Ganguly the captain - How good was he?

[theguyinallblue]

Ganguly the captain - How good was he? There is an argument that the captains with the best record are not necessarily the best leaders. Steve Waugh, with a 72 percent win rate, may statistically be Test cricket's most successful captain but the argument goes his tactical nous was hardly taxed: watch your batsmen score at four an over, declare with a massive lead, give the new ball to Glenn McGrath, let Shane Warne bowl into the rough and wait for victory. Is Michael Vaughan a better captain than Mike Brearley because he has won more Test matches? Surely Brearley achieved more with less talent at his disposal against tougher opposition. Nasser Hussain admits that he got an easier ride as captain than his predecessors Mike Atherton and Alec Stewart because his reign covered the era of central contracts, Duncan Fletcher and consistency in selection. So what to make of Sourav Ganguly? Statistically he is the most successful Indian captain of all-time. He had 49 Tests in charge from 2001 until 2005, winning 43 percent, although take away the victories over Bangladesh and Zimbabwe and this success falls to 30 percent. Consider also the records of other great Indian leaders: Mohammad Azharuddin was captain in 47 Tests from 1990 to 1999 and he won just 14 matches while Sunil Gavaskar was captain in 47 Tests and he won just nine times. Some would say that a team with the talents of Sachin Tendulkar, Rahul Dravid, Anil Kumble, VVS Laxman, Harbhajan Singh and Virendar Sehwag should be expected to win matches. The biggest tick in Ganguly's column is his success away from home, where India played 28 Tests, winning 11, drawing seven and losing 10. But he never actually beat anyone. Ganguly's India won four series away from home: again take away the two wins over Bangladesh and one over Zimbabwe and the only team of any merit they beat was Pakistan. Drawn series away against Australia and England were a good start but nothing more. To fully appreciate Ganguly's legacy, his one-day results must also be examined. He won 76 of his 147 games in charge (54%). Yet against leading nations, India under Ganguly only beat England (53.85%) and West Indies (53.33%) more often than they lost. During his tenure India made it to the final of the 2003 World Cup and the 2004 Asia Cup - and lost both. But perhaps that is to miss the point of what Ganguly brought to the team. Ganguly brought a hard edge to the team, most famously by standing up to cricket's playground bullies Nasser Hussain and Steve Waugh. But was he the right man for the job or simply in the right place at the right time? A telling story emerged during his fallout with Indian coach Greg Chappell. In 2003 Ganguly supported the appointed of the Australian Chappell as coach. Yet the honeymoon was brief and the pair found themselves constantly at odds. The relationship reached its nadir in September 2005 when an email that Chappell had written damning Ganguly's captaincy was leaked to the press. In the letter Chappell accused Ganguly of setting a bad example with his approach to training. "Everything he does is designed to maximise his chance of success and is usually detrimental to someone else's chances," Chappell wrote. "This team has been made to be fearful and distrusting by the rumour mongering and deceit that is Sourav's modus operandi of divide and rule. "Certain players have been treated with favour, all of them bowlers, while others have been shunted up and down the order or left out of the team to suit Sourav's whims." Chappell is no longer coach of India after a disastrous World Cup but Ganguly remains in the squad. Former England captain Alec Stewart told it was well known that Ganguly could rub people up the wrong way, but that did not make him a bad captain. He did point out that Ganguly inherited a very talented team who were extremely difficult to beat at home so his success was not unexpected. "If you asked me if Shane Warne was a good captain, I could say 'yes' because he did some brilliant things when he was in charge of the one day team. "If you asked me if Stephen Fleming was a good captain, I could say 'yes' because he took a group of average players and shaped them into a formidable unit. "But I don't remember anything Ganguly did that stands out as brilliant or stands out as a waste of time." Stewart sums it up. Nothing Ganguly did stands out. His greatest achievement away from home was a drawn series against Australia. He never won a major one-day trophy. He was accused by his coach of undermining his own team. It's fair to say based on results since he left that post that he didn't lay the foundations for future success. Ganguly's statistics are average when compared to the likes of Waugh or even Michael Vaughan, but fantastic when compared to other Indian captains. It seems that either Ganguly was a good captain with an average team or an average captain with a good team. PS: The Rahul Dravid has already surpassed Ganguly as more successful captain in ODIs..his win % are more than Ganguly. even the pakistan series win that people credit to Ganguly...Dravid was the captain the first game...thus winning a test after so many years... Ganguly returned in only third game..and Dravid won us that game..Ganguly or no Ganguly that series was always ours for taking....because of the superb form of Dravid. Dravid needs the support of its STAR batsmen..who have forgotten how to bat.. we lost two matches in WC...the same SL team...jisko hamne 6-1 se haraya tha not long ago...the same BD team..jiski band baja di...WC ke baad... and on top of that politics of Greg and Senior mafia... now that Dravid has all the control and responsibilities..we have already seen some success..like first overseas win after 3 decades..in WI...first overseas ODI win over SA... so eventually in coming 2 years...Dravid will overtake Ganguly's Test records..just like he has over taken ODI records.. who knows..if our batting clicks...we will create history this summer in England.. Go Dravid Go..all the indians are supporting you..except may be some Bengalis..:wink_smile:

