Terrorism, Al-Qaida - recommended viewing

[Guest dada_rocks]

Foreing-nation nedorsement can make psec/communazi crowd ignore the gaffaes rest of the nationalist don't give two hoots about that.. IF somethign doesn;t make sense then it doesn't foreign nation commentarians can keep harping whatever they want..

[Grim Reaper]

LOL. Talk about typical American brainwashing or America-worshipping ( common phenomena in India these days). US - the good guys.LOL

Typical Islamic extremist brainwashing. ~US - NOT good guys.~ <---LOL!

Likewise. Nomatter how much one belives that good and evil exist, it will never ever actually make it so.

No matter how much you believe you are actually making valid points, it will never make it so.

Which is why i am inviting you to debate me on this and you keep running away, eh ? Typical conservative git you turn out to be really- all talk and no cigar.

I'm not running away, I've said everything I have to long before, you choose to ignore it and interpret it in your own idiotic way. It's not my fault if you fail to understand, I couldn't care less. Typical Islamic extremist, 'lets bomb ourselves up!' and no 72 virgins when you are done. ~~~ Now for those arguing about the US supporting Pakistan. Yes I agree that this shouldn't be so, but it is not all because of the US alone. Go back in history and see why it is how it is, India could've sided with the US during the Cold War but they decided to be neutral and then eventually made ties with the USSR, which collapsed. Now we know that it was a wrong decision as becoming an ally of the US would have altered how things eventually turned out to be in India's interest. As for all the support that Pakistan is getting now, it hardly will change anything. The US knows that India is the future and that the big picture lies with them. All those F-16's are chew toys for Indian SU-30MKI's. The US has supported Pakistan WITHOUT giving them the edge over India. If the US wanted they could easily change the military balance of power in South Asia but that isn't what they want to do. Time is changing and relations will too.

[maggot_brain]

Lurker: Yes religious extremism is a world wide phenomenon unfortunately. It's not just Islamic, but Hindutva, Christian nutters in America, Jews in Israel et al. Deeply disturbing. Grim Reaper: Your attitude smacks of a black-and-white mentality towards an amorphous concept, that of good and evil. It's no surprise though, a lot of this is due to the search for certainty in an uncertain world. If you can label something in terms that are concrete it is comforting. GWB's 'if you're not with us..' statement is in the same vein. This is a simplistic world view and one that is certainly not shared in Europe outside the right-wing. As an American I would presume you have to ask yourself, 'why do a signficant proportion of the world's inhabitants hate us?'. One newspaper here (the UK) ran a headline when GWB won a second term along the lines of, 'how can 100 million people be wrong?'. The US has historically not supported 'freedom' and 'democracy' and has engaged in several shameful episodes. Particularly with respect to Latin America. There are numerous documented examples of this. Ask yourself why the Patriot Act exists. Why the US Govt. carried out illegal wiretapping. Why evidence extracted under torture and 'special rendition' is being used in the 'War on Terror'. If you'd watched the documentary that the OP is about you would see how messrs Rumfeld and co. used the same propaganda to refer to Al-Qaida as they did the to Soviet Union in 1970s and 80s. Some of Rumsfeld's speeches could almost be copied word for word from the 70s with the term Soviet Union replaced with Al-Qaida. My only request to you is, watch the documentary and then make your mind up, and try to move away from simplistic modes of thought.

[Grim Reaper]

Grim Reaper: Your attitude smacks of a black-and-white mentality towards an amorphous concept, that of good and evil. It's no surprise though, a lot of this is due to the search for certainty in an uncertain world. If you can label something in terms that are concrete it is comforting. GWB's 'if you're not with us..' statement is in the same vein. This is a simplistic world view and one that is certainly not shared in Europe outside the right-wing. As an American I would presume you have to ask yourself, 'why do a signficant proportion of the world's inhabitants hate us?'. One newspaper here (the UK) ran a headline when GWB won a second term along the lines of, 'how can 100 million people be wrong?' The US has historically not supported 'freedom' and 'democracy' and has engaged in several shameful episodes. Particularly with respect to Latin America. There are numerous documented examples of this. Ask yourself why the Patriot Act exists. Why the US Govt. carried out illegal wiretapping. Why evidence extracted under torture and 'special rendition' is being used in the 'War on Terror'. If you'd watched the documentary that the OP is about you would see how messrs Rumfeld and co. used the same propaganda to refer to Al-Qaida as they did the to Soviet Union in 1970s and 80s. Some of Rumsfeld's speeches could almost be copied word for word from the 70s with the term Soviet Union replaced with Al-Qaida. My only request to you is, watch the documentary and then make your mind up, and try to move away from simplistic modes of thought.

