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Real McCoy Proficient

Real McCoy

Posted
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38 minutes ago, Straight Drive said:

I buy gold coins sometimes as birthday gifts for my family members and naming ceremony or first birthday of relatives kids as birthday gifts or for own investment. I have never bought the bar though. Never bought a gold bar though. No headache whether somoen will like it or not. Sureshot like and if they keep for 5 years they will like more seeing the amount it becomes. Best and easy choice of gift.

 

The point you mentioned regarding value deduction does exists in one case: Suppose you have got made gold ring or necklace or other jewellery from a goldshop named "ABC". Then after 10 years you decide to sell it or make a new jewellery out of it by adding more grams of gold to it. You visit another goldshop named "DEF". Then the shopkeeper "DEF" may (usually they will) deduct value as the jewellery was initially not made by him. It is not beneficial. The goldsmiths have a mark on gold jewellery which they use to identify whether they have made it or someone else has made it. If its made by others then he will deduct a good amount. If he himself has made it then there is no deduction. This is also the reason why it is advised to keep purchase invoive handy in case the goldsmith says he hasn't made the jewellery. It will be a proof for you. Generally a renowned and reputed goldsmith will not play such games to deduct money.

 

Although i have never sold gold coins, imo coin value remains same irresptive of gold shop you go to sell at and irrespective where you purchased it from. As long as its pure and as per carat, the value is intact.

 

Banks do not take back gold coins. They just sell certified gold.

 

The samller units are preferred as compared to gold bullion or bar because the value is more, so can make a difference when you go overseas due to taxation, limit, value one can carry across borders. Also the risk for purchaser is big because its a big amount and there can be some impurity. The buyers also generally will not buy gold of so much value from shopkeeper. Coins for gifts or investments, gold for ring and necklace are the most common purchases since long back. So the bars are not common and preferred.

Generally find one gold shop keeper who is doing business since 50+ years atleast in your city. Those are more trusted ones. Aged people can tell you about those shops which can be trusted more due to experince in buysing gold for a longer period of time.

So you're saying you buy gold coins from reputable gold shop in your city. Is that better than buying from govt outlets like MMTC or private collaboration from MMTC-PAMP. MMTC offers the first Indian gold coin which has Gandhi on one side and chakra on the other with BIS(Bureau of Indian Standards) logo stamped on it.

Do you look for any such stampings on the coin or any assaying certification/sealed package if you're buying from gold shops in your neighborhood. Its usually helpful to consult the elderly people. They are more wise to it and will do so. Thanks for the excellent idea :nice:

What do you say about certain reports that say that jeweler may give you less money while selling it. Is that rumor mongering and scare tactics. Its also interesting that MMTC-PAMP sells their gold for 6,300 per gram but only buys the same amount for 4,900. Why so much discrepancy. Is there something I'm missing. My brother says its to discourage people from selling it immediately. Do you agree.

Is there any appreciable difference between 999 gold and 999.9 gold. They are both 24 carat I reckon. So whats the difference and is it worth looking into. Sorry I have too many questions once I started on the gold investment. The more sites I look into, the more questions I get :((

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Straight Drive Newbie

Straight Drive

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Real McCoy said:

So you're saying you buy gold coins from reputable gold shop in your city. Is that better than buying from govt outlets like MMTC or private collaboration from MMTC-PAMP. MMTC offers the first Indian gold coin which has Gandhi on one side and chakra on the other with BIS(Bureau of Indian Standards) logo stamped on it.

Do you look for any such stampings on the coin or any assaying certification/sealed package if you're buying from gold shops in your neighborhood. Its usually helpful to consult the elderly people. They are more wise to it and will do so. Thanks for the excellent idea :nice:

What do you say about certain reports that say that jeweler may give you less money while selling it. Is that rumor mongering and scare tactics. Its also interesting that MMTC-PAMP sells their gold for 6,300 per gram but only buys the same amount for 4,900. Why so much discrepancy. Is there something I'm missing. My brother says its to discourage people from selling it immediately. Do you agree.

