Raj Thackeray sucks a new low -- Will Mumbaikars accept him?

[kumble_rocks]

Moron tongue in cheek u have bene on throat of amar singh and Big B without any reaosn.. I have reaons to call those khans what I call them..

BS, do you have any proof that King Khan collaborated with underworld ?

[CC1981]

In my humble opinion ' date=' DR should stop posting till he improves his writing skills. For a guy who has been debating for ages now, his English and writing skills are surprisingly mediocre. I simply cannot comprehend what he tries to convey sometimes through his muddled posts.[/quote'] LOL. I don't think he realizes how crappy most of his postings are due to his completely inadequate grasp of English/typing skills. A guy who posts as many muddled posts as him, without using the spell-check at hand just conveys how little he cares about his own readability- and whats the point of taking such a chap seriously ? 000000000

[CC1981]

I have reaons to call those khans what I call them..

We know your reasons : That they are muslims who are very successful in the movie industry dominating a hindu nation and that you are a muslim-hater who levels baseless accusations.

[Guest dada_rocks]

BS' date=' do you have any proof that King Khan collaborated with underworld ?[/quote'] I am not doign the same routine millionth time.. yawn

[sandtest]

Sandy is proven to me by his constant praise of Balasaheb that he does not care about South Indians and DR seems to agree with Sandy ... It's a pity !

When did I say, I do not care about South Indians?? Perhaps you should read more carefully....whether it's a Hindu from South, North, East or west, he is equally an Indian. as told before, it was the same Balasaheb Thackeray who rushed Shivsainiks when ROPers armed with Dawood and Dubai money were slaughtering Hindus in Paydhuni, Bhiwandi and Mohd Ali Road during Mumbai riots. Shivsainiks under fearless and non-PC guidance of Balasaheb, protected all Hindus-- UP, Biharis and South Indians irrespective of their region. So let's learn to give credit to Balasaheb where it's due......whenever radical Ummah pushes Hindus in those ROP dominated areas, it is same Shivsena which comes to rescue them. perhaps you or many of those in Mumbai haven't witnessed Mumbai riots in slum areas, hence your hatred for Shivsainiks. Btw...yesterday, Balasaheb criticized Raj Thackeray in Samana, basically Shivsena said it doesnot support expuslsion of outsiders, but only wants a check on mass immigration and some assurity for job to local Mumbaikars. Legitimate demand in all fairness, I must say.

[kumble_rocks]