Bossbhai has pretty much delivered the most clearest of answers to you. Though if you really believe in what you are saying, I will go even deeper against it. The Black and White mentality is also exposed by yourself with your own comments. Bush put it very clear for the world to understand, "You are either with us or against us." That statement is taken as flawed logic by many, yet it is a very simple and correct solution to the complicated world many believe that they are in. Terrorism is a very serious problem that is plaguing the world, it is like a virus, infecting and slowly killing off what it wishes to. We are in the early stages now but as time goes on, you will see how it will evolve and cause much more problems. The time is coming and my generation will witness it, I doubt even another Crusade may be able to stop it. Now when a man emerges, a man who is willing to risk so much, darken his name by people like yourself, thrust a massive amount of money and lives into a war, all for the sake of trying to stop the very thing I described. That man is none other than Bush, a great leader in my view because he didn't care about being the time wasting politician that is seen in countries around the world. He doesn't care about what his name will be associated with in history. He most of all didn't care about what the majority thought, he did what he thought was right for the better of his supporters and yes, even all the ungrateful anti-Americans/Liberals/Nazis/Communists/Islamic Maniacs etc... out there as well. He decided to take his time in office to fight what he viewed, I view and what many truly intellectual people view as the biggest threat to world peace, Islamic Terrorism. What politician in their right mind would do such a thing one would ask? The answer is simple, a politician who actually wanted to make a real change in the world for the better. A large portion of the world's population doesn't like him and frankly, I don't care and neither does Bush as he continues to do what is right. If a large part of the world's population hates the man for his efforts, they truly have no idea about what Islamic terrorism has brought, what it is currently bringing and what it is going to bring in the near future. The US stands for freedom and democracy, hence the reason Bush has chosen to fight such a war despite the heavy costs. As to your claims about Latin America and the actions of the US itself concerning the issues your raised, point out what causes you to believe what you believe and I will also clarify that with you. Your comparison with Al-Qaeda and the Soviet Union regarding speeches is also not strong. I can perfectly see why they can be interchanged and I believe that it's not wrong neither, they may seem different, yet they are very similar. Though what people choose to believe is not under my control. I can repeat the same thing over and over in different forms but people like yourself and CC will never get it. Perhaps evil can truly never be defeated then, as such supporters of it will always be there to oppose the one force that dares to challenge it.

[maggot_brain]

