India lost even before the war started

[Dhondy]

Re: India lost even before the war started This is just a litany of excuses, to be honest. The buck stops with the players. Greg may be useless, and may well need to go, but he is not the villain of the piece, as is being made out in this article. Just a bunch of losers trying to deflect the blame on to the likeliest scapegoat because he is a foreigner. The author is not from Dubai by any chance, is she?

[Chandan]

Re: India lost even before the war started

I think Chappell and Dravid shld stay; Ganguly and SRT should go and let Chappell and Dravid control team selection etc and give them 2 yrs to help develop the next layer of talent + fix egos of Sehwag and Yuvraj

No way. All these fellows should leave. I can agree to have Dravid for one more year just to guide the youngsters, but never as captain. Rest of them HAVE to leave the scene of ODI and Chappell the scene of Indian cricket. I don't believe in what has been stated by the IE columnist. Still I want these results.

[Bumper]

Re: India lost even before the war started

The author is not from Dubai by any chance' date=' is she?[/quote'] :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

[DesiChap]

Re: India lost even before the war started Cut and Paste from Panicker's blog -------------------------------- Naming names "There are five players in the team whose attitude needs to be sorted out," the official stressed. When asked to name the players, he suggested names like Sachin Tendulkar, Sourav Ganguly, Zaheer Khan, Harbhajan Singh and Ajit Agarkar. He further added the need to rope in more youngsters under skipper Rahul Dravid. "There is nothing wrong with the team as such, but we are convinced that it is the attitude of the players that affected the performance. When we meet on April 6, we will go into all the factors in a detailed manner that contributed to our poor show," the official promised. He also suspected groupism had a huge impact on the field. "They didn't gel well and also didn't play as a team. There were a few who even played for themselves and didn't have much respect for some of the other members of the squad." What is most surprising about the above clip, from this story, that I read over my morning coffee? For me, simply this: it is the first time, at least that I know of, that someone -- even an anonymous someone -- has been prepared to name Sachin Tendulkar in this context. Been making calls ever since, and as with so much to do with Indian cricket, what you hear depends on who you speak to, and no two versions are even remotely alike. Yet, one story gets repeated, by several unrelated quarters -- and my best guess, since I know the people from whom this came, is there is a big chunk of truth in it. It was before the game in Bermuda. The Indians were in the nets, and Sourav Ganguly was batting. He asked the bowlers -- Zaheer, Agarkar and Sreesanth -- to pitch the ball up and cut out the bouncers (whether it is because he doesn't like being bounced, or he wanted to practice his driving, depends on who was telling the story -- I heard both, and am inclined to leave the 'why' alone). At some point, as Sree was walking back to the top of his mark, Zaheer and Agarkar asked him to bounce. Sree ran in and bowled the full length; on his follow through, he went up to the batsman and asked if he wanted him to bowl bouncers. No, Ganguly told him with some, um, vehemence. Sorry, said Sree, I asked because they told me you wanted me to. Ganguly then chewed out the other two bowlers who, pissed that Sree had fingered them, later gave him a substantial -- and on this family forum, unmentionable -- earful. If it had ended there, it would have been one of those things. But next day, when the Indians played Bermuda, Sree was deputed to the boundary line at one end, to provide drinks and towels to the bowler at the end of each over. At the end of the first over, Zaheer wandered over to the third man boundary, Sree greeted him with drinks, and Zaheer pushed him away with a 'F*&# off, I don't need anything from you you *&#*)@(...' A shocked and upset Sreesanth retreated to the dressing room and, for a while, was inconsolable. The other stories I heard, I'll avoid -- all of them are from one or another source, and I have no independent confirmation of any of them. One thing for sure: the report of manager Sanjay Jagdale, who is also a selector, should make for very interesting reading -- the question is, will it get the same treatment all managers' reports in the past have? http://sightscreen.rediffiland.com//scripts/xanadu_diary_view.php?postId=1175452369

[shailesh]

Re: India lost even before the war started conclusion - Sree is a ch***ya :hic:

[Rahul]

