UN rates best and worst countries to live

[Dhondy]

Actually, i shud add one correction - I dunno if docs (indian docs) "preferred" UK? More like many could not get visas to USA due to the consulates not approving it for docs, so they go to UK. Is this fairly right (majority of cases)?

There may have been a couple of years when that might have been true, when the US clamped down on International Medical Grads, say around the early-90s. In general however, there are far too many Indian doctors who come to the UK without even considering US for what you say to be a truism. There are several reasons for this. First, the pay of junior doctors in the UK is the highest in the world, second to none. In contrast, for the first 3-6 years (depending on whether you took up a speacialisation), you are very poorly paid in the US. However, after that pay in the US outstrips that in the UK. Second, the PLAB Test is a somewhat easier proposition than the USMLE, which has 3 steps, and requires very high scores to get a good residency. Third, it was very difficult for people to get surgical residencies in the US. Therefore, traditionally, people from medical specialties went to the US, while surgical aspirants came to the UK. Fourth, MRCP, FRCS has a huge lure for people born in the 60s and early 70s. The current crop would probably not be so enamoured. Fifth, social life is much better in the UK. You have shorter hours, more family friendly work practices, longer maternity leave, better sick leave, more annual leave. Work-life balance is considerably better than in the US. US has one major advantage. Money. While primary care physicians earn the same as they would have done in the UK, specialists often earn twice or higher than their counterparts in the UK.

[fineleg]

First, the pay of junior doctors in the UK is the highest in the world, second to none. In contrast, for the first 3-6 years (depending on whether you took up a speacialisation), you are very poorly paid in the US. However, after that pay in the US outstrips that in the UK..

Thanks for ur answer Dhondy. Question - regardz to above - if first 3-6 yearz are below UK, but then later on US pay outstrips UK, wont folkz think longterm and prefer US? (just focussing on this specific point u raized, the other pointz i will take ur word, except for the "better work life balance"...i have questions on that but thatz for later)

[Dhondy]

Thanks for ur answer Dhondy. Question - regardz to above - if first 3-6 yearz are below UK, but then later on US pay outstrips UK, wont folkz think longterm and prefer US? (just focussing on this specific point u raized)

Yes, many of them do. But equally, many don't. The US is a much bigger employer, hence will have higher numbers obviously. However,for its size, the UK has porportionately drawn very high numbers of doctors because of the above factors and its familiarity. This has all changed because of new rules though. I'll deal with that some other day.

[fineleg]

Yes, many of them do. But equally, many don't. The US is a much bigger employer, hence will have higher numbers obviously. However,for its size, the UK has porportionately drawn very high numbers of doctors because of the above factors and its familiarity. This has all changed because of new rules though. I'll deal with that some other day.

I presume ur talking abt the non-EU grads rule...ok, for later.

[fineleg]

There may have been a couple of years when that might have been true' date=' when the US clamped down on International Medical Grads, say around the early-90s..[/quote'] Doc, BTW - even today US clamp down on Med Grads from India is there - you cannot usually get a visa for Medical grads if you declare your education. I know some friends (girls who are doctors) who got married to Engineer husbands working in USA. They have come to USA after marriage in dependent H visa without disclosing their medical degree. Becos if they disclose, they will not even get dependent visa!

[Guest dada_rocks]

Did he actually do his PhD at all? or still "studying"? :)

No idea ..now u mention may be it's time to ping him..:D

[Guest dada_rocks]

Forget the schools and roads, I bet my bottom dollar Australia is more beautiful and picturesque than Canada and has much better weather than Canada. Whats a country without good, all-season tourist spots !

AgaiN I have not been to australia but it's hard to belive that anythign wud be more picturesque than a roa-trip from toronto to Nova-scotia.. or a rail-ride through rocky mountains.. Nova scotia has to be one of the most freaking beautiful place particulalry in summer

[apocalypse]

CC: I will appreciate if you edit your post on first page. There is no need for foul mouthing. You are comparing a country whose independence was achieved just 50 years ago. Considering Australia, there have been so many attacks on Indians living there. And you put entire blame on India. If you dont appreciate the positives then please dont be an arm chair critic also

[Guest dada_rocks]

CC: I will appreciate if you edit your post on first page. There is no need for foul mouthing. You are comparing a country whose independence was achieved just 50 years ago. Considering Australia, there have been so many attacks on Indians living there. And you put entire blame on India. If you dont appreciate the positives then please dont be an arm chair critic also

Good luck Apo with driving bare minimum sense to empty brain:D

[Lurker]

No idea ..now u mention may be it's time to ping him..:D

Kahe? Apne pair pe kyun kulhaadi maar rahe ho? Maloom chala 1 minute phone call mein sab kuch jal gaaya :hysterical: Let him be. Its only better for YOU :hatsoff:

[Mandrake]