FYI , Sandy and DR , here is a interesting tidbit on the great Balasaheb. I commiserate with the the author's post here. I took the liberty of highlighting in bold relevant sentences for your perusal. But wait, no prize for guessing , their still won't be unequivocal criticism of Thackeray from both you simply because it was South Indians he targeted....Admit it that you don't care for South Indians , otherwise both of you wouldn't be eulogizing Balasaheb in spite of the fact that he terrorized south indians in the 70's. And you were quick to pounce on Raj for the same crime , albeit different subject. http://www.merinews.com/catFull.jsp?articleID=130018 MOST INDIAN newspapers and channels carried funny-sounding stories this week about Maharashtra Navnirman Sena (MNS) and its founder chief Raj Thackeray. The prize goes to the report headlined ‘UP, Bihar leaders slam Goonda Raj!’ “The violence instigated by Raj Thackeray and his men makes a mockery of our constitution,” Mayawati thundered, “The administration looked the other way while people from UP and Bihar were being beaten up on the streets, and their property destroyed by hooligans of the MNS.” She found instant support from her bitter rivals in her state. Mobsters of SP stopped trains and burnt Raj Thackeray’s effigies. Shivpal Yadav, SP general secretary, lambasted the Maharashtra government, “When Raj Thackeray and his men are indulging in hooliganism, the state government seems to be sleeping.” Let us for the time being ignore the illegitimacy of the pot calling the kettle black – notorious goons of SP and BSP as well as JD (U) and RJD. Let us try to analytically to look into what is happening in Mumbai. The MNS president triggered the crisis on Friday (February 1) by ridiculing Bollywood superstar Amitabh Bachchan on starting a girls’ school in UP. He also took a dig at some of the superstitious customs of North Indians - particularly during ‘chhath pooja’ rituals. An SP-organised rally at Shivaji Park the following Sunday added fuel to the fire started by his inflammatory remarks. The politicos incited North Indians to resort to ‘lathis’ if they are prevented from coming to Mumbai. MNS retorted they would defeat the lathis with spears. The Centre reportedly asked for an Action-Taken report apparently at the initiative of Shivraj Patil, Maharashtra Congressman. (Yes, he is still around and India is supposed to have a home minister in him!) Rumours soon spread that Raj would be arrested. Who started them - MNC itself or its rivals – will never be known. Theatres screening Bhojpuri films, hapless taxi drivers and milk and vegetable vendors from North Indian states are bearing the brunt of continued lawlessness triggered by these rumours. What is not being realised by readily fooled people is that the fracas is no more than a show of strength between MNS and Shiv Sena, the outfit run by Raj’s uncle Bal Keshav Thackeray, the smalltime cartoonist who has become ‘Balasaheb’. Most political outfits are only hoping to derive advantage from the feud. The wily Maratha manipulator Sharad Pawar and the saffron outfit BJP are shadow boxing, while the run-down Congress hopes for their mutual annihilation. It is not much different from a parasitic police force that passively watches the war between underground mafia gangs. “The police could have detained Raj Thackeray under Section 151(3) of the IPC, where a person can be detained for upto 30 days, if there is a fear of inciting violence, complains (comfortably) retired IPS officer YP Singh. Julio Riberio agrees, “The government could have gone to court and got summons issued against him.” Over 230 workers of the MNS and the SP have been booked in a dozen cases and two police officials have been suspended in response to these loud noises. But, Mumbai police have not dared to touch the main culprit. He even graced the wedding reception of the police commissioner’s daughter and a meek DCP paid obeisance at his house to confirm if he was satisfied with the security arrangements! KL Prasad, joint commissioner, Law and Order reasoned, “We need enough evidence. We don’t want to arrest him and make him a hero. He will get bail immediately.” Prasad is right; for, that is the way things stand. What Raj is practicing now is simply a repetition of his uncle’s “Maharashtra is for Maharashtrians” campaign in the 1970s. “Bajao pungi, bhagao lungi” was the war cry Bal Thackeray devised to target and terrorise South Indians then. After carving a niche, he joined hands with the saffron brigade and issued calls to Hindus to form “Hindu suicide squads” to counter alleged Muslim violence. He is currently a respected Hindutva icon advocating the renaming of India as “Hindurashtra”, where only “our religion is to be honoured here” after which “we will look after other religions.” He thus consolidated the OBC vote bank and turned into the ‘remote control’ of the state government in 1995. Thackeray and the murderous goons of Shiv Sena and allied saffron outfits roam about as respected citizens ever since. Bal was indicted by Justice Srikrishna, a comparatively junior judge who accepted the challenge of probing the 1992-93 Mumbai riots, for involvement in the ghastly incidents. However, the police and the judiciary are unable to lay hands on