yoda Posted August 30, 2010 Posted August 30, 2010 Why Salute people for not being crooks? Have our standards fallen so low? Yes they are all people of great integrity the way they carry/carried themselves, but I mean Salute them for not fixing games?
vamos_rafa Posted August 30, 2010 Posted August 30, 2010 Why Salute people for not being crooks? Have our standards fallen so low? Yes they are all people of great integrity the way they carry/carried themselves, but I mean Salute them for not fixing games? Well mate you are looking at things from a very narrow slit. These people need to be saluted because they were our heroes right through the 90's.And if you just make a list of all the other worshiped cricketers during that era, be it wasim,waqar,warne,cronje,azhar(he wasn't worshiped per se but still had a huge fan base),Kapil(though not found guilty but his name did crop up with some solid evidence) all were involved in match fixing. I would also add the name of Javagal Srinath in this list.
yoda Posted August 30, 2010 Posted August 30, 2010 Well mate you are looking at things from a very narrow slit. These people need to be saluted because they were our heroes right through the 90's.And if you just make a list of all the other worshiped cricketers during that era, be it wasim,waqar,warne,cronje,azhar(he wasn't worshiped per se but still had a huge fan base),Kapil(though not found guilty but his name did crop up with some solid evidence) all were involved in match fixing. I would also add the name of Javagal Srinath in this list. They were the heroes cause they weren't crooks? I admire RD for his work ethic. I admire SRT for his exciting stroke play and Sehwag for his audacious batting. I admire Kumble for his never say die attitude. For me, not being a crook is a given, no matter which era you played in.
vamos_rafa Posted August 30, 2010 Posted August 30, 2010 no, the then board secretary Jaywant Lele and Coach Anshuman had told him that the next day's match was fixed by Azhar & co, indian team was set to lose...this was part of the sting operation by Tehelka once a few years back. I would agree that Azhar or other match fixers/bookies would not have directly approached Sachin/Kumble but our heroes had an idea about what was happening in the same dressing room. as some one pointed out, there could have been many reasons for not coming out-threat from underworld, lack of credible, legally valid proof etc. Yeah, i remember reading the whole testament and what you said is right. But in the entire transcript i found Madan Lal stating that even if the BCCI is informed about this still there would be any reactions form them. So maybe that kind of an attitude by the BCCI would have stopped them. Mind you these are all speculations from my side as well. And the shabby attitude of BCCI can be found in one of these book reviews for Pradeep Magazine's book "Not Quite Cricket" IT is an acknowledged fact that one of the greatest pleasures of life is to be able to sit back and exclaim: "I told you so." Whether this is to compliment an acquaintance for accepting your advice or to chide him for ignoring it, the four ever-popular words give you an indescribable high. Well, the writer of this book can indeed enjoy the privilege of uttering these words on the issue of match fixing. It was he who had removed the curtains from the murky goings-on in the underworld of betting and bribes to cricket stars. It is a pleasant coincidence that his book has hit the stands when the controversy is at its peak, making it compulsory reading of sorts. With the benefit of hindsight, it can be said that if his warnings were heeded, the dirt would not have hit the game quite the way it has. But that was not to be. The book is a chronicle of the frustrations that are in store for anyone daring to fight the system, especially if he happens to be a journalist chasing an investigative story. It was in 1997 that Pradeep Magazine was visiting the Caribbean to cover the matches for his newspaper, The Pioneer. He had a chance encounter with a bookie there, which opened a stinking can of deception and underhand dealings. This bookie-agent not only told him that players took money to change the odds but also gave the names. According to him, crores of rupees are wagered in the outcome of a match and if someone has paid a player who can change the course of a match, he stands to make a lot of money. Some players run themselves out, play false strokes, deliberately slow down the tempo of the match or bowl badly to manipulate the odds. If you have two or three key players to do so, especially the captain, it is very much possible to fix the result of the match. When Magazine fibbed that he knew Sachin Tendulkar and Mohammad Azharuddin very well, this agent, whom the author refers to as Anil (a pseudonym), made him an offer: Help me establish contact with them and I can give you as much as Rs 40 lakh! "The money can be put in any foreign bank of your choice. Or, if you wish, I can give you a house in a locality of your choice in Delhi. All I am asking you to do is to get these two players to talk to me. Can you do it?" A dazed Magazine discussed the matter with his roommate, another journalist, who advised caution. But Magazine decided to play along with the