Is there any appreciable difference between 999 gold and 999.9 gold. They are both 24 carat I reckon. So whats the difference and is it worth looking into. Sorry I have too many questions once I started on the gold investment. The more sites I look into, the more questions I get :((

Yes, the hallmark of BIS is there. There is lot of fraud in gold. Some shopkeepers sell gold which is actually not the soft metal but total alloy. At times out of 2 grams of gold sold may not even have any gold at all. Hence the need to go to reputed and trusted gold shop. There was a case two years back where some new gold seller with multiple chain of shops getting fake hallmarks. Be very cautious because knowledge of gold metal is very limited as only few buy gold periodically and hence new gold shoppers are likely to get cheated by selling lot of alloy proportion within gold. Hallmark is implemented just for avoiding the novice purchasers and even regular gold purchasers being cheated . Stick to hallmark.  Avoid the shop which will try to lure into purchasing non hallmark gold at lesser value citing some or other reason. Small shopkeepers do that kind of cheating. You may end up buying 90% alloy mixed with actual metal.

 

Gold price should not be deducted while selling, unless the part of ornament say one of the link in necklace is broken or part of coin is chipped or damaged. No buyer will ever tamper gold obviously and gold won't just deteriorate by itself to cause physical damage in normal stores condition.  Gold does not loses its value. Gold has to be 100% pure if it is 24karat as it should not contain any part of alloy. If it is 22karat then it has to be sold at current rate of 22karat. The alloy portion is priced in already karat wise.

 

I cannot comment in MMTC PAMP but I will always prefer the well known two chains of gold shops. Otherwise next option is Tanishq. A Tata product, very reliable. 

Edited by Straight Drive
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Straight Drive Newbie

Straight Drive

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Even there is fraud in wood which is  cheap still saw dust is used as filler to increase profits . With the prices of gold sky rocketing one needs to be very very cautious before buying even 1gram of gold. There could be rise in fraud to increase as gold metal prices increases in future.  RBI SGB helps avoid all these risks totally. You get the price without any deductions while you sell. 2.5% interest. No storage costs and risks. Two years back the bank charged me 10000 Rs. to provide gold storage facility in locker. Storing gold at home is very risky as it invites lot of trouble. No deductions like in Gold ETF.  RBI SGB solves all problems. imo it is best for investment in gold if one is not interested in gold as consumption product.

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Real McCoy Proficient

Real McCoy

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31 minutes ago, Straight Drive said:

Even there is fraud in wood which is  cheap still saw dust is used as filler to increase profits . With the prices of gold sky rocketing one needs to be very very cautious before buying even 1gram of gold. There could be rise in fraud to increase as gold metal prices increases in future.  RBI SGB helps avoid all these risks totally. You get the price without any deductions while you sell. 2.5% interest. No storage costs and risks. Two years back the bank charged me 10000 Rs. to provide gold storage facility in locker. Storing gold at home is very risky as it invites lot of trouble. No deductions like in Gold ETF.  RBI SGB solves all problems. imo it is best for investment in gold if one is not interested in gold as consumption product.

That is what I've been telling my brother. He insists on having gold thats his choice but not really mine. He is planning to have jewels for his children. Mine is only oriented towards investment not on having bling bling to show off. I guess I will stikc to SGB or maybe buy more SGB in the future. This whole physical gold and selling process seems to be a turnoff for me and as you said there will be more corruption once the price hits an upward curve

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jusarrived Collaborator

jusarrived

Posted
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10 hours ago, Straight Drive said:

Nifty at 11242.30 now. Out of the 148 points rise today, the majority percentile boost was due to the policy. Some profit  booking likely to happen. Hope it breaks 11300 resistance.

Need banks to have a few good day’s . 

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Straight Drive Newbie

Straight Drive

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34 minutes ago, Real McCoy said:

@Straight Drive Gold has been going up and down this week. They have been saying this is a record high and record drop whatever. What's your take on it. Is it normal?

