King Tendulkar Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 Who is defending status quo here again ? I asked you not to accuse my motherland of state sponsored genocide/massacres without clear and categoric evidence. Please, have some shame and either at the very least take some time and effort to provide such evidence in some meaningful way or stop calling yourself an indian. Please. You may be angry or personally affected by this (i highly doubt that) or just using it for a whole gamut of agendas. I dont care. But understand the difference between actually carrying out a justice system that actually proves the guilt of the criminal decisively and just finding some 'balee ka bakraas' just to satisfy the whole 'blood must pay for blood' bloodlust. Otherwise what you are basically saying here is, if someone names me guilty for rape/murder of a Punjabi woman/people etc. and i happen to be anywhere between 45+ today, i am guilty because someone said i was there, doing it to some innocent people 30 years ago. Surely, you want to live in a society that cares a wee bit more about the rights of the accused than that ? Or are you all about finding someone guilty, you dont care who, so long as a sufficient number of people die to pay for their ill-proven crimes ? Smoke screens. Thousans killed and 30 years later no justice. Yet you defend it, mistakenly thinking that makes you patriotic. When in fact defending the killing of your own country men by the states institutions is as unpatritioc as you can get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muloghonto Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 Smoke screens. Thousans killed and 30 years later no justice. Yet you defend it, mistakenly thinking that makes you patriotic. When in fact defending the killing of your own country men by the states institutions is as unpatritioc as you can get. Find me where i defended the fact that these people have no justice. I am not defending the killing of my own countrymen by state institutions. I am merely asking that you present evidence before saying such serious allegations. Are you even a real Indian or a parosi, seriously ? How can you go around accusing govt. of India of commiting state sponsored terrorism,mass murder,etc. and not show a shred of evidence ? And when i ask you to present evidence that my country is guilty, you say i am defending the death of innocents ?! What kind of bhadwe bakwaas logic is that ? Again, nobody is defending anything. Just Asking for EVIDENCE THAT GOVT. OF INDIA is guilty of mass murder. If you cannot provide evidence, i have no time for such serious charges being talked about on zero factual basis. So far what we have evidenec for, is a whole bunch of people died. Allegations of powerful people involved. That sounds like just about any crime-big or small, so how dare you accuse my nation of such crimes and not have decency to atleast provide evidence ? Incase you are ignorant on the criterias required to call a nation a state sponsor of mass murder, look it up. it is pretty stringent. You cannot accuse the state apparatus without proving a concerted effort from the state to perpetrate the act. Subversion of state apparatus by individuals is called corruption. Not a genocidal or mass murdering state. And you still call yourself an Indian. Shameful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raghav_12 Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 well one question to SachinLara, who/what is state? I precisely understand what you are trying to convey here. But we need to understand whom or what you define as state. If Police has orders to stand there without making an attempt to stop brutal killings, then won't you take that as the complicity of police and hence complicity of state. When system has a job to protect citizens and if it doesn't do that deliberately, than it amounts to complicity of system, in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Tendulkar Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 well one question to SachinLara' date=' who/what is state? I precisely understand what you are trying to convey here. But we need to understand whom or what you define as state. If Police has orders to stand there without making an attempt to stop brutal killings, then won't you take that as the complicity of police and hence complicity of state. When system has a job to protect citizens and if it doesn't do that deliberately, than it amounts to complicity of system, in my opinion.[/quote'] Well if the leader of the country at the time i.e ruling familes Rajiv Ghandhi, was complicit in this, does that qualify as the state? Plus leading senior leaders in govt, senior police etc etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muloghonto Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 well one question to SachinLara' date=' who/what is state? I precisely understand what you are trying to convey here. But we need to understand whom or what you define as state. If Police has orders to stand there without making an attempt to stop brutal killings, then won't you take that as the complicity of police and hence complicity of state. When system has a job to protect citizens and if it doesn't do that deliberately, than it amounts to complicity of system, in my opinion.