agent in the hope that something much bigger could be unearthed. Perhaps he was oblivious of the fact that such sticking his neck out annoys the establishment no end. Perhaps he also did not remember the incident that took a few years earlier when an enterprising journalist actually purchased a woman, Kamala, to prove that women are still being bought and sold like cattle. The incensed government instead of being beholden to him for exposing the scandal, toyed with the idea of prosecuting him for indulging in this illegal activity. Such incidents only highlight the difficulties of an investigative journalist. If he writes on the basis of the experience of others, he is accused of depending on hearsay. If he acts as a decoy, he is hauled over the coals as if he is a culprit. Anyway, the agent "engaged" Magazine to give him information about wicket, weather, likely teams and which team stood a better chance. These nuggets were to be provided on the eve of every Test match — for a fee of Rs 10,000 per match. Magazine had informed his Editor, Chandan Mitra, of the entire Anil episode and the latter had given him the green signal to do as he thought it fit. He wanted to do the story from Guyana itself but knew it lacked meat, as it was based purely on a personal experience. But at the same time, there was a strong possibility of something coming out of it. Match-fixing charges had simultaneously surfaced in Pakistan when Aamir Sohail accused some of his team members of doing so for money. Magazine decided to talk to the coach of the Indian team, Madan Lal, describing his experience and enquiring whether he had suspected anything and if a bookie had ever approached him with an offer. The coach did not seem to be surprised at the question but advised him not to go ahead with the story unless he had concrete facts. What the author quotes Madan Lal as saying was to prove almost prophetic: "Listen Pradeep, nothing is going to come out of what you want to do. I tell you, no one is going to react. Only silence from the establishment is going to greet you. The only possibility of the truth coming out is when a player gets up and says that his teammates have taken money. Till that happens, there is no point in pursuing the story. It could even prove dangerous". At the same time, he admitted he too had his suspicions. "Look at the lifestyle of some of the players, compare it with the money that they earn and the truth will come out." Later, he talked to captain Tendulkar who told him: "Even I have been hearing a lot of things about this whole affair. I don’t know what to do. If I were you, I wouldn’t do the story but would tell the police about this man. Tell them to tap the man’s phone and let us see who he talks to." But the story was carried with an eight-column banner headline: "I was offered Rs 40 lakh by a bookie to ‘fix’ a match." It is after this stage that the narrative in the book becomes racier than a one-day match (if it is not fixed, that is!). The reaction of the BCCI was one of silence. Except for condemning Magazine for bringing the "fair name of Indian cricket into disrepute", there was no attempt to find out whether the story was true or not. But unknown to Magazine, things were moving at a feverish pitch. The Board sent a fax to Tendulkar, taking the "I" in the story to be him and asking him (Tendulkar) to explain who this man was who had offered him the money! (What Mohinder Amarnath said about the Board members and selectors stops being comic after this incident.) When Magazine wrote a letter to the Board saying that "I fail to understand how Tendulkar’s name was linked with the bookie when my story was clear and at no stage did it even hint that the bookie had met Tendulkar", he got a bizarre reply: "Now that you have denied the story, it would have been in the fitness of things if you had also named the bookie whom you had met". "How was my letter a denial of the story? Who would I name him to? The Board had all along maintained that the bookie was a concoction of my fevered imagination," Magazine wonders. The most fascinating and revealing is the chapter about the author’s appearance before Justice Chandrachud. After general questions he waited for the crucial one about the bookie, who he was, and other related questions which could have been useful in this probe. The questions never came. Magazine even offered to tell him what Tendulkar and Madan Lal told him after he told them the story of the bookie. The Judge said: "Leave it". "I was shocked. The man was not willing to listen, to know. What kind of a probe was this? I realised the futility of the entire exercise," Magazine laments. On being prompted that if he can establish a bookie-player nexus, it would be easier to find the truth, Magazine claims the Judge said: "Nothing is going to come out of that. Even if bookies have written the names of the players in their diaries, that is not conclusive proof." That apparently shows the frustration of the former Chief Justice of India over the Jain hawala case that had recently taken place. So much for the efficacy of enquiries into such affairs. Journalists and others can only provide the lead. After that investigative agencies have to take charge. But that rarely happens. Just think what would have been