Bossbhai has pretty much delivered the most clearest of answers to you. Though if you really believe in what you are saying, I will go even deeper against it. The Black and White mentality is also exposed by yourself with your own comments. Bush put it very clear for the world to understand, "You are either with us or against us." That statement is taken as flawed logic by many, yet it is a very simple and correct solution to the complicated world many believe that they are in. Terrorism is a very serious problem that is plaguing the world, it is like a virus, infecting and slowly killing off what it wishes to. We are in the early stages now but as time goes on, you will see how it will evolve and cause much more problems. The time is coming and my generation will witness it, I doubt even another Crusade may be able to stop it. Now when a man emerges, a man who is willing to risk so much, darken his name by people like yourself, thrust a massive amount of money and lives into a war, all for the sake of trying to stop the very thing I described. That man is none other than Bush, a great leader in my view because he didn't care about being the time wasting politician that is seen in countries around the world. He doesn't care about what his name will be associated with in history. He most of all didn't care about what the majority thought, he did what he thought was right for the better of his supporters and yes, even all the ungrateful anti-Americans/Liberals/Nazis/Communists/Islamic Maniacs etc... out there as well. He decided to take his time in office to fight what he viewed, I view and what many truly intellectual people view as the biggest threat to world peace, Islamic Terrorism. What politician in their right mind would do such a thing one would ask? The answer is simple, a politician who actually wanted to make a real change in the world for the better. A large portion of the world's population doesn't like him and frankly, I don't care and neither does Bush as he continues to do what is right. If a large part of the world's population hates the man for his efforts, they truly have no idea about what Islamic terrorism has brought, what it is currently bringing and what it is going to bring in the near future. The US stands for freedom and democracy, hence the reason Bush has chosen to fight such a war despite the heavy costs. As to your claims about Latin America and the actions of the US itself concerning the issues your raised, point out what causes you to believe what you believe and I will also clarify that with you. Your comparison with Al-Qaeda and the Soviet Union regarding speeches is also not strong. I can perfectly see why they can be interchanged and I believe that it's not wrong neither, they may seem different, yet they are very similar. Though what people choose to believe is not under my control. I can repeat the same thing over and over in different forms but people like yourself and CC will never get it. Perhaps evil can truly never be defeated then, as such supporters of it will always be there to oppose the one force that dares to challenge it.

I can see that there is no point discussing this with you further, as you have a closed belief system and reacted in a manner which was entirely expected. I am confident though that posterity will prove you wrong in about 30 years when all the relevant government documents are declassified. By the way have you seen the documentary in question?

[maggot_brain]

I guess you and the neo-liberals will never get it untill your collective asses come under direct fire from the islamic radicals .... but then again there is a precedent of Indians never having managed to understand the gravity of it for lord knows how many centuries so yeah there is a possibility of that happening too ...

I'm not a neo-liberal, my politics are on the left, which raises the obvious question, do you know what neo-liberalism is?

[maggot_brain]

as I said ... none of the links on that site work ... and as me and Reaper pointed out ... this nonsense has been around since much before the US came into existence ... the characteristics and symptons of this disease remain exactly the same ...but no one has managed a Antidote yet. you have also accepted that this ideology is by no means a gentle one and that Faithfreedom has done a thorough research to unmask this ideology.

You're missing the point completely, it is not to act as an apologist for Islamic terrorism but to debunk the notion of its threat that has been played up by the neocons. Anyway I suggest you watch it before you pass judgement. There is a torrent link on one of my posts on the first page. You don't need to burn the image to a DVD you can download Daemon Tools and mount the image to watch it.

[maggot_brain]

Strange, Bossbhai the links are working for me, at this URL: http://www.archive.org/details/ThePowerOfNightmares You can download the MPEG4 links and watch them in VLC Media Player.

[yoda]

The entire US (minus some extreme right wingers) have accepted now that the Iraq war was a mistake. It is one of the worst policy decisions ever taken possibly by any country since probably our decision to accept partition. It has costed the US, $1 trillion. It has removed a major oil supplier from the pool. It has helped destroy the economy of a once semi-prosperous nation. It has become a new safe haven and breeding ground for terrorists. Has taken the focus away from the real terrorists hiding in the mountains of AFG and PAK.

[Grim Reaper]

You're missing the point completely' date=' it is not to act as an apologist for Islamic terrorism but to debunk the notion of its threat that has been played up by the neocons. Anyway I suggest you watch it before you pass judgement. There is a torrent link on one of my posts on the first page. You don't need to burn the image to a DVD you can download Daemon Tools and mount the image to watch it.[/quote']

I can see that there is no point discussing this with you further' date=' as you have a closed belief system and reacted in a manner which was entirely expected. I am confident though that posterity will prove you wrong in about 30 years when all the relevant government documents are declassified. By the way have you seen the documentary in question?[/quote'] You and CC are the ones that missed the point completely. If the NeoCons are being blamed for making the threat be known to the wider world, so be it. The NeoCons are probably the only ones to truly have the will to tackle Islamic Terrorism and deliver a good and final blow to their immense ****tardism. That anti-NeoCon, pro-evil show does nothing but to delude minds into thinkng that the NeoCons are playing up something that isn't how the anti-Americans/Liberals/Terrorists WANT everyone else to see it. This evil came hand in hand with the birth of Islam and has been a threat to peace ever since. Now people like you and CC dare to play down the NeoCons with this foolish show that attempts to cover up the real evil that has been in existence for such a long span of time? They've only tried to expose the evil, imagine what you people will do if they tried to really launch a full counter offensive against it, like another Crusade.

