Lurker Posted May 13, 2007 Share Posted May 13, 2007 Re: Milk/ Fitness/ ChickenBreast/Nuts...everything allowed here! Because you cant ban protien. Creatine damages over long term primarily due to overusing your body (kidneys). Its not gonna actively destroy stuff in your body like naldrolone. Sorry that is hardly a convincing argument. I repeat again what I have said. Creatine is the number 1 supplement around the world. How is that a supplement that "destroys" human body is allowed to go scott-free without any ban? There is a health statutory for smoking, even for caffeine and related stuff and you are telling me that Creatine is very bad for health. On what grounds? Who cares about in the US ? US is the standard of martial arts ? hell they dont even know whats martial arts really. How many Shaolin masters from China are fat ? how many muay thai people are fat ? You CANNOT be fat if you are a practitioner of martial arts. The fat masters are fat because they dont really follow the training/eating pattern anymore. Arre bhai I will give you example of the ones I see. I am not going to make examples out of thin air and all. This has got nothing to do with US/non-USA. My assertion was that Martial arts people can also be very unfit. xxxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CC1981 Posted May 13, 2007 Share Posted May 13, 2007 Re: Milk/ Fitness/ ChickenBreast/Nuts...everything allowed here! On what grounds? I just did on what grounds ! Do you really think that everything that is harmful out there comes in with a FDA warning ? Sorry but that simply isnt true. MSG is deadly, so is Saccharin, yet they do not come with warning labels. My assertion was that Martial arts people can also be very unfit. Only if they give it up and dont do it anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THX_1138 Posted May 13, 2007 Share Posted May 13, 2007 Re: Milk/ Fitness/ ChickenBreast/Nuts...everything allowed here! . Naturally' date=' if they are brought up in those conditions then they would be able to adapt to them.[/quote'] No amount of adaptation would enable you to walk around 20Km per day in raging hot desert sun if you are malnourished. The malnourished westerner doesnt have a higher survival chance than a fully nourished Indian like me in this northern climate they are 'adapted to'. Simple fact : You cannot lead the life of a Khoisan if you are malnourished. It cannot happen. Malnourished khoisan is a dead khoisan very quickly. Do you see that or not ? Well everyone is different CC, your body is different to mine, mine absorbs Creatine without any issue, yours doesnt. False propaganda. As THX and i've said, everytime you take protien, your kidneys go into overdrive processing uric acid from your blood. Taking concentrated form of protien such as creatine leads to kidneys being extremely overworked. You can compensate for this when you are young and in your 20s by drinking a lot of water but to put it simply, your kidneys are 'putting on a lot more miles' due to these protien shakes. When you are 50, your kidneys are not gonna be anywhere as fine (on average) as those of a person who eats normally. Put them in the middle of Juneau, Alaska and they wouldn't last 2 mins. Well doh- they arn't dressed for Alaska and know nothing about survival in snow. Teach them and give them proper snow-gear and they will run rings around you and me 'city-gym fit guys' in Alaska. You claimed they were all more muscle bound than the average westerner, yet they all look like twigs. They are more muscle-bound. Just about everything on them that isnt bone is muscle. Westerners- even your gym-types pack around far more lard than these Khoisan do. So their bodies are fitter- they arnt lugging all this fat around. You acclimatise to the climate you are raised in. I don't consider their walking around to be an indicator of fitness. You have no idea then what it is like to walk 20Km on SAND under 40-45C sun. I've lived in the middle east and i've never seen a cityboy arab (born and raised there) make it up a sand-dune in one dead-run. Walking on sand for 20Km in 40-45C is harder than anything you or I've ever done on a treadmill, that i can safely say. Even if you are a fitness freak guru who runs the local gym by example, you still havnt done anything on your treadmill thats remotely challenging for a Khoisan. You still didn't answer my point regarding their life-expectancy ? They have good life-expectancy when you factor in stuff like they have literally zero access to healthcare and services. A nomadic society doesnt