Now, Oz-speak about Brahmin dominance!

[Guest Hiten.]

NEW DELHI, January 5: Both on and off the field, Team India's tour of Australia is generating heat, creating controversies. First, there was the allegedly racist remark made by Harbhajan Singh. Now a widely-circulated Australian newspaper has attempted a slipshod caste-based analysis of Indian cricket and about the Brahmin dominance in the team. Here's what Andrew Stevenson wrote in Saturday's Sydney Morning Herald. "Even today, with the game reaching further and further into the countryside, and the so-called lower orders, the Indian team has a decided flavour with Anil Kumble, Rahul Dravid, VVS Laxman, Sachin Tendulkar, Sourav Ganguly, RP Singh and Ishant Sharma all Brahmins. Wasim Jaffer is a Muslim, Harbhajan Singh a Sikh, while, of the Hindu players, only Mahendra Singh Dhoni and Yuvraj Singh come from "lower castes." True, the composition of Team Indian reflects caste imbalance due to historical as well as socio-economic factors. But Stevenson doesn't seem to be qualified enough to deal with the complex subject; especially since he cannot differentiate his kurmi from kayastha. At one point he writes that MS Dhoni comes from a "lower" caste. However, in the box at the end of the story, he categorises Dhoni as a Rajput. A Rajput and a "lower" caste at the same time? Or does he mean that anyone who is not a Brahmin is a "lower caste"? He errs on facts too. Uttar Pradesh paceman Rudra Pratap Singh has been categorized as a Brahmin; he is a Thakur/Rajput. Elsewhere in the same article, Stevenson writes: "Despite his talents, Vinod Kambli was always booed and mocked at his home ground, Wankhede Stadium in Mumbai. Observers believed it was because of the dark colour of his skin." He further quotes Kambli himself as saying, "I think it's because of my caste." Despite repeated attempts, Kambli couldn't be reached on phone for his comments. But to say that the Mumbai left-hander was "always booed and mocked" itself is questionable. Incidentally, the most booed cricketer in Indian history is Ravi Shastri, a Brahmin. Even Sourav Ganguly, who was booed for a brief period across the country, is a Brahmin. For his story, Stevenson spoke to cricketers (Ravi Shastri), commentators (Harsha Bhogle), journalists (Siddhartha Vaidyanathan). But he also extensively quotes from an insightful article by S Anand, 'The Retreat of the Brahmin', published by the Outlook magazine in 2003. Stevenson, however, errs in calling Anand a Dalit; he is a Tamil Brahmin. Perhaps, the Australian felt that only a Dalit could be so critical of Brahminism. Unlike Anand, though, Stevenson seems to lack any kind of historical perspective on caste. The one-dimensional article also overlooks the complex divides of class, region and urban-rural — all that have gone into the making of Indian cricket as it stands today. Caste is tricky terrain that requires a certain degree of understanding and reading before being written about. This clearly seems to be a case of "fools rushing in where angels fear to tread." Source: TOI ---------------- LMFAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO....And I thought Indian media printed senseless stories.... Title should go to OZ media, hands down :hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::hysterical:

[Guest dada_rocks]

Idiotic aussies.. they sud be charged for racism..

[coverpoint]

How many aboriginals play for Australia? Did they leave any undead to be ready for selection? Indians are a significant population in Aussie land. How come they are not represented in the team. The knife cuts two ways my friends

[siddhu]

couple of questions for Aussies... how many colored players have played for Australia (other than Symonds)??? In my 24+ years since WC 83 of following cricket, i don't remember any?? How many folks have been allowed to play Aussie domestic cricket like English County?? Bottomline, Aussies are the biggest racists and jerks on the entire planet...

[maggot_brain]

Australia used to have a policy called, 'White Australia' whereby only white immigrants were allowed into the country. This continued into the early 1970s. Also they applied social darwinism in attempting to 'breed out' the Aboriginal race. Oh and they also systematically annihilated the Aboriginal race, there are now no native Tasmanian Aboriginals left. Not a great history of race relations there then.

