Our ODI team is too jaded and lacks X factor to win the ODI WC

[vvvslaxman]

 

[Ultimate_Game]

4 hours ago, putrevus said:

If ace bowler and spinners did not lay eggs instead of winning matches then India would have won in 2023 and also who knows maybe in 2019 too.

 

Aussie bowlers delivered for them in finals. Head flayed our bozo bowlers like no tomorrow.

 

Batting will be just fine in world cup , bowlers have do do something.

 

 

Time our so called maharathis do something as well like our kids did in the recent WT20. Couldn't chase 230 odd in 2019 and could managed 240 on a patta in 2023 WC. I expect nothing different this time as well as it's the same batters, only 4 years older.

[Ultimate_Game]

35 minutes ago, jf1gp_1 said:

While I enjoyed watching Rohit in Indian colors and shut down match as soon as he was run out it was evident he is well past his due date. I just hope he announces retirement in few days and plays last game at home in this series.

 

Our batting stars have always been selfish and everyone had to be pushed out. They're not like Ashwin who failed once and bowed out. Batters continue to fail for ages but still expect to be picked without any shame.

[Ultimate_Game]

22 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

The pitches that pakistan got were benign pitches. Pakistan is the most notorious team against bouncers. They got bullied by Nahid Rana's bouncers at Mirpur. But they scored heavily in SA. Pitches were flat. IF anything they were very dry.  SA's home performance in the last  3 series against Asian teams

 

 

Pakistan 3-0

India 2-1

Bangladesh 2-1

 

This boogeyman story about SA pitches is not longer true. When they had guys like Steyn and others they dliberately offered spicy pitches. Look at Rohit's average in SA. It is an appalling 19.  But Sai Sudarshan has more fifties in 3 games than Rohit ins 14 mathches in SA. 

 

India also beat SA 5-1 in 2018. 

 

6 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

 

Sai, Sooryavanshi or Jaiswal should replace Rohit but we all know that's not gonna happen. The phat phuck will cost us the world cup along with other "experienced" players.

[tapandrun]

13 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

The pitches that pakistan got were benign pitches. Pakistan is the most notorious team against bouncers. They got bullied by Nahid Rana's bouncers at Mirpur. But they scored heavily in SA. Pitches were flat. IF anything they were very dry.  SA's home performance in the last  3 series against Asian teams

 

 

Pakistan 3-0

India 2-1

Bangladesh 2-1

 

This boogeyman story about SA pitches is not longer true. When they had guys like Steyn and others they dliberately offered spicy pitches. Look at Rohit's average in SA. It is an appalling 19.  But Sai Sudarshan has more fifties in 3 games than Rohit ins 14 mathches in SA. 

 

India also beat SA 5-1 in 2018. 

 

There is  huge diff between SA white-ball pitches and Red-ball pitches, its similar to Ind.

 

In SA avg 1st innings score is nearly 290 in last 3 yrs. They are good pitches for white-ball but its natural to have more bounce they are similar to how its in Ind spinner gets some assistance even in white-ball and cutter and slower-ones still works for pacers. There is natural pace and bounce and assistance to pace bowling in SA.

 

Sa has been fielding b/c even experimental sides in all these Odis series, they are trying to develop larger group Aus is following the same , they do not mind losing some games at home as long as they can qualify for wc and can field a top side in icc events.

 

In last 2/3 yrs they have found 2 v.good white-ball batters brestke and Zorzi, they seems to have endless pacers of top quality.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited June 14 by tapandrun

[vvvslaxman]

19 minutes ago, Ultimate_Game said:

 

Time our so called maharathis do something as well like our kids did in the recent WT20. Couldn't chase 230 odd in 2019 and could managed 240 on a patta in 2023 WC. I expect nothing different this time as well as it's the same batters, only 4 years older.

 

FLunked 2 semi finals, 1 final.  2015, 2019, 2023 are the mother of all flat pitch world cup era in combination with relaxed rules in favor of batsmen. This is the worst phase for bowlers. INdia still managed to  produce results no par with pre-2-ball era . This magic won't be available in 2027 world cup. We are going to get thrashed big time.

 

 

[vvvslaxman]

4 minutes ago, tapandrun said:

 

There is  huge diff between SA white-ball pitches and Red-ball pitches, its similar to Ind.

 

In SA avg 1st innings score is nearly 290 in last 3 yrs. They are not good pitches for white-ball but its natural to have more bounce there similar to how its Ind spinner gets some assistance even in white-ball and cutter and slower-ones still works for pacers. There is natural pace and bounce and assistance to pace bowling in SA.

