Tendulkar's unseemly media blitz

[Crookbond]

How is b555 wrong ?

I have mentioned the reason b555 is wrong. The author never solely attributes the cause of loss to Tendulkar. b555 mentions that the author is solely attributing the loss to Tendulkar. b555, Please don't take this as I am against your post or side. I've made my share of mistakes as well.

[Crookbond]

It's nothing but a cheap article taking personal shots at a celebrity. If such an article was written on a movie star or any other sportsman (what dress he wears' date=' how he celebrates, calling him words narcist) no one would take such an article seriously. But suddenly it's open season on Sachin and [b']anyone who objects to the cheap publicity stunts of certain writers is a bhakt and non objective

MTC, The other side is also true. Anyone who brings even an inch of criticism towards Tendulkar is a basher. It's time both sides recognize the existence of each other. Also, lets also not start the child play of -"They did it first and hence, I'm right". Finally, I would like to understand your stand on it - Is there any criticism of Tendulkar you find OK ?

[Guest BossBhai]

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[Crookbond]

By never mentioning the crappy bowling performance ... that was the main reason for the loss. But if you seriously think that 290 is not a defendable total against BD there is no point discussing further as it appears that our understanding of cricket is diametrically opposite.

The post was about - what b555 thought the author said and b555 was wrong in that statement. The author has clearly mentioned that Tendulkar's knock was "one of the reasons". In addition, I also feel bowling was one of the reasons for the loss and if I'm not wrong have mentioned it earlier too. If you feel these priors aren't true then definitely my understanding of cricket is different than yours and as it follows no point discussing further.

[Guest BossBhai]

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[Crookbond]

Why werent these other reasons mentioned ? Cherry picking by any chance ? and according to you : What is the single biggest reason we lost that match to BD ? a. Bowling b. Tendulkar To me and to most people it is the Bowling. Heck if you go thru the match thread most of the trolls who are bashing SRT also felt the same including U_G.

The article isn't about India vs Bangladesh at Asia Cup. Probably, that can be a good starting point why other factors of the defeat wasn't mentioned. If you want to discuss India vs Bangladesh there are gazillion threads out here. Lets exit this one in peace.

[Guest BossBhai]

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[akshayxyz]

Can't believe there can be two opinions about quality of the article. It is decently written cheap shot. That is it. Seriously, how can one take a article as a quality critique - which goes about 'ridiculing' dressing and stuff - of a man, who is least likely to be fashion literate. And that is not the only problem with the article.

[Crookbond]

The point is about how the author is no different than any other troll here ... mindless cherry picking and fudging half truths and sometimes brazenly lying thru the teeth as long as the end result is aligning with his agenda.

The only concern I have here is this - The author may be on one side of the table but make no mistake a lot of "fanatics" (found on this forum too) are on the other side of the table. Fundamentalists but opposite polarity. Hence, it's a little bit mind boggling that people call names. The question here is - Not what the author says or doesn't the real question here is - how does one separate the fanboys and bashers from the cricket lovers. Have you ever criticized Tendulkar, btw?

[Crookbond]

Can't believe there can be two opinions about quality of the article. It is decently written cheap shot. That is it. Seriously, how can one take a article as a quality critique - which goes about 'ridiculing' dressing and stuff - of a man, who is least likely to be fashion literate. And that is not the only problem with the article.

I'm a little surprised. It's an opinion by an author. Some people believe it's ONLY cheap shots while some believe that amongst the cheap shots the author raises valid points. It's what perspectives are all about, it varies from individual to individual. Now whether you feel either ways shouldn't make you a terrorist. I guess you would understand where I'm coming from.

[CG]

I am as big a sachin fan as anybody,But his recent press conferences have been shoddy,Some of his comments are what you do not attribute with sachin of old.

[akshayxyz]

I'm a little surprised. It's an opinion by an author. Some people believe it's ONLY cheap shots while some believe that amongst the cheap shots the author raises valid points. It's what perspectives are all about' date= it varies from individual to individual. Now whether you feel either ways shouldn't make you a terrorist. I guess you would understand where I'm coming from.