The entire US (minus some extreme right wingers) have accepted now that the Iraq war was a mistake. It is one of the worst policy decisions ever taken possibly by any country since probably our decision to accept partition. It has costed the US, $1 trillion. It has removed a major oil supplier from the pool. It has helped destroy the economy of a once semi-prosperous nation. It has become a new safe haven and breeding ground for terrorists. Has taken the focus away from the real terrorists hiding in the mountains of AFG and PAK.

Another one with a foolish view. I guess this is what must come hand in hand with every action good takes. The US is damned if they do and damned if they don't. The curse of being the one nation that has the capability and the intention to stand up to Islamic Terrorism, the greatest evil plaguing the world today.

[maggot_brain]

This is hilarious really ... I gotta run right now but later on I will provide you with elaborate Data on Islamic Terror ... you can pick and choose how far you want to go back in time. And also it doesnt make any sense when tallied with what you wrote in the PM a while back. Iam afraid I cant do that ... as i have burnt my fingers once ...

As I said, you need to watch it, then what I am saying will become a little clearer.

[Grim Reaper]

As I said' date=' you need to watch it, then what I am saying will become a little clearer.[/quote'] Even the ones that have watched the pack of junk see it for what it really is, like me. Just because you don't agree with it doesn't mean they haven't watched it and you must continuously question them. Following your idiotic logic I could also ask if you truly watched it because you have failed to seen it for the stupidity it is.

[maggot_brain]

Even the ones that have watched the pack of junk see it for what it really is' date=' like me. Just because you don't agree with it doesn't mean they haven't watched it and you must continuously question them. Following your idiotic logic I could also ask if you truly watched it because you have failed to seen it for the stupidity it is.[/quote'] So you've seen it then? I fail to see any idiotic logic involved. It's plain and simple if you haven't seen it don't pass judgement. Where's the idiocy in that?

[Grim Reaper]

So you've seen it then? I fail to see any idiotic logic involved. It's plain and simple if you haven't seen it don't pass judgement. Where's the idiocy in that?

It's delusional, you can't apply that logic to such a video, which is exactly what I'm talking about, not about passing judgement. I'll put it simple, it attempts to make the NeoCons look like if what they are doing is not FULLY correct and what the Islamic retards are doing is not FULLY wrong. I've been saying it the whole time but blind fools like yourself have been missing it from the first page of the thread. It's just anti-NeoCon, pro-Islamic foolishness that's all. You can do that with anything, make both sides look like if they are both equally to blame or not, despite only one side truly being fully to blame. That way you can make a balance to look like there really was no good or evil, or that both sides are equally responsible for what is happening to begin with. In which case, you are supporting the evil itself by deluding those who don't have the intellect to see around it. I on the other hand am not like you and CC, I see around this pack of idiotic junk.

[maggot_brain]

still not working ... links just time out ... tried every single one of them ...

Hmm. Bizarre, it's working for me. Are you on any torrent sites like bwtorrents? I could download the mpeg4 files and create a torrent either at bwtorrents or some other site.

[maggot_brain]

It's delusional, you can't apply that logic to such a video, which is exactly what I'm talking about, not about passing judgement. I'll put it simple, it attempts to make the NeoCons look like if what they are doing is not FULLY correct and what the Islamic retards are doing is not FULLY wrong. I've been saying it the whole time but blind fools like yourself have been missing it from the first page of the thread. It's just anti-NeoCon, pro-Islamic foolishness that's all. You can do that with anything, make both sides look like if they are both equally to blame or not, despite only one side truly being fully to blame. That way you can make a balance to look like there really was no good or evil, or that both sides are equally responsible for what is happening to begin with. In which case, you are supporting the evil itself by deluding those who don't have the intellect to see around it. I on the other hand am not like you and CC, I see around this pack of idiotic junk.