Re: India lost even before the war started ^^thats a really sorry thing to say on such an informative web site, my fellow fan. there were lots of issues with the team and management even before the SL tour. Jagdale, hopefully, will be honest enough to bring it to light. fact is, the players never pulled as a team and TRULY BELIEVED in dravid. SCG worked around this typical prob with the seniors by pulling rank and holding a scepter above them. it was his pure good luck that the folks he used to play tit-for-tat with the seniors performed for a short period. in many respects, he is the luckiest captain ever. never performed as a bat, while inheriting a team of seniors that was itching to put the match-fixing scandal behind them and performed well. IMHO, what happened was a very performance-oriented coach was installed at a time when these so-called seniors (who, ideally, should have been grooming the youngsters and creating the next team) were beginning to get into a comfort zone and when called out, reacted like sulking KG schoolboys. the fall was inevitable. i hope sanity prevails, otherwise, this will gut me even more than when i reported the match-fixing... and eventually quit cricket reporting.

[Bumper]

Re: India lost even before the war started

^^thats a really sorry thing to say on such an informative web site, my fellow fan. there were lots of issues with the team and management even before the SL tour. Jagdale, hopefully, will be honest enough to bring it to light. fact is, the players never pulled as a team and TRULY BELIEVED in dravid. SCG worked around this typical prob with the seniors by pulling rank and holding a scepter above them. it was his pure good luck that the folks he used to play *****-for-tat with the seniors performed for a short period. in many respects, he is the luckiest captain ever. never performed as a bat, while inheriting a team of seniors that was itching to put the match-fixing scandal behind them and performed well. IMHO, what happened was a very performance-oriented coach was installed at a time when these so-called seniors (who, ideally, should have been grooming the youngsters and creating the next team) were beginning to get into a comfort zone and when called out, reacted like sulking KG schoolboys. the fall was inevitable. i hope sanity prevails, otherwise, this will gut me even more than when i reported the match-fixing... and eventually quit cricket reporting.

Fair enuff that the players themselves are to be blamed for this nonsense. But what do you make of the media obsessed Chappell ? He's quick to take credit when things go well & the first to indulge in blame games when things go wrong. Dravid sadly is the victim of all this nonsense. Why the hell did Chappell send his latest SMS to the media ?

[Rahul]

Re: India lost even before the war started ^^ very simple. greg comes from a first world culture where sports and media are intertwined. heck, do u remember jordan's issues with jackson with the bulls??? or, in more rcent timnes, iverson with larry brown?? no biggie. too bad greg had to deal with stupid, self-promoting prima donnas who started sulking the moment the coach made his thots clear on why he/they sucked. (tendy is prime example--he hasnt spoken to greg since greg said that he has serious doubts abt tendy's fitness in general, this was after his elbow crap. (events have proved greg right and tendy a sad sack). i still think Team Blue (if thats what Pawar wants to call them henceforth) lacks a true professional culture.

[Bumper]

Re: India lost even before the war started I was a fan of Greggy's coaching myself when he started (by laying his job on the line, to get rid of Ganguly, who was a non-performing political captain then). But one gets the feeling he's carried his mantra a bit too far, without an iota of concern for whether his Aussie ideas would fit our culture. He FAILED in the no. 1 attribute that a leader in the subcontinent must have. The ability to command the respect/trust of his team. He had issues with every single one of them (barring Dravid & the ones who made their debut in the last 2 years). Even if he has great coaching brains, there is no way he can work with our guys, given his relationship with everyone.

[Rahul]

Re: India lost even before the war started ^^ agree. but i also would postulate that this means bigger issues with the guys themselves, more than a coach. like ravi always says, end of the day, coach can only coach you, but yr attitude is basically inborn. if tendy sulked when the coach told media he is unfit, that becomes greg's fault??? i didnt get yr point, bumper, pls explain.

[Bumper]

Re: India lost even before the war started

^^ agree. but i also would postulate that this means bigger issues with the guys themselves, more than a coach. like ravi always says, end of the day, coach can only coach you, but yr attitude is basically inborn. if tendy sulked when the coach told media he is unfit, that becomes greg's fault??? i didnt get yr point, bumper, pls explain.