the plight of Magazine if the Hansie Cronje scandal had not come to light. His expose would have continued to be called a newsman’s attempt to sensationalise a story. This narration of events forms the first part of the book which runs into 83 pages. The second part is equally long and focuses on what ails Indian cricket. This is obviously not as juicy as the first one. His contention is that the Board has been treating the matches as a money-making venture without bothering to plough back the money into the promotion of the game or the players. Test players and one-day players get a respectable sum now but those taking part in domestic cricket, even the Ranji Trophy, are paid a pittance. The facilities extended to them are fit for a galley slave. Under these circumstances most players grow up with a sense of insecurity. The errors of commission and omission of the Board are held responsible for reducing the players to pawns in whose heart flows the lava of rebellion. The cricket administrators play the game of favouritism in which anybody who speaks out is treated as a traitor. You cannot fight the system and are made to fall in line. The circumstances are tailor-made for turning everyone into a mercenary. He narrates how even a fiery player like Mohinder Amarnath decided to make peace with the establishment after some time. Magazine recalls how coach Madan Lal was snubbed when he began supervising the training of the team himself. The physiotherapist, "who obviously had a godfather on the Board", got a letter issued to him signed by Board secretary Jayant Lele saying in no uncertain terms that the job of training the team was Dr Irani’s and not Madan Lal’s. Madan Lad did not even fight back. "Had he done so, he would never have been able to step back into the cricket hierarchy again. That is how the establishment tames the best of people, people who are sincere and want to do something positive for the team and the country. Haryana Ranji Trophy player Sarkar Talwar points out: "Even today a Ranji Trophy player gets Rs 2,000 as match fees. Is it possible to survive on that kind of money in any city in India? If you are playing in a place like Mumbai, you’ve had it. Invariably players have to dip into their own pockets." Ajay Sharma, the Delhi skipper, puts the spotlight on the Duleep Trophy: "In 1997, I remember, the North Zone team had to travel for about 16 hours by bus from Guwahati to Silchar in the East Zone. And we had to play a match the next day. Once we even had to travel without any reservation and had to occupy toilets so that we could find a place to stand." Ironically, it is Kapil Dev whom Magazine interviews at length on whether he thought Indian players had taken money to fix matches or bet on the game (who was to know at that time that the icon himself will be dragged into the controversy?). Says the winning team captain of the Indian World Cup: " I wouldn’t know. During my time I did not think such a thing was happening. But when there is so much of smoke, there has to be some fire. A proper probe has to be conducted to get to the bottom of the whole affair. Why not hand over the entire probe to the CBI? If there are some players who are suspect, the best way out is to evaluate their assets. After all there has to be a record of the money earned and spent. My business is an open book. Anyone can have a look at it. This should be the case with others too." On being reminded of the Chandrachud probe and its findings which had exonerated players from any "wrongdoing", Kapil says sarcastically: "What probe? If the man asks you, what would you like to have, what were your playing days like, do you think such things happen, and all sorts of questions which do not get to the crux of the problem, then how can you call it a probe? As expected, it is Bishen Singh Bedi who speaks without any ifs and buts. On being asked if he thought players were actually throwing away matches for money he says emphatically: "Yes they are. I am convinced about it. Like you, I too have met bookies and talked to players. I don’t want to get into the details but one thing is certain; the Chandrachud report, or to be more correct, the Chandrachud cover-up, has done the maximum damage to Indian cricket". Talking about the games the Board plays, he recalls: "In the late fifties, when New Zealand had come to India, India won a Test match inside of four days. You know what the Board did? They deducted Rs 50 each from the players’ match fees. Instead of Rs 250 they were given only Rs 200. That is the Board for you." It may be simplistic to blame the match-fixing on the faults of the Board but the book is right in pointing out that far too much is wrong in the administration of cricket and there is need for cleaning the whole augean stable. But chances are 10 to 1 that even now when the fixing scandal has provided the perfect reason to do so, there will be the usual dragging of feet and procrastination. Want to bet?Top The way the BCCI behaved to the whole story and the way they tried involving goddy in the whole affair was quite baffling. And I think they need not have washed dirty linen in public because that is highly uncalled for during a crisis. They fact that they cooperated with the investigation is a highly commendable job.