the Fuehrer. His Sena lords over businessmen, builders and Bollywood biggies of Mumbai even more ruthless extortions than the dreaded D Company. Thackeray wrote, “Muslims should draw a lesson from the demolition of the Babri Masjid, otherwise they will meet the same fate as the Babri Masjid. Muslims who criticise the demolition are without religion, without a nation.” Even as everyone is aware what his incendiary articles had to do with the riots that killed 900 people, Mumbai High Court bowed before him and held, “These articles do not criticise Muslims as a whole, but Muslims who are traitors in India!” Likewise, a January 1993 essay claiming “The ugly and violent form of Muslim traitors was witnessed in the city yesterday…. Our prophecy has come true. A Muslim, whichever country he belongs to, whatever position he occupies, is first a Muslim” was found not amounting to “creating feelings of ill-will, spite and hatred!” The sympathy wave all over India in favour of Amitabh Bachchan is quixotic. He had started dabbling in politics with the patronage of his ‘friends’ Rajiv and Sanjay of the Nehru dynasty. He never fully retired from the dirty profession as can be seen from ties with the UP wheeler-dealer Amar Singh. Just two years ago, Amitabh was the main attraction at a book release function – a photo-biography of Bal Thackeray by his pet nephew Raj. Also, one of the very first felicitations received by Big B upon his being declared a farmer by the UP government was the junior Thackeray. A Sena toughie thinking of defecting to MNS reminisces, “Those were the days when it was an unwritten rule that whenever Raj would organise a big function, Bachchan would be the chief guest.” How the superstar benefited and used that clout to acquire huge tracts of land in Maharashtra is anyone’s guess. That the Big B has now become an object of attack for the deposed heir-apparent of the outfit is only logical! The ambitious nephew was widely expected to take the reins from its founder ‘senapati’, throwing just crumbs at his low-profile cousin Uddhav, Bala’s son. When that did not materialise, it has become necessary for him to build one. Bachchan recently launched the debut music album of Aditya, Uddhav’s son. The senior Thackeray deputed Uddhav to attend the wedding of Abhishek and Aishwarya on his behalf. The Bachchans knew that Raj had parted ways from the Sena, and so did not give him even a casual invite. All these gave an indication that Bachchan was closer to Uddhav’s family than Raj’s. Naturally, nobody can blame him for adopting the same tactics he mastered under his ‘illustrious’ uncle! Shiv Sena realises pretty well that Raj’s offensive against North Indians – portraying himself as the messiah of the Marathi Manoos – could eat into its own Marathi votebank. Raj Thackeray is obviously hijacking the Sena’s original trump card: His followers say, “It’s not a good thing that our jobs are going to outsiders. How will we like it? The Shiv Sena used to raise this issue before. But, they are not raising it anymore.” An alarmed Manohar Joshi, who once presided over the ‘honourable’ Parliament, declares, “’The Marathi Manoos is very important to us.” After all, a typical Marathi man in Mumbai streets feels, “They can’t come from outside and sit on our heads.” Several ‘intellectuals’ from the northern states have resorted to condemning offhand the incidents in Mumbai, insisting that all Indians have the full right to venture in any part of the country for education, employment or other purpose. Their argument is that despite the physical boundaries between states, we feel proud in referring to ourselves as Indians, boasting of 5000 years of rich history when people of different religions have been living in perfect harmony. What our ‘nationalists’ forget is that except during the last 300 years of colonial rule during the ‘5000 years of rich history’, India has never been one nation! Like Europe, it is the habitat of distinct nationalities, which the politicians want to synthetically unite for their own advantage. The right approach to contain harassments to the common public is to recognise that the entity headquartered New Delhi can, at best, be a confederation like the European Union. Let us admit that the so-called integration of the erstwhile 600 princely states by Vallabhbhai Patel into one dominion has been an utter failure. That has created more problems than it sought to solve. While citizens may be allowed free movement in all territories, indiscriminate migration of workers from one region to another will only serve unscrupulous elements. For example, a person from any of the territories of India, even though ‘proudly’ calling himself an ‘Asian’, is not permitted to settle in China or Japan without proper procedure. The ‘integral part of India’ rhetoric will only lead to more unseen divisions and tensions. The lack of a realistic, transparent and well-defined regulation with respect to jobs and migration, like in the USA or EU, is the root cause of the rise of people like Bal Thackeray and his nephew in every part of the ‘one dominion’. Only, the other ‘leaders’ do not get publicity because what they extort from ‘outsiders’ in their ‘ilakas’ (territories) is too meager compared to the financial capital of India!