No it doesn't and it is your logic that is fatally flawed and not mine. I suppose I can cut you some slack, I thought I knew everything when I was a teenager too.

[Grim Reaper]

No it doesn't and it is your logic that is fatally flawed and not mine.

Your logic is the one that is fatally flawed and also delusional, if you haven't learned that by now, well then there is little I will or can do about your problem.

I suppose I can cut you some slack, I thought I knew everything when I was a teenager too.

That won't work with me, you can pull that off with the average teen who doesn't know what he is talking about, but you must be one foolish adult to try that on me. You are no better than the teens who you believe have views that disagree with yours. I don't cut you slack for it, but I pity you and those similar to yourself.

[Lurker]

The Black and White mentality is also exposed by yourself with your own comments. Bush put it very clear for the world to understand, "You are either with us or against us." That statement is taken as flawed logic by many, yet it is a very simple and correct solution to the complicated world many believe that they are in. Terrorism is a very serious problem that is plaguing the world, it is like a virus, infecting and slowly killing off what it wishes to. We are in the early stages now but as time goes on, you will see how it will evolve and cause much more problems. The time is coming and my generation will witness it, I doubt even another Crusade may be able to stop it.

Putting it simply that comment is one of the biggest effs of modern world, no wonder it doesnt find too many takers in the very country it was uttered, heck it doesnt find many takers in Bush's own party today even today Bush is two time President. It is rather interesting to see how Republican hopefuls have distanced themselves away from Bush and to my knowledge not even ONE of them have made the mistake of uttering - you are with us or against us. But of course that statement would sound like music to many right wing Hindus...oops Indians. xxx

[maggot_brain]

Your logic is the one that is fatally flawed and also delusional, if you haven't learned that by now, well then there is little I will or can do about your problem. That won't work with me, you can pull that off with the average teen who doesn't know what he is talking about, but you must be one foolish adult to try that on me. You are no better than the teens who you believe have views that disagree with yours. I don't cut you slack for it, but I pity you and those similar to yourself.

Speak for yourself. I don't wish to get involved in a slanging match like CC and dada_rocks often do. Needless to say I believe you are ill informed and as I've already pointed out have a closed belief system, therefore your mind cannot be changed. The statements you've made about the PON are completely false extrapolations which will be obvious to anyone who's seen it. Mercifully US Presidents can only serve two terms now. My only hope is that Obama gets in, the lesser of two evils and all. Four more years of Republican paranoia, the world can do without. Look, my intent is not to ridicule or denigrate you but simply to say - try and keep an open mind. Obviously our particular paradigms cannot be reconciled, let's try and at least keep it civil and not get into a CC / dada_rocks situation. Peace...

[Grim Reaper]

Speak for yourself. I don't wish to get involved in a slanging match like CC and dada_rocks often do. Needless to say I believe you are ill informed and as I've already pointed out have a closed belief system, therefore your mind cannot be changed. The statements you've made about the PON are completely false extrapolations which will be obvious to anyone who's seen it. Mercifully US Presidents can only serve two terms now. My only hope is that Obama gets in, the lesser of two evils and all. Four more years of Republican paranoia, the world can do without. Look, my intent is not to ridicule or denigrate you but simply to say - try and keep an open mind. Obviously our particular paradigms cannot be reconciled, let's try and at least keep it civil and not get into a CC / dada_rocks situation. Peace...

You are indeed a hypocrite, you say I close my belief system for not choosing to believe a pack of junk? You are the one who has done so, don't accuse me of it. I can only say that the entrance to hell will be wide open if that highly stupid, sorry excuse for a president 'wanna be' Obama is elected. I can only hope that these Liberals will not cause the nation to collapse from within. I don't really care much about getting into 'slanging match' with you or CC if it is called for. I will defend my views at all costs here and if it means to get into a 'slagging match', then so be it.