 

Sa has been fielding b/c even experimental sides in all these Odis series, they are trying to develop larger group Aus is following the same , they do not mind losing some games at home as long as they can qualify for wc and can field a top side in icc events.

 

In last 2/3 yrs they have found 2 v.good white-ball batters brestke and Zorzi, they seems to have endless pacers of top quality.

 

 

 

 

 

 

SA can field whatever side but bounce is still not really a threat. Sanju himself is not an uber confident player against bouncer. He did well both in ODis and T20Is.  It will be batsmen friendly unless there is rain , overhead conditions. It is not like our elite "ODI legends" were good in those conditions. Most teams will come with FTBs. 

 

Here Bangladesh has mowed down SA at centurion by 9 wickets. Taskin bagged 5 wickets. 

https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/bangladesh-in-south-africa-2021-22-1277070/south-africa-vs-bangladesh-3rd-odi-1277099/full-scorecard

 

This is a full strength SA side Ngidi, Rabada, Jansen, Maharaja against BD who racked up 300 and bowled SA out for 270 odd

https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/bangladesh-in-south-africa-2021-22-1277070/south-africa-vs-bangladesh-1st-odi-1277097/full-scorecard

 

My point is not about SA's performance here. My point is we have this assumpation SA means we will get bullied. It is not the case. If anyting ODI pitches there will be easier than Indian pitches. Ball will come on nicely. Most Indians prefer such pitches rather than sticky pitches where ball holds.

[tapandrun]

19 minutes ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

SA can field whatever side but bounce is still not really a threat. Sanju himself is not an uber confident player against bouncer. He did well both in ODis and T20Is.  It will be batsmen friendly unless there is rain , overhead conditions. It is not like our elite "ODI legends" were good in those conditions. Most teams will come with FTBs. 

 

Here Bangladesh has mowed down SA at centurion by 9 wickets. Taskin bagged 5 wickets. 

https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/bangladesh-in-south-africa-2021-22-1277070/south-africa-vs-bangladesh-3rd-odi-1277099/full-scorecard

 

This is a full strength SA side Ngidi, Rabada, Jansen, Maharaja against BD who racked up 300 and bowled SA out for 270 odd

https://www.espncricinfo.com/series/bangladesh-in-south-africa-2021-22-1277070/south-africa-vs-bangladesh-1st-odi-1277097/full-scorecard

 

My point is not about SA's performance here. My point is we have this assumpation SA means we will get bullied. It is not the case. If anyting ODI pitches there will be easier than Indian pitches. Ball will come on nicely. Most Indians prefer such pitches rather than sticky pitches where ball holds.

 

Didnt say that SA white-ball pitches are not easy to bat or score runs quickly, just said it has natural pace and bounce. Yes Ind batters may like it.

 

Pointed out the issue that Ind bating is mono-tone full of Rh batters, Ind relies on Iyer for impetus in mo , but he usually take down spinner, Can he do it vs pace.

Same for Pandaya he also like hitting spin, where are those quick 20-30 coming for Ind ???

 

Iyer has managed short balls better in Ind condition in recent times but he has nt fully ratified the issue, can he play the extra bounce ball after ball and still play with high tempo.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[cowboysfan]

3 hours ago, vvvslaxman said:

 

The pitches that pakistan got were benign pitches. Pakistan is the most notorious team against bouncers. They got bullied by Nahid Rana's bouncers at Mirpur. But they scored heavily in SA. Pitches were flat. IF anything they were very dry.  SA's home performance in the last  3 series against Asian teams

 

 

Pakistan 3-0

India 2-1

Bangladesh 2-1

 

This boogeyman story about SA pitches is not longer true. When they had guys like Steyn and others they dliberately offered spicy pitches. Look at Rohit's average in SA. It is an appalling 19.  But Sai Sudarshan has more fifties in 3 games than Rohit ins 14 mathches in SA. 

 

India also beat SA 5-1 in 2018. 

I agree.Even Varun was unplayable  on SA pitches since they offered grip and change of pace was working for fast bowlers too but it will interesting to see how they behave in a ICC tournament.

[tweaker]

13 hours ago, Ultimate_Game said:

I'm sorry but this ODI team is way too jaded to win the ODI WC.

Against Afghanistan also,selectors don't want to risk and play young players.

 

Rahul, Prasidh, Sundar should have been rested for this series.

 

They have been part of every series and just have played IPL.