Gold price was very volatile yesterday. It went down but it recovered quite well. It was very volatile on Wednesday. Profit booking is happening. Investors are booking profit. It will bounce back again imo and I feel 70K will be target after up and down journey.

 

This is normal and correction happens. In fact a good chance to add more gold when prices correct significantly like it did yesterday.

 

I feel gold will keep rising for another 2 years minimum. Historically when gold gains momentum it stays  for 3 to 4 years atleast. We are  into second year only of the rise. During such journey of new highs, there will be temporary setbacks like we saw now but it will recover and then move up again.

 

(1)Coronavirus vaccine is not yet proved even though Russia is claiming some cure. The count of coronavirus infections is rising everyday in infected as well as death count. So the fear of infection will lead to isolated knockdowns and have prolonged negative impact on business.

 

(2)OPEC and OPEC + nations have already reported that the normal demand of oil will take another few quarters. In fact Saudi Aramco reported a massive downfall when they released their quarterly results yesterday. Aramco have mentioned that they will improve the production capacity but that does not means they will improve production soon. The US has reached full inventories of Oil and there is no offtake. It is still surplus and hence the low price per barrel. Therefore I think all this situation means a economic normalcy is still far away.

 

(3) UK released unemployment data this week which wasnt good at all.

 

(4) Investors will take position's in gold relatively more during the uncertain times rather than the equity market. Gold is preferred safe haven during such scenarios. Generally when stocks markets collapse gold will do very good.

 

Coming back to Indian factors

(1) Indian wedding season in first quarter have been postponed which will add in to more weddings during year end.

 

(2) Longest Indian festive season is also coming soon in few months.

 

(3) I have seen less than 10 Indian companies posting increased returns for Q1 FY 2020-2021. Ofcourse there may be more as I could not track all results. But the percentage is dampening for sure for obvious reasons. More investor money (allocation of investment) will thus flow into gold rather than the volatile equity market.

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Straight Drive Newbie

Straight Drive

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On 8/6/2020 at 10:11 PM, Real McCoy said:

That is what I've been telling my brother. He insists on having gold thats his choice but not really mine. He is planning to have jewels for his children. Mine is only oriented towards investment not on having bling bling to show off. I guess I will stikc to SGB or maybe buy more SGB in the future. This whole physical gold and selling process seems to be a turnoff for me and as you said there will be more corruption once the price hits an upward curve

Physical gold too holds a value, which may not be seen in other countries apart from India. Like in Hindu culture gold is considered very pure. Hence we see the ears of new born being pierced and gold ring is attached. In some Indian families you will also see a mixture of gold being given with some ghee and other liquid to new borna for few days. Gold being considered as pure people will feel better to wear the gold touching the body because of purity aspect. Not sure about the current generation but it definitely is symbol of purity in Indian history. The purity aspect also is a reason why when worshiping deities gold is preferred to be placed . Then gold being shiny and color being pleasing, people will feel it attractive. Physical gold is also considered as a pure gift.  It serves both the investment purpose as well as purity aspect and goodliness that Indian people try to relate with gold. Maybe your brother is also one of those who believes in some of the ancestors tradition or the purity aspect of gold.

 

But if only investment is the objective, then RBI SGB is better.

 

But I have usually invested in physical gold before and may purchase adding coins whenever the prices drop. RBI SGB may not be there as investment option on a specific time period when you want to allocate funds to gold or exactly during the time gold prices enter correction phase.

Edited by Straight Drive
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Straight Drive Newbie

Straight Drive

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Posted (edited)
52 minutes ago, diga said:

Any investment stocks for 1-2 year horizon?

Reliance, HDFC Bank,HDFC,TCS, Infosys.