have doctors. So even a particularly bad cut can fester into tetanus and kill you. These people dont have good life-expectancy by our standards ( ie, 65+) because they don't live for very long when old age robs them of their skills of survival..usually croaking by 50 because they fell down a cliff or foot slipped, etc etc. But if you don't mind, i would like to highlight our perception of looks being a big problem in this 'gym fad' mentality - which is not really fitness fitness but more 'feel good, look good, quasi-fitness'. The very fact that an average Khoisan looks distinctly unfit to you but that he/she is capable of feats of physical strength/endurance far far superseeding the average gym goer should indicate how warped the idea of 'gym fitness' is. DUDE!!! CREATINE is a form of anabolic carbohydrate that helps in better metabolism by saturating the muscles with ATP, its is not a protein!!!!! repeat, creatine is not protein. excess diary protein such as whey and casein protein is not half as harmful as excess sugars. and true, stop soiling the name of creatine, easily the magic supplement in responsible hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rajiv Posted May 13, 2007 Share Posted May 13, 2007 Re: Milk/ Fitness/ ChickenBreast/Nuts...everything allowed here! In this part of the world there is a saying. In a queue if you see some of the biggest men/women in the queue' date= rest assured they are Americans. It is a common knowledge Americans are the most non-fit people on earth. BTW it is a general consensus and that doesn't mean you lot from America are obese. LOL, you know why? Coz the order a LARGE Burger, LARGE Fries, and a DIET coke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaurav Posted May 13, 2007 Author Share Posted May 13, 2007 Re: Milk/ Fitness/ ChickenBreast/Nuts...everything allowed here! Funny thing is that diet coke is very bad as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THX_1138 Posted May 13, 2007 Share Posted May 13, 2007 Re: Milk/ Fitness/ ChickenBreast/Nuts...everything allowed here! Funny thing is that diet coke is very bad as well. the artificial sugar... its a carcinogen. its like the ironic frack you... either you drink the sugary stuff and become fat and repulsive, or drink the non sugar thing, contract cancer and become thin and repulsive... choose your poison! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted May 13, 2007 Share Posted May 13, 2007 Re: Milk/ Fitness/ ChickenBreast/Nuts...everything allowed here! I just did on what grounds ! Do you really think that everything that is harmful out there comes in with a FDA warning ? Sorry but that simply isnt true. MSG is deadly, so is Saccharin, yet they do not come with warning labels. It is not about FDA warning at all. Creatine has been used for a long long time. I have known its usage atleast since the past couple of decades, including in India. Long enough time for Medical groups in the world to come out with issues if there was one. Creatine is the most widely used supplement in Industry. It is ridiculous to beleive that there are well-proved health hazards and still everyone uses it. As for MSG I have quite often see the warning labels on eatabls. Generally there is warning along the lines of "Product does contain/does not contain MSG". Only if they give it up and dont do it anymore. I was talking about Martial Arts experts. People who teach Martial Arts as a living. More often than not I have seen people who are great in martial arts but hardly the fittest bloke. xxxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted May 13, 2007 Share Posted May 13, 2007 Re: Milk/ Fitness/ ChickenBreast/Nuts...everything allowed here! Funny thing is that diet coke is very bad as well. Half of the things in the world are bad(if you beleive the conspiracy theorist that is). I have heard Diet Coke being bad but has it been proved yet? When Coke was launched in India there was this tirade that it was bad for health, many Governmental agencies also came up with issues. This was also seen in Europe. Finally after lot of lab tests nothing came out. Remember the famous Aamir Khan ad where he is a Bengali suggesting Coke was bad? Now I hear the same thing about Diet Coke. Makes me wonder why would the agencies sit down and take things lying down when there is a "proven" knowledge that it is bad. Look the point is there arent issues if you are aware. If you know, for example, that drinks like Red Bull has almost 25-50 times more caffein than coffee and still drink it like 3-4 times a day dont