[sandtest]

their still won't be unequivocal criticism of Thackeray from both you simply because it was South Indians he targeted....Admit it that you don't care for South Indians , otherwise both of you wouldn't be eulogizing Balasaheb in spite of the fact that he terrorized south indians in the 70's. And you were quick to pounce on Raj for the same crime , albeit different subject.

Why you are moaning about being a South Indian in your every second post....aren't you trying to stir regional sentiments in a subtle way here?? I am telling you third time here that you haven't seen the Mumbai riots, which we have....It was same Balasaheb who called for protection of all Hindus against armed ROPers and those ROP dominated areas like Paydhuni, Behram Baug/Jogeshwari and slums/chawls do have some Hindu population comprising of North and South Indians. Shivsainiks protected them without descrimination simply because they were Hindus vulnerable to murderous ROPers. Can't you give some credit where it is due instead of searching and googling for a two-bit free lance article to prove your anti-Balasaheb stance?? Wait.....I just finished reading this amazing source and the last paragraph made me wonder what the writers real agenda is --- look basically he is even dis-crediting the greatest leader of India -- Sardar Vallabhbhai Patel. Clearly he is promoting division of our country although in a subtle way. So, Stop googling for such articles. Raj Thackeray cannot be Balasaheb, that's the fact.

Let us admit that the so-called integration of the erstwhile 600 princely states by Vallabhbhai Patel into one dominion has been an utter failure. That has created more problems than it sought to solve. While citizens may be allowed free movement in all territories, indiscriminate migration of workers from one region to another will only serve unscrupulous elements. For example, a person from any of the territories of India, even though ‘proudly’ calling himself an ‘Asian’, is not permitted to settle in China or Japan without proper procedure. The ‘integral part of India’ rhetoric will only lead to more unseen divisions and tensions. http://www.merinews.com/catFull.jsp?articleID=130018

So basically this writers is trying to portray India as a failed state, just because a two-bit power hungry idiot like Raj Thackeray, who at the moment don't have even a political base said something :giggle:...subtle are the ways of India-hating 2-bit writers to conduct psy-ops....*sigh*

[PaiN_KiLLeR]

He just seems to sidestep every point made by KR :haha:

[Guest dada_rocks]

KR never makes any point he has this verbal diarrohea where he vomits sthg and thinks that's the reevant point.... He has gone silent why his tipu is secula messiha because he fired a letter which he is yet to produce under threat fo british but Thackrey must be roasted no matetr what.. I know that clown has no answer to this sort of dichtomy in his stand.... HE wil just opne up some new front till someone nails that too.. it's litany of hit and run in hope that shtg sticks Anyway here is Rajdeep Sardesai's channel in name of debatng the issue of attack on north indians in Mumbai basically discussing how north indians are different subtly endorsing the attack on them.. http://www.ibnlive.com/videos/58527/02_2008/ftn0802_3/target-north-indians-big-bias-or-fitting-reply.html

[kumble_rocks]

Again no criticism from DR or Sandy . Not even an acknowledgment of the fact that Balasaheb orchestrated attacks against South Indians in the 70's. These two gentlemen should stop spewing Hindiutva nonsense from now on. Me thinks , they have lost all moral authority to speak on behalf of Hindus , simply because they don't consider attack on fellow Hindus relevant for criticism. And Bheembhai should take a note that these two gentlemen are perfectly okay if his fellow kannadigas(Hinuds) are attacked. If not okay , then why are they not criticizingThackeray for his alleged crimes against South Indians ? After all , this is my zillionth post in this thread cajoling them to do so ! And for the record , I unequivocally condemn both the Thackerays for their attack against Indians , be it North or South . This is what I am looking from these two google ninjas.

[Lurker]

Why you are moaning about being a South Indian in your every second post....aren't you trying to stir regional sentiments in a subtle way here??

Rather simple. The apple doesnt fall far from the tree. Bal **** Thackeray started all this hunagama 30 years back. Now the chicken has come home to roost. I can only imagine the two sipping Malt whiskey and singing Boore kaam ka boora natija sun bhai chacha, arre haan bhatija.. All these developments makes me actually happy that I left Bombay. Indeed this was one of the reason I left Mumbai thanks to all the Marathi bhaichara over rest of the countrymen at TCS Mumbai.

[suma25]

Indeed this was one of the reason I left Mumbai thanks to all the Marathi bhaichara over rest of the countrymen at TCS Mumbai.

talk with them in marathi and you will be fine. :cantstop:

[CC1981]

Perhaps you should read more carefully....whether it's a Hindu from South, North, East or west, he is equally an Indian.

We have read carefully allright- we have read right into your religious fascism that the Hinduvta and scumbag organisations like RSS, VHP etc. propagate. Perhaps *YOU* need to read our constitution more carefully- whether it is a hindu,muslim, sikh,christian,jew,buddhist or jain , from South,North, East or West, he or she is equally Indian. And there is not a damn thing you can do or say to change that, for our nation's constitution ENSHRINES that. So in other words, you may not like it, but you are just as much Indian as a muslim. I suggest the sooner you deal with the reality, the better for your own mental health.