[kumble_rocks]

Good post . Though I would consider the context under which Ganguly took over the captaincy .In 2000, after the match fixing scandal Ganguly was named the captain of the India team. Their was lot of infighting and Tendulkar had issues leading the team. As a leader he was successful in uniting the team to some extent. Again , Alec Stewart was an average captain himself. I would take what he says with a pinch of salt. Also, under Rahul Dravid's stewardship we were knocked out of the WC in the preliminary rounds. So , no matter what winning % he enjoys , their is no way he is better than Ganguly in ODI at least for now.

[Gambit]

Ganguly is the best captain India has ever had so far. No amount of revisionism is going to change that. Indian cricket was in doldrums when he came at the helm and over the course of the next 5 years, we reached the pinnacle of test and ODI cricket being second only to the Australians.

[Predator_05]

This article is trash. Stewart is clearly a moron who knows nothing about Indian cricket. So Fleming is a great captain because he got some average results with an average team like NZ ? By the same token, Ganguly should be a legendary captain because he took over a pathetic Indian team after the match-fixing scandal and took them to heights never seen before. Even more hilarious is his claim that Ganguly didn't do anything that stands out as "brilliant". How about being the first captain to reach the World Cup final in 20 years ? Or being the first Indian captain in over two decades to win Tests in Australia, Pakistan, WI ? The notion that India would have tests anyway is also a bit naive. India always had good players throughout the 90's but never won anything away from home. Stewart is a fool.

[Lurker]

Ganguly is the best modern Indian captain Period! Sure he had great players when he was the skipper but just as it can be argued that SRT/Dravid/Kumble made Ganguly a success as a captain it can also be argued that Ganguly ensured that all the pressues were taken away from SRT/Dravid/Kumble and he and he only faced the music which he did. The man wore his heart at sleeves, make no mistakes about it. When Freddie celebrated by taking his shirt off at Bombay, Ganguly did the same at Lords. It was not planned but perhaps more prompted by the occassion, regardless the man, at his peak, was as fine a skipper and as passionate a Indian captain that I have seen yet. xxx

[Guest dada_rocks]

Oye BIHARI :haha:kab tak dada ke pichhe para rahega

[Guest dada_rocks]

Ganguly is the best modern Indian captain Period! Sure he had great players when he was the skipper but just as it can be argued that SRT/Dravid/Kumble made Ganguly a success as a captain it can also be argued that Ganguly ensured that all the pressues were taken away from SRT/Dravid/Kumble and he and he only faced the music which he did. The man wore his heart at sleeves, make no mistakes about it. When Freddie celebrated by taking his shirt off at Bombay, Ganguly did the same at Lords. It was not planned but perhaps more prompted by the occassion, regardless the man, at his peak, was as fine a skipper and as passionate a Indian captain that I have seen yet. xxx

You guys can close this site down, I am in agreement wiht Lurker:haha:

[Guest dada_rocks]

Chappel kachara ki baton ke zilch value hai.. sala imagine karta tha things wo.. wo gaya hai aur team india bina kisi faction ke dikh rahi hai sala jab tak wo tha na jane kitane faction ban gaye the...

[Guest dada_rocks]

Go Dravid Go..all the indians are supporting you..except may be some Bengalis..

this is so off the mark bengalis boo chappel not team india..