come running to me with a sleep disorder. However if you take a Red Bull before workout and do not take caffein anytime later in the day not only would your workout be freaking fantastic you will have no health issues as well. The key is to educate yourself not go around making excuses. xxxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Outsider Posted May 13, 2007 Share Posted May 13, 2007 Re: Milk/ Fitness/ ChickenBreast/Nuts...everything allowed here! Look I never said my source was the best in the business. It was only to suggest Organic food may not be as beneficial as one thinks. If you have better source suggesting indeed Organic food are better feel free to share. I am not sure of this argument though. if the problem is eating harmone injected stuff, then this argument is itself redudant as Organic "meat" is available just as much as Organic Plants are, cattles raised on a Natural diet. So what are we argueing about here? ***** I dont see your point about organic meat and hormones. Organic meat does not have any external injected hormones, is fed organic produce, is not genetically modified, and is free range. The average meat on the other hand is obtained from caged up animals injected with hormones to result in faster growth and fed pesticide laden food and are also genetically altered. The choice is pretty clear to me. BTW, about research on organic food here is something which might interest you: Many EPA-approved pesticides were registered long before extensive research linked these chemicals to cancer and other diseases. Now, the EPA considers 60% of all herbicides (weed killers), 90% of all fungicides (mold killers), and 30% of all insecticides (insect killers) as potentially cancer causing. Organic farming keeps harmful chemicals and pesticides out of the food we eat and beverages we drink. It also prohibits the use of antibiotics in animal feed, which are routinely used in conventional farming and is known to create dangerous antibiotic-resistant pathogens. Organic farms also benefit the farm workers who have high exposure to chemicals and synthetic pesticides. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holysmoke Posted May 13, 2007 Share Posted May 13, 2007 Re: Milk/ Fitness/ ChickenBreast/Nuts...everything allowed here! More often than not I have seen people who are great in martial arts but hardly the fittest bloke. xxxx me :eew: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted May 13, 2007 Share Posted May 13, 2007 Re: Milk/ Fitness/ ChickenBreast/Nuts...everything allowed here! I dont see your point about organic meat and hormones. Organic meat does not have any external injected hormones, is fed organic produce, is not genetically modified, and is free range. The average meat on the other hand is obtained from caged up animals injected with hormones to result in faster growth and fed pesticide laden food and are also genetically altered. The choice is pretty clear to me. Part of the way this discussion evolved Shwetabh is that one shouldnt eat meat because the chicken/cattle etc are fed harmones and stuff and hence it creates health problems for the consumer. My argument was personally speaking it doesnt matter to me, but for those who think it is a serious health hazard go for the Organic "meat" that is like you mentioned poultry raised on natural diet and stuff. Point is harmone scare should not be a reason for people when it comes to meat consumption. Now of course if you have a religious or philosphical reason thats an altogether different story. xxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holysmoke Posted May 13, 2007 Share Posted May 13, 2007 Re: Milk/ Fitness/ ChickenBreast/Nuts...everything allowed here! Red Bull has almost 25-50 times more caffein than coffee xxxx No. The caffeine in one can of Red Bull equals that of one cup of filtered coffee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holysmoke Posted May 13, 2007 Share Posted May 13, 2007 Re: Milk/ Fitness/ ChickenBreast/Nuts...everything allowed here! In this part of the world there is a saying. In a queue if you see some of the biggest men/women in the queue' date= rest assured they are Americans. It is a common knowledge Americans are the most non-fit people on earth. BTW it is a general consensus and that doesn't mean you lot from America are obese. LOL, you know why? Coz the order a LARGE Burger, LARGE Fries, and a DIET cokeI dont see anything wrong with that.. A person wants to have a burger, wants to have fries. Instead of ADDING calories by having coke, he has diet coke to reduce his calorie intake, as he knows that he's eating shit already by having a large burger and fries, he doesnt need sugar on top of that..