Rajan Posted August 30, 2010 Posted August 30, 2010 //As expected, it is Bishen Singh Bedi who speaks without any ifs and buts. On being asked if he thought players were actually throwing away matches for money he says emphatically: "Yes they are. I am convinced about it. Like you, I too have met bookies and talked to players. I don’t want to get into the details but one thing is certain; the Chandrachud report, or to be more correct, the Chandrachud cover-up, has done the maximum damage to Indian cricket". Talking about the games the Board plays, he recalls: "In the late fifties, when New Zealand had come to India, India won a Test match inside of four days. You know what the Board did? They deducted Rs 50 each from the players’ match fees. Instead of Rs 250 they were given only Rs 200. That is the Board for you."// poor Bedi & team! how sad that is. if the same thing happens today, the board secretary will announce a bonus for the entire team, support staff and even bus driver!
DomainK Posted August 30, 2010 Posted August 30, 2010 //As expected, it is Bishen Singh Bedi who speaks without any ifs and buts. On being asked if he thought players were actually throwing away matches for money he says emphatically: "Yes they are. I am convinced about it. Like you, I too have met bookies and talked to players. I don’t want to get into the details but one thing is certain; the Chandrachud report, or to be more correct, the Chandrachud cover-up, has done the maximum damage to Indian cricket". Talking about the games the Board plays, he recalls: "In the late fifties, when New Zealand had come to India, India won a Test match inside of four days. You know what the Board did? They deducted Rs 50 each from the players’ match fees. Instead of Rs 250 they were given only Rs 200. That is the Board for you."// poor Bedi & team! how sad that is. if the same thing happens today, the board secretary will announce a bonus for the entire team, support staff and even bus driver! I have such an allergy to this guy that I can never sympathize with him.