[/quote'] Not when the stand down order to the police comes from a powerfully located politician affiliated with the police and the crime, with no evidence of it ever being coordinated as a matter of policy by the government in general. What i am talking about, is what you are talking about and that amounts to subverstion of state institution for individual (or group) gain, It is not the state that is guilty! Guilt of the state equates guilt of the government. You need a concerted policy or execution of a super-secret plan for it to be justifiably accusatory towards the state. A random bad guy using his level best to stay alive and do bad things by exploiting state mechinery, is simply another sad but regrettable aspect of corruption. Does not make India Nazi Germany or any such mass killing governments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muloghonto Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 Well if the leader of the country at the time i.e ruling familes Rajiv Ghandhi' date=' was complicit in this, does that qualify as the state? Plus leading senior leaders in govt, senior police etc etc[/quote'] Obviously. Now if only you could prove it. :haha: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Tendulkar Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 Find me where i defended the fact that these people have no justice. I am not defending the killing of my own countrymen by state institutions. I am merely asking that you present evidence before saying such serious allegations. Are you even a real Indian or a parosi, seriously ? How can you go around accusing govt. of India of commiting state sponsored terrorism,mass murder,etc. and not show a shred of evidence ? And when i ask you to present evidence that my country is guilty, you say i am defending the death of innocents ?! What kind of bhadwe bakwaas logic is that ? Again, nobody is defending anything. Just Asking for EVIDENCE THAT GOVT. OF INDIA is guilty of mass murder. If you cannot provide evidence, i have no time for such serious charges being talked about on zero factual basis. So far what we have evidenec for, is a whole bunch of people died. Allegations of powerful people involved. That sounds like just about any crime-big or small, so how dare you accuse my nation of such crimes and not have decency to atleast provide evidence ? Incase you are ignorant on the criterias required to call a nation a state sponsor of mass murder, look it up. it is pretty stringent. You cannot accuse the state apparatus without proving a concerted effort from the state to perpetrate the act. Subversion of state apparatus by individuals is called corruption. Not a genocidal or mass murdering state. And you still call yourself an Indian. Shameful. yes innocent until proven guilty Just like in Bofors, Bhopal, Gujurat riots, 2G Scam, Coal scam, etc etc All innocent clean chit. Where is proof? None. Jai Hind p.s you are acting like a paki in defending ridiculous things in mistaken belief you are being patriotic by doing this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Tendulkar Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 Obviously. Now if only you could prove it. :haha: Of course I cant prove it. Who can? Only the police and istitiutuons who investigate such matters can. But wait they are corrupted and are run by same accused. So guess what govt gets clean chit Jai Hind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muloghonto Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 yes innocent until proven guilty Just like in Bofors, Bhopal, Gujurat riots, 2G Scam, Coal scam, etc etc All innocent clean chit. Where is proof? None. Jai Hind p.s you are acting like a paki in defending ridiculous things in mistaken belief you are being patriotic by doing this. I AM DEFENDING NOTHING. I AM JUST ASKING FOR EVIDENCE BEFORE YOU CAN DEFAME MY MOTHERLAND. You are again, making tall claims with zero evidence. Because you are a lazy dimwit who likes to shoot off his mouth but cannot provide evidence. What else could there be ? Oh- that you are not a lazy dimwit who is sullying the name of his nation but is actually a paki, who is making heinous claims and providing no evidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muloghonto Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 Of course I cant prove it. Who can? Only the police and istitiutuons who investigate such matters can. But wait they are corrupted and are run by same accused. So guess what govt gets clean chit Jai Hind If you have no proof, then you are basically just operating on the basis of beleif. Sorry, i do not share your beleif. End of story then, because your beleif is not a fact. If you cant prove it is a fact, then yuo dont know for sure that it is a fact, therefore stop talking about it as if its a fact! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Tendulkar Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 I AM DEFENDING NOTHING. I AM JUST ASKING FOR EVIDENCE BEFORE YOU CAN DEFAME MY MOTHERLAND. You are again, making tall claims with zero evidence. Because you are a lazy dimwit who likes to shoot off his mouth but cannot provide evidence. What else could there be ? Oh- that you are not a lazy dimwit who is sullying the name of his nation but is actually a paki, who is making heinous claims and providing no evidence. Well wether you like it or not its my mother land as well. Maybe this is root of problem, not able to accept ALL in your mother land? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muloghonto Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 Well wether you like it or not its my mother land as well. Maybe this is root of problem' date=' not able to accept ALL in your mother land?