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Outsider Posted May 13, 2007 Share Posted May 13, 2007 Re: Milk/ Fitness/ ChickenBreast/Nuts...everything allowed here! Point is harmone scare should not be a reason for people when it comes to meat consumption. Now of course if you have a religious or philosphical reason thats an altogether different story. Here is something on the effect of external hormones in meat: More than a decade ago, Roy Hertz, then director of endocrinology at the National Cancer Institute and a leading authority on hormonal cancers, warned of the carcinogenic risks of estrogenic additives which can cause imbalances and increases in natural hormone levels. Hertz warned against the uncontrolled use of these potent carcinogens. No dietary levels of hormones are safe and a dime-sized piece of meat contains-billions of millions of molecules. Breast cancer has been raised as a primary concern in light of associations between breast cancer and oral contraceptives, whose estrogen dosage is known and controlled. The risk of breast and other cancers only increases with the uncontrolled use of hormones in meat. Dont know why it shouldn't be scary. :shrug: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted May 13, 2007 Share Posted May 13, 2007 Re: Milk/ Fitness/ ChickenBreast/Nuts...everything allowed here! ^^ Fair enough Shwetabh. So dont eat "average" meat then. But let it not become an excuse to consume meat altogether. Just like you want to eat Organic veggies to avoid Fertlizer reared plants, similarly go for the Organic Poultry if you wanted to. xxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted May 13, 2007 Share Posted May 13, 2007 Re: Milk/ Fitness/ ChickenBreast/Nuts...everything allowed here! I dont see anything wrong with that.. A person wants to have a burger' date=' wants to have fries. Instead of ADDING calories by having coke, he has diet coke to reduce his calorie intake, as he knows that he's eating **** already by having a large burger and fries, he doesnt need sugar on top of that.....[/quote'] Holy. Yes it does cut extra calories due to sugar but it is like taking away a small fraction from overall. Just to put some numbers, a large Burger shall say be about 750 calories(with mayonaise, cheese and the good stuff), the large french fries would be about 450 cals or so. So about 1200 in total, now if you take a large drink(16 oz) it would be about 250 calories. In other words you worry about 250 cals when you are consuming 1200 in the first place. Sure in principal it is good to avoid extra calories but in larger scheme of things it is the lowest calorie generator on your meal menu. xxx PS: I havent forgotten about making a routine. Will do that today. Should i put it here or should I PM you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holysmoke Posted May 13, 2007 Share Posted May 13, 2007 Re: Milk/ Fitness/ ChickenBreast/Nuts...everything allowed here! I agree, its the smallest calorie generator. But consuming 1200 instead of 1500 is better isnt it?. I dont mind if you put up the routine here.. thanks a lot :wtg: Btw, uve seen my pic right. Now figure this. I have low blood sugar, and low cholestrol :shrug: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Outsider Posted May 13, 2007 Share Posted May 13, 2007 Re: Milk/ Fitness/ ChickenBreast/Nuts...everything allowed here! ^^ Fair enough Shwetabh. So dont eat "average" meat then. But let it not become an excuse to consume meat altogether. Just like you want to eat Organic veggies to avoid Fertlizer reared plants, similarly go for the Organic Poultry if you wanted to. ***** I am a meat eater, Lurker and do consume organic at home. Ofcourse, when I eat out I dont have a choice. But on the other hand I also recognize that a vegetarian diet can also provide whatever a meat diet does with some supplements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted May 14, 2007 Share Posted May 14, 2007 Re: Milk/ Fitness/ ChickenBreast/Nuts...everything allowed here! Alright Holy. Here is my routine for you. I thought for some time and decided that instead of going with just eating routine I will go ahead and give you a little bit of overall lifestyle thing. Good health is not just food(or exercise) but a combination of them plus good rest so with that here is my routine. I have made a few assumptions and I will mention them whereever I use them. Also feel free to get back to me in you would want changes. 