[Lurker]

So in other words' date=' you may not like it, [b']but you are just as much Indian as a muslim. I suggest the sooner you deal with the reality, the better for your own mental health.

Right on. A Marathi Hindu does NOT have any different status than a Bengali Muslim. Both will enter the election booth with a single ballot and when produced in court of law will get the same treatment in eyes of Justice. It is just the hallucination for bhagwa brigade that India is for Hindus. Of course once you start going deeper it becomes more for Marathi Hindu, Gujrati Hindu, Sharshwat Brahmin etc etc.

[Lurker]

Now Advani comes out against Thackerays(Raj and Uddhav) In a veiled criticism of ally Shiv Sena and Maharashtra Navnirman Sena (MNS), BJP leader L K Advani on Monday said the remarks against north Indians were against the concept of national unity. Dubbing them as “unacceptable,” Advani said, “No political party should say or do anything that weakens the country's unity or undermine the Constitution." http://www.ibnlive.com/news/advani-fires-salvo-against-raj-shiv-sena--fir-against-raj/58691-3.html Indeed this is a key difference between a Vajpayee, an Advani on one hand and a Thackeray or a Narendra Modi on the other. The formers with all their pitfalls can claim to be Nationalist in nature, the latter are nothing more than regional leaders who cater exclusively to the whims of their constituency. Unfortunately many right wing brigade, or brigand, dont exactly see the difference.

[kumble_rocks]

Anyways , I don't know what these Thackeray clowns are yapping about anyways ... The number of outsiders are actually decreasing thanks to cities like bangalore , hyderabad etc ... http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/India/Number_of_outsiders_in_Mumbai_declining/articleshow/2756873.cms Mumbai is often called the city of dreams. The phrase refers not just to Bollywood, but also to the potential the city offers to people for jobs. But dreams can also give rise to delusions. And, one of the delusions persistently kept alive by some political outfits in Mumbai is that it is being swamped by "outsiders", that is, people from other states. Migration figures clearly show this is a myth. Mumbai is not being swamped by outsiders. In fact, the proportion of out-of-state migrants has considerably gone down over the decades. In the 1960s, when the "sons of the soil" slogan was first raised, the share of out-of-state migrants in Mumbai’s population was over 36%. In 2001, it had dropped to 26%. In fact, within the state, migrants from other districts of Maharashtra too has gone down from 27% to 19% of the population. As a consequence, even by a strict definition, Mumbaikars now constitute over 57% of Mumbai's population compared to 34% in 1961. The migrants in Mumbai are now mostly from north Indian states, unlike in the past when Gujaratis and South Indian states made up the largest share. This is attributed to the rise of Hyderabad, Bangalore and Chennai, as centres of employment and the high economic growth in Gujarat. This indicates that migration can be reduced if jobs are created nearer home. Another feature of migration to Mumbai is that the new migrants are mostly settling down in Navi Mumbai, Thane, Kalyan and Mira-Bhayander areas. They live in these areas, and if necessary, travel to the main city for work. Thus, the perception that they are putting an unsustainable load on the civic infrastructure is not completely true. The unsustainability is arising due to a total mismatch between the growing population and myopic urban development policies. Perhaps the most important feature of migrants' lives in Mumbai is the nature of their employment. According to a study by S Parasuraman, director, Tata Institute of Social Sciences, over 49% of male migrants coming to Mumbai do production-related jobs. A majority of them work in industries and occupations that need semi-skilled or unskilled workers with minimal educational qualifications. In contrast, the non-migrants have dominated white-collar professional, technical, executive and managerial jobs, including clerical and sales jobs, in various service-based industries, says Parsuraman in a paper presented at a conference on world megapolises, held in Mumbai last year. Mumbai's economic structure has undergone a drastic change over the past decades. Over 81% of its employment is in the tertiary sector today. This mostly comprises the unorganized sector, including construction, hospitality, personal services, retail and wholesale trade, financial services. Experts say migrants, apart from working in industries, are involved in providing 48 types of services in the city — ranging from selling milk, vegetables and provisions to driving vehicles, working as security guards and so on. While these are mostly low paying jobs, their contribution to maintaining the standard of life in this affluent city cannot be discounted. According to NSS reports, the share of the self-employed in the city has increased from about 35% in 1993-04 to more than 40% in 2004-05 among men. The share of casual labourers too has risen in that period from about 2% to 8% for men. Most of these jobs are being done by migrants. While there are no authoritative studies to quantify the migrants' contribution to the economy of cities like Mumbai, international studies of immigrants clearly show their significant contribution to host economies. According to a study, the contribution of immigrants to the economy of the United Kingdom was about $5.4 billion and they also generated over 200,000 jobs through their spending within the UK. Another study on the impact of immigrants on the US economy estimated that these "outsiders" contribute more than $10 billion every year. In fact, unskilled jobs within US would have declined by 3-4% per annum if poor immigrants, mostly from Mexico, had not been filling them up.