Nowhere worth mentioning. India, for the most part, is still a fairly big to live in. If its not the terrible poverty & overpopulation, its the terrible smog of clunky and outdated industries. If its not that, then its the bhagwaa-brigade hindu jihadis, if its not that, then its the mullah-brigade jihadis. If not that, then its the cross-wearing brigade of jihadis. Ofcourse, there is the nationalist versus communist versus just plain idiots all going on. And on top of that, there is corruption, casteism, sexism and amazing amounts of natural destruction and destitution happening (which in itself will be the cause of India's ultimate demise). I've been to many European countries, many middle eastern countries, north americas and some south-east asia. And India is very near the bottom of the pile for overall liveability- the only thing going for India is it has a fairly robust cultural scene that somehow keeps ticking, despite being a pretty sick puppy from time to time. No, India is not improving anytime soon-it will not eliminate poverty to the western levels in the next 100 years- and by then it won't matter anyways, for with global warming, retreating glaciers and ganga-jamuna drying up, India is just a place waiting to die as a civilization.Or atleast,the north- the deccan will still remain relatively liveable... but heartland of India (Sindhu-ganga-jamuna-brahmaputra valley) is toast in the near future. And given that most Indians live in this area, India as a nation is also toast pretty soon. Oh well.

what a pile of nonsense....India is well behind the west is self evident but to paint such an overtly negative picture!!......so global warming is going to cause India's demise? I can make the same case for any of the developed nations. USA by the way ranks right at the top in terms of carbon footprint. Living standards in India have improved drastically in the last decade and continue to do so. If you want to close your eyes its your choice.

[Guest dada_rocks]

Kahe? Apne pair pe kyun kulhaadi maar rahe ho? Maloom chala 1 minute phone call mein sab kuch jal gaaya :hysterical: Let him be. Its only better for YOU :hatsoff:

mera nahin jalta hai bhaya main intrinsically less libidio wala aadmi hun :haha:

[CC1981]

.so global warming is going to cause India's demise? I can make the same case for any of the developed nations. USA by the way ranks right at the top in terms of carbon footprint. Living standards in India have improved drastically in the last decade and continue to do so. If you want to close your eyes its your choice.

Ofcourse, global warming will finish India. Unless ofcourse, you can think of a reason why India will still flourish when Ganga,Jamuna, Brahmaputra and 90% of the himalayan rivers dry up. Ganga-Jamuna basin is where over 600 million people live...what happens to them when there is no more ganga, no more water, the fields start to desertify(again,due to lack of water) ? Yes, global warming will hurt many nations- but India is going to be one of the WORST affected regions! Not only will Ganga-Jamuna dry up ( hello,Gangotri,Jamunotri and all these glaciers are retreating and even the best estimates say 100-150 years before they are gone. No more Gangotri = no more Ganga!) and create an create mass social upheaval, areas like Krishna delta, mahanadi delta, Kaveri delta & ofcourse the Ganga-Brahmaputra delta are ALL going to be underwater if the sea levels rise so much as 1-1.5 meters(which is projected to happen in the next 150 years). With these kinds of massive geographical changes, there is a future for India ? I don't think so. Oh and i agree- living standards are improving- but that in itself doesn't make a civlization. There are way too many social ills in India and we should be honest enough to admit that.

[Desi Cartman]

Its the case of grass is greener on the other side, but australia is heads up with its weather. I guess, other factors are security, taxes, cost of living etc - canada ain' cheap for that matter escpcailly where I live, for a 2 bedroom home, its minium 350K, so it all really depends. Canada is attached to the US, so travelling to US destinations and mexico becomes very affordable, whereas in Aus...well, u are just in Aus

Its pretty much the same here as far as the taxes are concerned. I guess its because of the size of the country and not enough people to support the infrastructure needed. Plus the population is scattered. Cost of living is sky rocketing in Aus for some time now as well , plus the house prices are going through the roof. One of the major reason for this in Aus is the growth of mining industry which is booming due to the growing demand from china and India. As for the beauty , I don't think you can compare it.

[Desi Cartman]

Ofcourse, global warming will finish India. Unless ofcourse, you can think of a reason why India will still flourish when Ganga,Jamuna, Brahmaputra and 90% of the himalayan rivers dry up. Ganga-Jamuna basin is where over 600 million people live...what happens to them when there is no more ganga, no more water, the fields start to desertify(again,due to lack of water) ? Yes, global warming will hurt many nations- but India is going to be one of the WORST affected regions! Not only will Ganga-Jamuna dry up ( hello,Gangotri,Jamunotri and all these glaciers are retreating and even the best estimates say 100-150 years before they are gone. No more Gangotri = no more Ganga!) and create an create mass social upheaval, areas like Krishna delta, mahanadi delta, Kaveri delta & ofcourse the Ganga-Brahmaputra delta are ALL going to be underwater if the sea levels rise so much as 1-1.5 meters(which is projected to happen in the next 150 years). With these kinds of massive geographical changes, there is a future for India ? I don't think so. Oh and i agree- living standards are improving- but that in itself doesn't make a civlization. There are way too many social ills in India and we should be honest enough to admit that.