[sandtest]

same old "Atlanticist" and "White supremascists" at work...:giggle:

[maggot_brain]

couple of questions for Aussies... how many colored players have played for Australia (other than Symonds)??? In my 24+ years since WC 83 of following cricket, i don't remember any?? How many folks have been allowed to play Aussie domestic cricket like English County?? Bottomline, Aussies are the biggest racists and jerks on the entire planet...

There was Jason Gillespie who is part Aboriginal although you'd never guess.

[Anakin]

I said it before too, holier than thou attitude usually is like an epidemic among the criminals and corrupt people (eg. politicians). So it's not any surprise that the OZs will write or think something like this. And you can't really blame them, those poor guys had no other choice either travel and hope for the best or rot in the jail.

[chunky_lafanga]

Symonds is an @ss!

[sandtest]

on a seperate note - abuse of Hinduism and psy-ops propaganda comes mostly from Christian (read western) sources, not muslim (who prefer violence anyway).

[aussiefan]

wow, some biased comments here....let's not point the finger too much, unless you want that pointed in your general direction. of course australia has done some terrible things in the past but so has india, so has every country....it wasn't too long ago that milliions of people were killed between india and pakistan in that separation of countries....thats on religion, race etc.... we could all through drag up examples of any country...perhaps try limiting yourself to the article instead of painting a entire country hey? and if australia is such a bad country why do many people wish to move here? i have several good indian and sri lankan friends living here with family and they must like it here to raise families etc over their home countries...

[maggot_brain]

wow, some biased comments here....let's not point the finger too much, unless you want that pointed in your general direction. of course australia has done some terrible things in the past but so has india, so has every country....it wasn't too long ago that milliions of people were killed between india and pakistan in that separation of countries....thats on religion, race etc.... we could all through drag up examples of any country...perhaps try limiting yourself to the article instead of painting a entire country hey? and if australia is such a bad country why do many people wish to move here? i have several good indian and sri lankan friends living here with family and they must like it here to raise families etc over their home countries...

I'm not saying Australia is a bad country, just that people in glass houses shouldn't throw stones that's all. Ditto with the whole Harbhajan-Symonds affair.

[aussiefan]

thats my whole point m_brain.....

[CC1981]

of course australia has done some terrible things in the past but so has india, so has every country

Umm.. india NEVER had a racist policy when Indians ruled India, India almost NEVER went around wiping entire communities out ( well Muslims did, but not Indians of Indian philosophy school-Hindus have done it like 3-4 times in 3000+ years of recorded history) like the Aussies did with Aborigines. Yes, it is very Politically correct to say what you have, but FACT is, USA and Australia are just about one of the most attrocious histories in treatment meted out to the natives and to communities not belonging to the 'master race' ( white people in these two countries).

thats on religion, race etc...

No, thats on religion only. Not on race. Race is actually a very new concept in Indian culture- present only since the Brits took over India and even then it has a very minority awareness..you see, racism has NEVER been a concept in Indian culture and history for thousands of years till the Europeans showed up - history and indic philosophy confirms this without a shadow of doubt.

and if australia is such a bad country why do many people wish to move here?

Because Australia is one of the best places in the world to make a decent buck. People are willing to put up with a bit of racism and idiotic xenophobic closeminded cultures if it means 500% or more appreciation in income. Yes, ultimately everyone lives in a glass house but if i were an Aussie or an American, i'd not try to dredge up cultural/historical deficiencies in other countries, given how these two are by far THE MOST depraved in history.

[maggot_brain]

I said it before too' date=' holier than thou attitude usually is like an epidemic among the criminals and corrupt people (eg. politicians). So it's not any surprise that the OZs will write or think something like this. And you can't really blame them, those poor guys had no other choice either travel and hope for the best or rot in the jail.[/quote'] Come on then Mr Australia expert, any chance of something more substantial than a crude, reductionist stereotype of an entire nation?