[Guest dada_rocks]

Good post . Though I would consider the context under which Ganguly took over the captaincy .In 2000, after the match fixing scandal Ganguly was named the captain of the India team. Their was lot of infighting and Tendulkar had issues leading the team. As a leader he was successful in uniting the team to some extent. Again , Alec Stewart was an average captain himself. I would take what he says with a pinch of salt. Also, under Rahul Dravid's stewardship we were knocked out of the WC in the preliminary rounds. So , no matter what winning % he enjoys , their is no way he is better than Ganguly in ODI at least for now.

this thread has no future.. after lurker I am in agreement with KR:haha:

[varun]

Here's a recent video about Ganguly the captain that was linked alongside the posted article above.

Launch in external player

[yoda]

Record looks very ordinary if you take minnows out. And given that it was achieved with some top talent shows that captaincy was pretty mediocre. The guy had a knack for showing off as if we had conquered the world. That much I give him.

[Predator_05]

Record looks very ordinary if you take minnows out. And given that it was achieved with some top talent shows that captaincy was pretty mediocre.

That record, as ordinary as it may look - is still the best produced by ANY Indian captain. Those of us who watched India play before the 2003 World Cup can say that before he took over, India won f*ck all away from home. His captaincy was an improvement on the sh*tty performances seen under Tendulkar and Azhar. Gavaskar didn't win anything either because he was a gutless p*ssy who would go for the win only when India were in an unassailable position (which wasn't very often, hence his pathetic record) and Kapil was no better. You have to go all the way back to 1971 if you want to see records of an Indian team which won test matches away from home. Ganguly changed all that and set a trend. I love the talent argument. Azhar had the greatest batsman of the modern era - Tendulkar - and he never won a damn thing. Another fact that people neglect is that much of that "top talent" was hand-picked by him. Harbhajan Singh would have been sitting in some police station as a hawaldar if Ganguly didn't insist on his selection for the 2001 series vs AUS. Before than he was an outcast, damaged goods because he had been humiliatingly called for chucking. No selector even thought of him (that is why they picked Sarandeep Singh). Yuvraj had been dumped after his first season and was brought back at Ganguly's request. The selectors picked Mohanty ahead of Nehra, and Ganguly argued for the latter. ...and i'd take an "arrogant" show off as a captain anyday. At least the team showed some balls, some fight under Ganguly. Tendulkar was oh so courteous and diplomatic, and no wonder the team played like a bunch of c*nts. At least Ganguly wanted to win at all costs - even if they meant p*ssing off evryone else - and that attitude rubbed off on the youngsters.

[Guest dada_rocks]

That record, as ordinary as it may look - is still the best produced by ANY Indian captain. Those of us who watched India play before the 2003 World Cup can say that before he took over, India won f*ck all away from home. His captaincy was an improvement on the sh*tty performances seen under Tendulkar and Azhar. Gavaskar didn't win anything either because he was a gutless p*ssy who would go for the win only when India were in an unassailable position (which wasn't very often, hence his pathetic record) and Kapil was no better. You have to go all the way back to 1971 if you want to see records of an Indian team which won test matches away from home. Ganguly changed all that and set a trend. I love the talent argument. Azhar had the greatest batsman of the modern era - Tendulkar - and he never won a damn thing. Another fact that people neglect is that much of that "top talent" was hand-picked by him. Harbhajan Singh would have been sitting in some police station as a hawaldar if Ganguly didn't insist on his selection for the 2001 series vs AUS. Before than he was an outcast, damaged goods because he had been humiliatingly called for chucking. No selector even thought of him (that is why they picked Sarandeep Singh). Yuvraj had been dumped after his first season and was brought back at Ganguly's request. The selectors picked Mohanty ahead of Nehra, and Ganguly argued for the latter. ...and i'd take an "arrogant" show off as a captain anyday. At least the team showed some balls, some fight under Ganguly. Tendulkar was oh so courteous and diplomatic, and no wonder the team played like a bunch of c*nts. At least Ganguly wanted to win at all costs - even if they meant p*ssing off evryone else - and that attitude rubbed off on the youngsters.

:thumbs_up: Sehwag,bhajji,yuvraj kaif all were his hand-picked lieutenants.

[yoda]

That record, as ordinary as it may look

That's all I care about.

[Predator_05]

That's all I care about.

What do you think of Dravid's record ? Including the test wins vs Banglastan, his win % is 32.

[yoda]

What do you think of Dravid's record ? Including the test wins vs Banglastan' date= his win % is 32.

He is mediocre too, but with declining talent.