My point is simple. Greggy had issues with Sehwag, Ganguly, SRT, Zakky, Bhajji to list a few. Hey, its not about whether its Chappell's fault or the player's fault. These guys are our match winners. Unfortunately we are not as gifted as Australia to throw them out overnite & lineup another set of match winners. How do u inspire performaces from them, by getting on their wrong side ? This is where a bit of a cultural understanding from Greggy would have helped. He may have great cricketing brains, but has shown that he is poor at communication. Our guys need to be pampered, not challenged or threatened. Whether its right or wrong, thats the way it works in the subcontinent. Wasnt John Wright ever upset about Sehwag, Ganguly or Zakky ? But they still managed to pull together didnt they ? Thats where Chappell failed. In the 2+ years he's been our coach, he's generated more news than results. I never came across so much bad press about the team when Wright was incharge. PS: BTW, i dont condone Sachin "I am a team man" Tendulkar's behavior one bit. Oflate, he's neither cared for the team's futrure nor shown up when the team needs him.

[Rahul]

Re: India lost even before the war started ^^ not really. zaks physically assaulted wrighty. wrighty had even bigger probs with harby and gangs in latter yrs. just cos he wasnt prone to the SMS button doesnt change facts. like nicholson said in "A Few Good Men". whenever greg spoke, it was like "You can't handle the truth." greg didnt give a rat's ass abt reputations. he got a tabula rasa, and he tried doing what he wanted, got totally chodoed.

[kumble_rocks]

Re: India lost even before the war started

^^ very simple. greg comes from a first world culture where sports and media are intertwined. heck, do u remember jordan's issues with jackson with the bulls??? or, in more rcent timnes, iverson with larry brown?? no biggie.

Are you kidding me. Larry brown was forced out of philly because of his bad relation with Iverson. And in the case of Jordan , initially he refused to accept the triangle offense introduced by Jackson , but he still was the wheel. That's why he kept quiet. Otherwise Jackson would have been out of Chicago. But I see your point and it is a valid one. For example the same Jackson called Kobe "unprofessional" in his book after his first stint with Lakers and now he is working with him as his headcoach.

[Bumper]

Re: India lost even before the war started

^^ very simple. greg comes from a first world culture where sports and media are intertwined. heck, do u remember jordan's issues with jackson with the bulls??? or, in more rcent timnes, iverson with larry brown?? no biggie.

There is a MASSIVE difference between American sports & our cricket tho, esp in the sporting culture. Teams & staff are much more professional (in American sports) compared to our political/zonal/money minded BCCI. Cultural aspects aside, in the NBA, differences within the team, can be settled easily by trading troublesome players or by kicking them out & finding good enuff replacements, the following year, as long as appropriate money is shelled out. Scottie Pippen who was unhappy with the Rockets, became a Blazer, in the middle of the season. But we cant trade our SRT or Sehwag for a Ponting or a Gilly. We are stuck with these hi-maintenance, non-performers. Our only hope is to get the best out of them. So it only hurts the team, if the coach doesnt get along with his premier players

[Chandan]

Re: India lost even before the war started

^^thats a really sorry thing to say on such an informative web site, my fellow fan. there were lots of issues with the team and management even before the SL tour. Jagdale, hopefully, will be honest enough to bring it to light. fact is, the players never pulled as a team and TRULY BELIEVED in dravid. SCG worked around this typical prob with the seniors by pulling rank and holding a scepter above them. it was his pure good luck that the folks he used to play *****-for-tat with the seniors performed for a short period. in many respects, he is the luckiest captain ever. never performed as a bat, while inheriting a team of seniors that was itching to put the match-fixing scandal behind them and performed well. IMHO, what happened was a very performance-oriented coach was installed at a time when these so-called seniors (who, ideally, should have been grooming the youngsters and creating the next team) were beginning to get into a comfort zone and when called out, reacted like sulking KG schoolboys. the fall was inevitable. i hope sanity prevails, otherwise, this will gut me even more than when i reported the match-fixing... and eventually quit cricket reporting.

I completely agree with you here.

[chanakya]

Re: India lost even before the war started What i want to know is just this. We are all talking about greggy's aussie way and why it does not fit Indians. Did Greggy's Aussie way fit South Australia ?

[Chandan]

Re: India lost even before the war started

What i want to know is just this. We are all talking about greggy's aussie way and why it does not fit Indians. Did Greggy's Aussie way fit South Australia ?

No. In fact his tenure was a disaster for South Australia.

[Chandan]

Re: India lost even before the war started Do you know who has written this article? Ajay S Shankar. Link He has written many articles before too and they were pure non-sense!