CSK Fan Posted August 30, 2010 Posted August 30, 2010 They were the heroes cause they weren't crooks? I admire RD for his work ethic. I admire SRT for his exciting stroke play and Sehwag for his audacious batting. I admire Kumble for his never say die attitude. For me, not being a crook is a given, no matter which era you played in. Exaxtly. Thats like Pakistani fans calling Afridi a hero becasue he did not fix
Karan114 Posted September 4, 2010 Posted September 4, 2010 Unshakeables, the Fab Five of Team India Unshakeables, the Fab Five of Team India By Suresh Menon Match-fixing 2.0 might have taken 10 years to arrive, but what is significant is that despite the first round implicating skipper Mohammad Azharuddin, the cancer did not spread in India. All the elements were in place — the money, the bookmakers, the meaningless matches — and Indian cricket might easily have paid the price. It didn’t because India were incredibly lucky to find a generation of high-integrity players. Hadn’t it been for the new skipper Sourav Ganguly and his band of upright men, Sachin Tendulkar, Anil Kumble, Rahul Dravid, VVS Laxman, Javagal Srinath cricket might never have recovered. We haven’t given these players enough credit for this. Their value did not begin and end with runs scored, wickets taken and matches won but went beyond into those areas which in the long run have greater impact on a nation’s sporting consciousness. It is a tribute to their probity that no match-fixer even bothered to tempt them. Perhaps that is what Tendulkar meant when he said recently that no player was approached by bookies in his time (presumably after Azharuddin and his cohorts had been smoked out). He and his colleagues stood as bulwarks against corruption. Match-fixers had to look elsewhere, and Pakistan was the obvious target, full of players with uncertain futures, governments and cricket boards that were corrupt, and with the prime examples of heroes who had supped with the devil and lived to tell the tale. There is a lesson here. What was common to the Indian heroes (apart from their middle class backgrounds) was education and a system of values. With the exception of Tendulkar, they were all university-educated men, some of whom did well in professional courses too. The Indian board’s tie-up with Kumble for a finishing school or mentoring university will hopefully continue that tradition. The temptations today are greater — the resistance must be greater too. Ten years ago, when Match-fixing 1.0 was unearthed, the reaction of the authorities was sometimes hilarious. There was a plan to fix spy cameras in dressing rooms. Or plant moles among the players. Is it any wonder then that the Anti-Corruption Security Unit that was set up had as many teeth as a newborn? That is why the International Cricket Council reacting to the News of the World revelations within a week is rather like Usain Bolt running the 100 metres in four seconds. Yet, the fact remains that there is no system to deal with match fixing that is clearly laid out and independent of member-countries’ interference. As soon as the story broke, the players involved ought to have been suspended pending an inquiry. A suspension does not presume guilt, and the Pakistan Cricket Board’s cry that it will not react till Scotland Yard registers a case is merely self-serving. The police authorities are investigating a criminal case, which by all accounts they will find hard to sustain given that no money was lost and no one came to any harm. They are not investigating the harm done to cricket. The disciplinary case is the ICC’s baby. What will the fall out of Match-fixing 2.0 (let us not split hairs, spot fixing is merely a version of match fixing) be? The Asian bloc which has been calling the shots in the game has developed cracks but the money is still in India, and the power shift longed for by England and Australia might not occur. But there could be a realignment of forces. Cameras and moles will not work. Perhaps the ICC might use the technique weathermen do, feeding as many discrete, unconnected events into a computer and then studying the pattern. Is a batting order being frequently changed? Are players being moved around? Are there surprising bowling changes? It is hard work, even boring, but any event out of the ordinary must be recorded over a period to discover whether a shift from the normal is occasioned by cricketing reasons or something sinister. We demand a higher moral standard from our sportsmen than from others. This is how it ought to be. The President of Pakistan might be ‘Mr Ten Percent’. But sportsmen cannot use that as an excuse. Sport and morality have a special relationship. Bill Clinton might have cheated on his wife, but had he cheated on a golf course, there would have been no redemption. http://www.dnaindia.com/sport/comment_unshakeables-the-fab-five-of-team-india_1433637
Gunner_Mania Posted September 4, 2010 Posted September 4, 2010 Unshakeables' date= the Fab Five of Team India We demand a higher moral standard from our sportsmen than from others. This is how it ought to be. The President of Pakistan might be ‘Mr Ten Percent’. But sportsmen cannot use that as an excuse. Sport and morality have a special relationship. Bill Clinton might have cheated on his wife, but had he cheated on a golf course, there would have been no redemption. http://www.dnaindia.com/sport/comment_unshakeables-the-fab-five-of-team-india_1433637 Huh. Does he mean Tiger Woods? I know Bill C also cheated his wife, but if he had cheated on a golf course, it would have meant Jack sh!t
achilles Posted September 5, 2010 Posted September 5, 2010 Seems like the author is still miffed with some sections the media for blowing up the Tiger Woods story. Wonderful read though. Thanks for the share.
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