 

Reliance due to huge many deals last quarter, approx 25.5 K crore deal with Future Retail on Saturday, Netmeds,  buyout (e pharmacy) ,  Hamleys toys expansion (UK toy brand) looks the best bet to me. Saudi Aramco deal is also likely this year. Jio Mart has advantage of Jio Platforms for cross selling services and products across its various verticals. Due to cash generated by stake sell in Jio Platforms to MNC's, they will be net debt free by 2021. Thus they have made acquisitions which will help them to be productive with brownfield acquisitions rather than the time consuming Greenfield developments they are avoiding for now. In future we can see Reliance do further acquisitions, and be present across more business verticals. Also important aspect imo is Reliance is a disruptor of markets. Who would have thought few years back that  Vodafone and Idea (now Vodafone Idea post merger)  and Bharti Airtel would be in such precarious position. It has entered and within 5 years made the toppers turn into losers. The management is just not sitting with idle cash flow, however it is interested in making money work by deploying it into various businesses. Personally, I have liked the way how RIL management have managed and run the show. So, I am liking it more nowadays.

 

If COVID continues in absence of vaccine, then IT stock will continue to be bullish. TCS will be safe bet but Infosys under Salil Parekh have managed to bring big deals, which was one concern when the management change happened. I like both TCS as well as Infosys. Two well managed companies. TCS at attrition rate of 11 percent has advantage in that aspect considering attrition rate of 18 percent of Infosys which has decline appreciably from 21 percent attrition they had 2 years back. But Infy had a better quarter recently in some aspects than TCS.

 

In financials HDFC bank has increased CASA ratio last quarter. It is the best in private banking space.

 

HDFC Ltd.  is another stock available stock which is tempting at CMP 1830. With government reducing stamp duty from 5   percent to 2 percent till Dec and then it will be 3percent in calendar year 2021. It augurs well. Also the NPA account of Jet Airways has Seena a recovery. I think they recovered 360 crore out of their 410 crore loan book to Jet Airways. Also they may have made provisions for that in last quarterly results. The recovery of NPA is better by HDFC Ltd than other banks.

 

For the time horizon you have mentioned, it's tricky because it is COVID period without a vaccine. Investing is tricky. IT and Pharma will outperform if the current scenario prevails. But I do not like pharma at all because of various factors.

 

 

Edited by Straight Drive
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velu Mentor

velu

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@Straight Drive   your concern is addressed by SEBI

 

SEBI chairman Ajay Tyagi is quite a badass  .. :hail: 

so many reforms done by him in a very short term ..

 

i will be affected because of his strict rule to curb intraday leverage ( easy money is gone ) , but his reforms and new margin benefit rules will really benefit traders like me :icflove: 

 

 

https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/business/markets/sebi-says-no-more-extension-of-deadline-new-pledge-and-re-pledge-system-to-come-into-effect-tomorrow-5779191.html

 

 

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Straight Drive Newbie

Straight Drive

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, velu said:

@Straight Drive   your concern is addressed by SEBI

 

SEBI chairman Ajay Tyagi is quite a badass  .. :hail: 

so many reforms done by him in a very short term ..

 

i will be affected because of his strict rule to curb intraday leverage ( easy money is gone ) , but his reforms and new margin benefit rules will really benefit traders like me :icflove: 

 

 

https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/business/markets/sebi-says-no-more-extension-of-deadline-new-pledge-and-re-pledge-system-to-come-into-effect-tomorrow-5779191.html

 

 

Finally after three postponement? or was it  two ? SEBI decided to implement rule  from SEP 1. CNBC flashed and commented on it.

 

I have not gone through in details though. It will matter less to long term investors imo and will be beneficial to market stability and less specualtion imo.


I think taking paying margin upfront will help keep only serious traders and investors in market? Is this understanding correct, Velu ?

 

The explanation regarding to pledging part given in thw link is confusing me.

 

Zerodha I guess has enabled PIN for selling stocks. The PIN is provided by depository. Which means that the pledging issue before is sorted. But I don't think other brokers have enabled the PIN based concept for selling stocks.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Straight Drive
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