Valid in what context? What is he trying to assess? a cricketer?, a person? What is the agenda?... I have no problem with any individual's opinion. ( btw, why should you have problems with my opinion). In case of this particular article, there are too many factual mistakes - and cheap stuff like - (as I already pointed out) - dressing sense etc. And I am not bothered to list down all the errors in the article - whoever wants to believe that it is some quality criticism - it is their choice.

[Crookbond]

Valid in what context? What is he trying to assess? a cricketer?, a person? What is the agenda?... I have no problem with any individual's opinion. ( btw, why should you have problems with my opinion). In case of this particular article, there are too many factual mistakes - and cheap stuff like - (as I already pointed out) - dressing sense etc. And I am not bothered to list down all the errors in the article - whoever wants to believe that it is some quality criticism - it is their choice.

One point which I felt valid was the author's catch of Tendulkar's statement - "When you're on top, you should serve your country". Tendulkar isn't really at the top is he. I felt it that it was a nice catch by the author. The media blitz, dressing sense and adverts; I don't really agree. Btw, I don't have a problem with your opinion. I was just a little bit surprised that you see that people have multiple opinions on the article.

[akshayxyz]

One point which I felt valid was the author's catch of Tendulkar's statement - "When you're on top' date= you should serve your country". Tendulkar isn't really at the top is he. I felt it that it was a nice catch by the author. The media blitz, dressing sense and adverts; I don't really agree. Btw, I don't have a problem with your opinion. I was just a little bit surprised that you see that people have multiple opinions on the article.

That is one of the few other examples of factual error in the article. More than a nice-catch, it was just twisting the words out of context to fit into his agenda. IIRC, in that particular interview Tendulkar did not suggest that he played his best cricket in Bangladesh match. He was responding to query - whether a player should retire at the top (I think MTC or someone posted the full interview somewhere) - and when he mentioned he was still at his top - he was referring upto the first two tests in OZ ( judged over last one year, and not just one month/series/match). And whoever watched OZ test matches - all experts unanimously agreed that he looked in best touch in first two matches - and looked in good touch in England/WI-home tour too. Just that, sometimes even when you are playing good, things do not go your way. Anyone who has spent reasonable amount of time in real world would have experienced that. And I guess that is what started bothering in later half of OZ tour and in that ODI vs Bangladesh. Also, remember - when players of this class assess their skills - it is not just on the basis of match-play. For every hour in the match, they spend 10s of hours in the nets. And the only metrics they have to judge their skills are - motivation level, how they are timing, how the feet are moving etc etc. What happens in the match is important, but not the only criteria. As I said, there are few more errors. But, instead of listing out, I will respond as they appear in further discussion.

[akshayxyz]

BTW.. have a look at what Dravid has to say on - right time to retire. http://www.espncricinfo.com/magazine/content/story/559136.html

How does a player pick the right time to retire? How did you? What's the different between a slump and a sign that your time is up? What separates doubt from foresight? It's actually very hard to tell if there is such a thing as a right time. All your career, you're taught to never never give up. You're fighting, you keep improving, you always think you can sort out problems. I never thought about going out on a high or going out on a slump. A lot of people told me: "You will just know, Rahul, when the time is right." Obviously there are other things that come into consideration. Where you are in your life, where the team is at that point of time, what the future challenges are, how you fit into that. Even if someone doesn't tell you, you've been around long enough to know where you stand. There are the immediate challenges of tours like Australia and England, which you think are tough, and you want to try go there and make a difference. In the end it just comes down to knowing and being comfortable with it. And I just think, while I had been thinking about it, I was most comfortable doing it at this stage. If things had not gone well in England, maybe I would have been comfortable doing it then. Obviously after England, I felt I was in good form and that I needed to go to Australia, and I felt that it was going to be a tough tour and that it wouldn't be right to walk away after doing well in England it may sound silly, but just wanting to finish on a high - that hadn't occurred to me, in the sense that I wanted to go when I was comfortable. There was a period in 2008, the end of 2008, when I was really struggling and not getting runs, and there was a lot of talk of me being dropped. If I had been dropped at that stage, I would've still continued to play first-class cricket. Not in the intention of trying to make a comeback - I know that if I had got dropped at 36 or 37, the likelihood of me making a comeback would have been very slim. I wouldn't have played for wanting to make comeback, but because I still wanted to just play the game. It was a game I loved and I still loved enjoying playing it. I probably would have continued playing Ranji Trophy at that stage. And how long that would have lasted, who knows.