[Lurker]

Mumbai is not being swamped by outsiders. In fact, the proportion of out-of-state migrants has considerably gone down over the decades. In the 1960s, when the "sons of the soil" slogan was first raised, the share of out-of-state migrants in Mumbai’s population was over 36%. In 2001, it had dropped to 26%. In fact, within the state, migrants from other districts of Maharashtra too has gone down from 27% to 19% of the population. As a consequence, even by a strict definition, Mumbaikars now constitute over 57% of Mumbai's population compared to 34% in 1961. The migrants in Mumbai are now mostly from north Indian states, unlike in the past when Gujaratis and South Indian states made up the largest share.

Interesting find KR. Though I must say it doesnt surprise me one bit. The (down)fall of Mumbai started in late 80s and early 90s thanks mainly to the divisive politics of Balls Thackeray. The early 90s coincided with Mumbai blasts(a phenomenon that happened on more than one occassion in 90s) and was followed by religious riots. This era also coincided with Indian liberalisation and lot more chances for other cities to come up. Thus when Mumbai was burning Bangalore, Hyderabad were coming up the ladder. Of course the retarded Mumbai politicians failed to see that and kept harping on Marathi respect. And as we can see they have their own fan following as well! :haha: As a result today Mumbai is not the single stop for commerce when it comes to India. In some ways it is good I suppose(more developed cities in India), in other ways it is sad to see Indian Financial Center pitting itself against the likes of Pune and Cochin to get large projects these days. xxx

[PaiN_KiLLeR]

Not to be outdone by the MNS .... Ball Thokrey's Shiv Sainiks have attacked shops owned by south indians in Shridi http://www.newspostindia.com/report-36533 In continuing ethnic turmoil in western Maharashtra, Shiv Sena workers Monday blackened Telugu and Tamil nameplates of some restaurants and shops in Shirdi. In Nashik district's Ambed town, about 350 km from the state capital Mumbai, hundreds of north Indian employees of small scale industries and business establishments have fled, allegedly on being threatened by Maharashtra Navnirman Sena (MNS) workers. While the irate Shiv Sena workers in Shirdi told media-persons after the rampage that they would not tolerate any non-Marathi nameplates in Maharashtra, MNS denied any role in the developments in Ambed, saying they do not act behind the scene. Shiv Sena's executive president Uddhav Thackeray had criticized the utterances of MNS president and his estranged cousin Raj Thackeray against superstar Amitabh Bachchan and north Indians in Mumbai last week. The party which espouses Marathi pride and claims to be the sole protector of interests of 'Marathi manoos' (Marathi man) had, in an editorial comment in its mouthpiece Saamna, dubbed MNS workers' attacks on north Indians as hooliganism of a misdirected bunch of youth.

[Guest dada_rocks]

Good that's how it should be.. Bihar and UP sud be developed further..

[Guest dada_rocks]

Gleaned from other site for KR's benefit I have never tried to justify actions of MNS, what they did was wrong, I was not even born when the anti South Indian agitations happened. But I have many South Indian friends, and all of them are doing very well in life, also the traditional south Indian dominated localities of Mumbai, like Chembur, Matunga, Dharavi are still thriving, so obviously whatever happened during 60s was not serious, and is treated as a distant memory best forgotten. The MLA of my area is a South Indian, despite the fact that large sections of our area are still Sena strong holds and there is no significant South Indian presence, if Maharashtrians held any grudge against Southerners this would not have happened. But it seems like people like you from distant Chennai are yet to get over it. RANDHIR MUMBAI INDIA