1) Your desired Calorie intake: Your height is 5ft 8. I will take off an inch since guys always add an inch hehehe. Say 5ft 7. For that height your desired weight should be about 150-160 pounds. That would mean you should take about 1600-1700 calories a day. This would be less than what you are having now. Combined with some exercise this will ensure your metabolism goes up and you lose weight/ 2) Your desired workout: For first two weeks I would want you to do cardio, and cardio only. No lifting weights etc. I want your heart to get ready for the pounding that is coming your way later on. For first two weeks you will get up early(about say 5-5:30 am), have a glass of water(with lemon if you like) and go for either a mile or two run. If you have access to a gym I want you to run on treadmill for 30 minutes. Start with 10 minutes and go to 30 minutes. Even if you dont very fast its fine, we are intersted in jogging and not sprinting. The idea is to burn calories early in the morning on an empty stomach so your body burns stored energy(fat). 3) Your desired rest: You should be taking in anything between 7-8 hours of sleep. Since you intend to get up at 5-5:30 am this means you should be tucked in bed snoring around 10-10:30 pm. The earlier the better. If you are a late nighter its time to call quits. No more tv watching. Get in bed by 10. 4) Your desired food: Your desired calories would be 1600-1700. You will take more of protein but you will increase it slowly over a period of time. We will try to get as much natural food as we can. Here is a sample menu: Breakfast(7:30-8 am): Egg whites(throw away the yellow. Start with 3 egg whites and go to 6 egg whites. If you eat 3 egg-whites eating 1 yellow is fine. ) Cup of oatmeal(with low-fat milk) or 2 slices of wheat bread(have a zero fat cheese in between them for taste). Late morning snack(around 10:30 am): Cup of yoplait(yogurt in a cup..you should be able to get 1 for 50 cents in local grocery). Afternoon meal (1 pm): 6 inch Grilled Chicken Sandwitch on Wheat Bread with no cheese or sauce(if you go some place else go for Grilled Chicken Sandwitch with no cheese) Twice a week you can have a meal with Subway, that is a small potato chips bag. Late evening meal(4 pm): Cup of yogurt Evening meal(7 pm) Cup of brown rice with vegetable or chicken curry. (You can also have the other half of footlong chicken sandwitch of Subway) Just before bed(10 pm) A glass of low-fat milk. This should provide your body with enough nutrients. The more disciplined you are the more it will work for you. Also the more you get up and run the more your fat will cut down as well as your metabolism will go up. The latter will make you hungry and we shall add more proteins to quench that hunger whereby you will start building muscle. Supplement: For now lets start with just a Multivitamin. You should be able to get them in Wal-Mart or Walgreens. Things to avoid: 1) Fatty stuff(chips etc etc) 2) Nuts 3) Natural milk 4) White bread 5) Regular Soda(Diet Soda is fine, you can also go for Caffein free Diet Soda) 6) Fruits.(Dont push out fruits altogether but instead have them early in the day. You can have it in breakfast or mid-morning meal) Things to do: 1) Eat timely and dont skip meals. 2) Have smaller portions of food every 3-4 hours 3) if you use oil to cook switch either to spray or use olive oil..that too sparingly. 4) Try to get good amount of sleep everyday(7-8 hrs is optimum) 5) Make sure you do not miss out on that early morning 30 minutes jog. if you have problems doing it at start, try brisk walking but go 30 minutes. Good luck :wtg: xxxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rajiv Posted May 14, 2007 Share Posted May 14, 2007 Re: Milk/ Fitness/ ChickenBreast/Nuts...everything allowed here! Lurks I take apple cider vinegar with water before meals everyday, how does that work in your diet. I read about it a lot and it's not only at burner but has tons of goodies ..and my regular diet contains a fresh juice of (carrots, beets, celery, apple, cabbage with honey) with Centrum Protegra My meals are light anyways but my problem is I have hypothyroid and weight loss is very difficult If I hit the gym , I will quite day one as my body won't be able to take it..where do I start I weigh 98 kilos and height is 5"7.6" I am not fat overall just have a beer belly P.S High Cholestrol, I haven;t checked since some time now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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