Hmmm to be honest CC , its a tough one we don't know what India is going to be like in 150 years. Just compare what US was 150 years ago and what it is today. Global warming may not even go to that level where it dries up everything or it may happen in next 20 years. Who knows In Aus we have had drought for last 10 years but we have learnt heaps from it. Now they are talking about using recycled water for many purposes and are building desalinization plants to use sea water. Some people thought that this drought will never end and its happening due to global warming but guess what ... This year there has been record rainfall in Queensland and the draught is over. As for calling India $hithole, well I don't think its polite to do that even if you think like that. You may not like a country but its rude to put it like that... Just my opinion !

[Guest Hiten.]

Where does India rank in these ratings ?

[CC1981]

we don't know what India is going to be like in 150 years. Just compare what US was 150 years ago and what it is today.

Agreed, atleast, socially. But it is important to realize that India TODAY is a very backwards culture with high levels of fundamental 'dictatorship' in the society- where there is way too much control afforded to parents, husbands and religious groups. It is understandable that India has regressed a lot in the last 1000 years, going from THE liberal place on the planet with a very high culture to one that is just a milder form of Arabia today, due to its history. But at the same time, if we are to wish for an Indian cultural reneissance, that will make us realize our dreams of putting India back where it belonged ( at the top of the world, not struggling to get out of the bottom in societerial terms, not just financial) and be admired the world over, we cannot ignore the social problems in India.

Global warming may not even go to that level where it dries up everything or it may happen in next 20 years. Who knows

Indeed. To be very frank,i am not a total believer in the GW theory but i do think it is worth keeping an eye on. There are, in my perspective, two competing theories, both of which presents a very strong case : The global warming theory vs the global ice-age theory. The first i will ignore for this post(since everyone is familiar with it and can find out about it in the net) but the latter is definitely the dark sheep of the pack, yet worth considering. There is a well thought out theory that what we are seeing now could be the very final step before the start of the next ice-age. Ice sample cores from antarctica that go back hundreds of thousands of years and spanning several ice ages have shown that there is always a sharp, very short(geologically speaking) and consistent spike in global temperatures (as we have experienced over the last 50+ years) right before the ice ages start. There is also a theory put forward that with the melting ice-caps, the salinity of the seas will decrease relatively (much more fresh-water influx = lower salinity levels) and it will disrupt the global salinity 'conveyor belt', which is basically what drives the main deep ocean currents like gulf stream. As soon as this conveyor belt of salinity-driven deep sea currents are disrupted, it will be the start of an ice-age because it will basically mean no more 'hot and saline' current flowing into the arctic ocean. It is not very well known that temperatures in Europe are much lower than what it should be at those latitudes due to the gulf-stream. Places like London, without this warm current bringing in heat around the isles would see temperatures of -25/-30C in the winter, as most places in the world at similar latitudes see. It is interesting to see which side the world will flip to but i cannot help see the personal irony to all this : I am a desi born guy, who is a canadian citizen living in Canada. The two countries that personally concern me the most are Canada and India and either which way, one of them is going to be the prime loser. If global warming, as is the mainstream opinion, continues, then India will be finished. It will end up looking like Iraq today (in terms of climate), where only seasonal monsoon rains will drive seasonal rivers and the entire north-Indian plain (which is the backbone of the country's population, culture and economy) will be largely a desert. On the other hand, it will make Canada far more inhabitable, with the ice/permafrost/unbearable winters of the north retreating and making Canada essentially the 'new India', with hoardes of people from the world over comming in to claim this massive land for human use. On the other hand, if another ice age is upon us, then Canada is effectively finished, as most of the country will go under ice-sheets and the rest of the country would be tundra. However, this will be a manna for India and the rest of South-west Asia, since it will also sizeably increase the snow/ice reserves in the himalayas. Most importantly, it would result in Tibet being one gigantic ice-covered alpine platue, effectively putting an end to India-China border tensions ( imagine most of tibet being Siachen and you get the point). Also, it would mean a far greater increase in the snow-reserves and glaciation in the hindukush range, which would directly mean a massive increase in river volume, fertility and arability of the lands in Afghanistan, Iran and much of central Asia. IMO, this would see a resurgance of the liberalism that defined India in those lands and the spread of our largely agrarian 'land of plenty' morals into what is now a largely 'desert/land of few and with hardcore morals'. ie, India becomes the central plexis of the world yet again. We shall see how this pans out- either way, if it happens in my lifetime ( i doubt it will but maybe if i live long enough, the future will become more and more revealed in terms of where it is headed to), it will involve the death of one of the two countries i love the most while vaulting the other into global pre-emminence.

[Dirty_South]

Norway owns your COUNTRIES .... I did my major part of my education there and my Dad still stays there , can't wait to get back to Norway.... I have been to Canada, Aus,France but still nothing to beat Norway...(I have never been to USA or UK) Sweden is much better compared to Can & OZ ...I still wonder how Norway is not number ONE :(

[Dhondy]

Norway owns your COUNTRIES .... I did my major part of my education there and my Dad still stays there , can't wait to get back to Norway.... I have been to Canada, Aus,France but still nothing to beat Norway...(I have never been to USA or UK) Sweden is much better compared to Can & OZ ...I still wonder how Norway is not number ONE :(

It was last year.

[Dirty_South]

It was last year.

. Ya I know ... What's so special in Iceland ? The ICE ? :D Any guyz been to Iceland ?