[Anakin]

Come on then Mr Australia expert' date=' any chance of something more substantial than a crude, reductionist stereotype of an entire nation?[/quote']Nothing to do with all Australians, I'm saying this from experience, you'll always find relatively more corrupt people to have the holier than thou attitude more than regular people. The rest was just a jab, but I guess I have to explain everything to you :giggle:

[Anakin]

Good post there CC

[maggot_brain]

Umm.. india NEVER had a racist policy when Indians ruled India, India almost NEVER went around wiping entire communities out ( well Muslims did, but not Indians of Indian philosophy school-Hindus have done it like 3-4 times in 3000+ years of recorded history) like the Aussies did with Aborigines. Yes, it is very Politically correct to say what you have, but FACT is, USA and Australia are just about one of the most attrocious histories in treatment meted out to the natives and to communities not belonging to the 'master race' ( white people in these two countries). No, thats on religion only. Not on race. Race is actually a very new concept in Indian culture- present only since the Brits took over India and even then it has a very minority awareness..you see, racism has NEVER been a concept in Indian culture and history for thousands of years till the Europeans showed up - history and indic philosophy confirms this without a shadow of doubt. Because Australia is one of the best places in the world to make a decent buck. People are willing to put up with a bit of racism and idiotic xenophobic closeminded cultures if it means 500% or more appreciation in income. Yes, ultimately everyone lives in a glass house but if i were an Aussie or an American, i'd not try to dredge up cultural/historical deficiencies in other countries, given how these two are by far THE MOST depraved in history.

This is a very good point. Also it is to be noted that Jews never faced Antisemitism in India compared to what they dished out in other 'civilised countries'. Also the concept of nationalism and a national 'identity' is also a western import that it could be argued lead to the tragedy of partition. Also the twisting of the Vedas by people like Max Muller and Mortimer Wheeler to turn the myths into some sort of 'race war' is notable.

[maggot_brain]

Nothing to do with all Australians' date=' I'm saying this from experience, you'll always find relatively more corrupt people to have the holier than thou attitude more than regular people. The rest was just a jab, but I guess I have to explain everything to you :giggle:[/quote'] So everyone in Australia is a convict or descended from one? The justice system in place around the time of deportation to Australia was particularly harsh.

[aussiefan]

Umm.. india NEVER had a racist policy when Indians ruled India, India almost NEVER went around wiping entire communities out ( well Muslims did, but not Indians of Indian philosophy school-Hindus have done it like 3-4 times in 3000+ years of recorded history) like the Aussies did with Aborigines. Yes, it is very Politically correct to say what you have, but FACT is, USA and Australia are just about one of the most attrocious histories in treatment meted out to the natives and to communities not belonging to the 'master race' ( white people in these two countries). No, thats on religion only. Not on race. Race is actually a very new concept in Indian culture- present only since the Brits took over India and even then it has a very minority awareness..you see, racism has NEVER been a concept in Indian culture and history for thousands of years till the Europeans showed up - history and indic philosophy confirms this without a shadow of doubt. Because Australia is one of the best places in the world to make a decent buck. People are willing to put up with a bit of racism and idiotic xenophobic closeminded cultures if it means 500% or more appreciation in income. Yes, ultimately everyone lives in a glass house but if i were an Aussie or an American, i'd not try to dredge up cultural/historical deficiencies in other countries, given how these two are by far THE MOST depraved in history.

c&c you must be bored sh@tless to write that much crap...in reply:

• most depraved countries? i guess nazi germany ranks third on your list after 1. Aus and 2. USA :hysterical:...China under Mao is probably 25 on your list
• so race is a new concept to India, i guess caste must be too, you better explain this to all the dalits out there :haha:
• .....i have never seen you say anything good about australia, its people etc....a bit jealous perhaps?