[tweaker]

The success of young player ie Suthar, Harsh, Gurnoor should make the selectors back some other young players especially Jaiswal should get some odi games.

[deathmonger]

12 hours ago, Norman said:

Root of the problem is Rohit Sharma at the top who refuses to quit for his selfish interests of leaving behind a "legacy". He desperately wants to join Dhoni and Kohli in the list of Indian players who have won all ICC LOI titles. 

 

Replace him with Jaiswal at the top and half our problems are already solved. I would love to see Tilak Varma in the ODI middle order at no.5 and start bowling more. We can't afford to play Jadeja yet again just for the 6th bowling option. 

Sehwag, Yuvi and Bhajji too

[Nikhil_cric]

12 hours ago, BacktoCricaddict said:

If only they can get Jaiswal and Vaibhav in, and give them enough time to hone their ODI game, it would go a long way towards rectifying things.

 

Tangentially, TBH, I think VK still has something to give in ODIs. RG is done. 

Kohli is fine if the conditions were in low bounce conditions like Asia.  And that's assuming his reflexes hold for another 1.5 years

 

Even then, he scored ducks in Perth and Adelaide when there was significant bounce in the wicket. And scored on a flatter Sydney pitch.  

 

His game on pitches with bounce has become pretty average since the turn of the decade. 

 

 

 

[Adamant]

Did not read the OP, but I am quite sure that its another rant on how Kohli should be dropped.

[Adamant]

 

 

L

13 hours ago, Ultimate_Game said:

 

They've been the same issues since the last 3 WCs - the top 3 which crumbles in a must win and no hitting power down the order except for Pandya. We have the time to experiment or at the very least upgrade our top order and yet here we are. The only so called "upgrade" is replacing Jadeja with Sundar, which is a huge step down from when Axar was in the team. We haven't improved even in one area. In fact our batting is older and weaker, and even our bowling has regressed due to no Shami.

Here we go again. The same *ing lie.

 

Are you not tired of this propaganda?

 

Last CT

 

semis Motm Kohli

Finals motm Rohit

 

Last WC 

semis highest scorer Kohli

finals highest scorer Kohli

 

Please stop with this BS.

 

Explain what Pandya has done in World cup and Champions trophy? I challenge you to list down his achievements in Odi trophies.

[Adamant]

29 minutes ago, Nikhil_cric said:

Kohli is fine if the conditions were in low bounce conditions like Asia.  And that's assuming his reflexes hold for another 1.5 years

 

Even then, he scored ducks in Perth and Adelaide when there was significant bounce in the wicket. And scored on a flatter Sydney pitch.  

 

His game on pitches with bounce has become pretty average since the turn of the decade. 

 

 

 

And what do you make of Sarpanch Sahab in bouncy conditions?

 

Let me tell you, if the conditions are actually bouncy, Iyer would **** his pants. 
 

Pandya himself won’t be able to connect anything like how he was unable to score off Rauf in MCG.
 

So there is more to worry about our so called MVPs then Kohli.

 

[Adamant]

Sarpanch Sahab scored 70 runs at str rate of 71 last time India visited Aus.

 

He is at his peak and these are the kind of numbers he is producing. 
 

Its so sad that Indian teams future is in hands of players who are so technically deficient that even at their peak they can’t play on a pitch with true bounce, also I am not even talking about uneven bounce, thats far away from his aukaad, just talking about true bounce pitches.

[Adamant]

13 hours ago, Nikhil_cric said:

No quality batting allrounder at #6 and geriatric Top 3 batsmen who will likely fail against bounce in South Africa at 40 and 39 years of age.

 

Those are the only issues.  But I don't expect Indian cricket to either acknowledge that or try to correct it. 

If the pitches are bouncy, watch out for our number 4. I fear that he will be scarred for life.

[Adamant]

5 hours ago, Ultimate_Game said:

 

Time our so called maharathis do something as well like our kids did in the recent WT20. Couldn't chase 230 odd in 2019 and could managed 240 on a patta in 2023 WC. I expect nothing different this time as well as it's the same batters, only 4 years older.

The maharathis won a t20 WC before the kids could debut for India.

 

The maharathis also won CT in 25 without ace bowler.

[Adamant]

5 hours ago, Ultimate_Game said:

 

Our batting stars have always been selfish and everyone had to be pushed out. They're not like Ashwin who failed once and bowed out. Batters continue to fail for ages but still expect to be picked without any shame.

Yeah right, Ashwin failed only once.

 

His SENA numbers are beyond amazing.