[/quote'] If it is your motherland, then i would expect a little bit of decency from you and not peddle your beleifs as facts. You have no evidence. Ergo, you have no real facts to conclude and believe such a heinous idea against our government. You may be the BJP type who think accusing Indian govt. of genocide and hitler-like behaviour to make it a congress vs bjp issue but i am definitely not going to support such nefarious claims without any evidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Tendulkar Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 If you have no proof' date=' then you are basically just operating on the basis of beleif. Sorry, i do not share your beleif. End of story then, because your beleif is not a fact.[/quote'] Please explain how thousands in one community were targeted and killed over a number of days in CAPITAL city, prisoners released to kill, petrol giving to people by police and politians to people to kill, electoral registers taken out to find and target sikhs. How can this be done over a number of days without state complicity? Keep burying your head in sand about this. And claiming you are some super patriotic Indian because you are willing to go to any depths to defend 84 Congress govt led by Rajiv Ghandhi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Tendulkar Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 If it is your motherland, then i would expect a little bit of decency from you and not peddle your beleifs as facts. You have no evidence. Ergo, you have no real facts to conclude and believe such a heinous idea against our government. You may be the BJP type who think accusing Indian govt. of genocide and hitler-like behaviour to make it a congress vs bjp issue but i am definitely not going to support such nefarious claims without any evidence. Yes you are great patriot cos you defend 84 massacres and defend Congress 84 govt. Our govt he says, as if being patriot means defending your govt at all costs, even if these crimes are done against its own people:hysterical: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Tendulkar Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 According to sachinlara Bofors innocent 2G innocent Coal scam innocent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Tendulkar Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 If it is your motherland, then i would expect a little bit of decency from you and not peddle your beleifs as facts. You have no evidence. Ergo, you have no real facts to conclude and believe such a heinous idea against our government. You may be the BJP type who think accusing Indian govt. of genocide and hitler-like behaviour to make it a congress vs bjp issue but i am definitely not going to support such nefarious claims without any evidence. Now it all makes sense!!! We have a congress die hard, who does not want The Ghandhi family to be tainted. Particular when we have Modi rising and being opposition to Congress. He wants to slam Modi for Gujurat riots but does not want his precious congress marked with same slur. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muloghonto Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 Please explain how thousands in one community were targeted and killed over a number of days in CAPITAL city' date=' prisoners released to kill, petrol giving to people by police and politians to people to kill, electoral registers taken out to find and target sikhs. How can this be done over a number of days without state complicity? [/quote'] Quite easily. its called a very systematic corrupt system where individuals can move aruond freely amd bribe people around to get away scot free. Works when the system is corrupt and forensics is not a solid benchmark. Such riots have happened many times in the past because the govt. lost control and then failed to bring people to justice. Happened during British Raj too. Not because govt. was complicit, but because govt. failed its task. No because i am going to need solid evidence to believe that national government of India is complicit in mass murder. I knew to you it is a good ol political mudslinging, but to us, less political Indians, we care a bit more about our national government to not throw around mud on congressi-BJP lines on something as heinous as mass murder. As i said, you make me ashamed to call myself an Indian. An Indian like you who exists, who can go around accusing my nation of state sponsored mass murder, out of a simple beleif and no evidence and scoring political points out of it. Thourhoughly ashamed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muloghonto Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 Now it all makes sense!!! We have a congress die hard' date= who does not want The Ghandhi family to be tainted. Particular when we have Modi rising and being opposition to Congress. He wants to slam Modi for Gujurat riots but does not want his precious congress marked with same slur. It is not about congress or BJP you idiot. It is about the national government of India. It is bigger than congress or BJP and you are not a real Indian if you are going to sully my nation's name with zero evidence to score political points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Tendulkar Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 You are not a patrioctic Indian. You are die hard congres fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Tendulkar Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 It is not about congress or BJP you idiot. It is about the national government of India. It is bigger than congress or BJP and you are not a real Indian if you are going to sully my nation's name with zero evidence to score political points. Its my nation as well chump. Also seeking justice for indians is actually patrioctic. What you are doing is unpatriotic in your desperate attempts to defend your beloved congress over the people of india Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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