And people make out Dravid's retirement decision as prime example of - well planned decision to 'retire on the top'. Which is far from the case, as explained by Dravid himself. Decision of retirement is not a simple function as - boolean should_retire(age, runs_scored_in_last_series...).

[Crookbond]

That is one of the few other examples of factual error in the article. More than a nice-catch, it was just twisting the words out of context to fit into his agenda. IIRC, in that particular interview Tendulkar did not suggest that he played his best cricket in Bangladesh match. He was responding to query - whether a player should retire at the top (I think MTC or someone posted the full interview somewhere) - and when he mentioned he was still at his top - he was referring upto the first two tests in OZ ( judged over last one year, and not just one month/series/match). And whoever watched OZ test matches - all experts unanimously agreed that he looked in best touch in first two matches - and looked in good touch in England/WI-home tour too. Just that, sometimes even when you are playing good, things do not go your way. Anyone who has spent reasonable amount of time in real world would have experienced that. And I guess that is what started bothering in later half of OZ tour and in that ODI vs Bangladesh. Also, remember - when players of this class assess their skills - it is not just on the basis of match-play. For every hour in the match, they spend 10s of hours in the nets. And the only metrics they have to judge their skills are - motivation level, how they are timing, how the feet are moving etc etc. What happens in the match is important, but not the only criteria. As I said, there are few more errors. But, instead of listing out, I will respond as they appear in further discussion.

Thanks for catching the author's catch but in reality Tendulkar was replying to his retirement plans as asked by a journalist. I believe that results are a good indicator over a period of time. If one doesn't get results over 1 year and 3 tours, no matter how good you look it doesn't matter. If you ask me, he looked best in the Melbourne Test match and another one in England apart from that we saw both the Tendulkar's - free flowing and struggling. I see this as a worry if the pattern continues over a year. TBH, I don't feel it will continue over the next year. Reasons - home tours and weight of the 100x100 out of his mind.

[Crookbond]

BTW.. have a look at what Dravid has to say on - right time to retire. http://www.espncricinfo.com/magazine/content/story/559136.html And people make out Dravid's retirement decision as prime example of - well planned decision to 'retire on the top'. Which is far from the case, as explained by Dravid himself. Decision of retirement is not a simple function as - boolean should_retire(age, runs_scored_in_last_series...).

I would be curious to know who said that actually, would be quite funny to suggest Dravid retired at the top.

[Lurker]

I would be curious to know who said that actually' date=' would be quite funny to suggest Dravid retired at the top.[/quote'] Actually nobody mentions Dravid as retiring on top. But yes everybody would, and should, mention Dravid retiring gracefully when he could have played atleast a few more series...just on pre-perceived debt of services rendered to the nation. I have had enough of Sachin, pro and against, so I would refrain from touching on that. But what needs to be made very clear is twisting Dravid's words. Dravid clearly mentioned in his interview that even though he had a great series in England, he didnt quit because there was another tough series in Australia. That is NOT the same as Sachin suggesting one shouldnt quit on top and then goes to play BD. I mean come on are you guys freaking kidding me?? You do not understand the difference between NOT retiring in the middle of back to back tough series? And equate that with playing on retarded track and defend a demi-god who as Mukul Kesavan has correctly pointed out is hurting its own legacy. Okay so I did go there a bit with Sachin...Argghhhhh!!!

[Guest BossBhai]

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[Crookbond]

is thru facts. Ofcourse not much can be done when people prefer to doggedly lie thru their teeth to save their face which is very easy to do on internet .. in real life you will be struggling to keep a straight face.

I guess you need to tone down a little bit - preach what you practice. I found the highlighted comment a bit personal. But, will give you the benefit of doubt.

So can you answer that question I asked in post#125 .... straight answer please. Is it a) or b) ?

I didn't want to turn this thread into a SRT Bangladesh 100 discussion. I feel the answer is - bowling. But, don't you feel Tendulkar jeopardized the team's chances as well?

Forget Tendulkar ... I don't even criticize Irphaan , Jaddu, the various Koomars. It all changed though recently when I decided to be like a Roman in Rome.

Great!