Indo-Israel :: A Strategic Relationship

[Lurker]

btw....There were some news in past that Israel offerred India direct help in eliminating Pakitsan's nuclear facilities, much before the rogue smugglers tested the nukes.... But as usual our ball less leaders, wasted that golden opportunity.

And there is a proven theory that Israelis were certainly linked one-way or the other with the way Indian Peace Keeping Forces were slaughtered by LTTE in Sri Lanka. There is provent fact that LTTE cadres were trained by Mossads. Interesting since we lost one of our most visionary ex-PM to LTTE. There is also the proven theory that days before Indira Gandhi was murdered it was NOT Mossad or CIA or any wuch Western country(whose chaploosi most Indians do today) who had given India a heads up but Yasser Arafat of PLO. I beleive it was Shayama Kumar who had confirmed it(take it for whatever its worth, I have no links to backup it up). Yasser Arafat had been able to catch the rumour that Indira Gandhi was to be assassinated, Indian Security was made aware of it, Indira Gandhi even went on to make that now famous speech, "Mere khoon ka ek ek katra" and was felled within 48 hours of it. xxxx

[sandtest]

Kshama maang kar diya wats. Abhi khsmadaan de diya hoon issiliye wont rebuke you but next time stop such nonsensical patriotic brouhaha. It is amply clear that either you have no clue about Indo-Israel trade(or else you would have atleast made an effort to prove my diamond trade critique wrong) or you just dont find it hard to accept that I may actually be right.

I told -- Mera apse matbhed hai -- meaning I agree to disagree with you. Because for you defense and security assistance is "smoke screen", obviously people purposefully try to ignore importance of defense deals instead of going in detail.

While diamonds constituted about 65% of India's exports to Israel, the other major products were textiles ($ 80 million), chemicals ($ 46 million), rubber and plastic products ($23 million), machinery ($ 15 million) and base metals ($ 14 million). Areas of significant growth in India's exports were prepared foodstuffs (173%), rubber and plastics (145%), diamonds (88%), machinery (85%), transport equipment (78%) and chemicals (32%) .

Even those figures are encouraging.....anyway, I won't give a rats musharraf, if our trade in traditional items is not as big as ours with US because how big Israel is anyway. My main point is defense related co-operation and at present Israel is the SECOND largest supplier of defense equipments for India after russia and that's all. Anyway for you defense is "smoke-screen" so any furrther arguement is useless.

As for your kaafir rhetoric and all that, well why should I even bother wasting my time on that?

As expected from self-apologists....given that we have been invaded so many times and it's not long forgotten history when Chincommies occupied our land near eastern borders. Paki invasion in Kargil not withstanding. But anyway defense of nation and it's border is a smoke screen for some....so no complaints here.

[Lurker]

I told -- Mera apse matbhed hai -- meaning I agree to disagree with you. Because for you defense and security assistance is "smoke screen", obviously people purposefully try to ignore importance of defense deals instead of going in detail.

It is a smoke-screen. I have given you hard numbers. 65% of Indian export is diamonds, over 65% of Indian imports is diamonds. You are free to disagree but dont try to show a moral highground here when you can simply not back up what you are insinuating. Atleast I have given you numbers, what have you given me thus far? Rhetorics galore eh?

As expected from self-apologists....given that we have been invaded so many times and it's not long forgotten history when Chincommies occupied our land near eastern borders. Paki invasion in Kargil not withstanding.

You have lost it now havent you? :haha::haha: China invasion linked with Kaafir-stan now?? :haha::haha: Chalo boss abhi you go to sleep, kahe khaali peeli time waster kar rahe ho der raat gaye. Inshallah kal subah aapko kuch akal aa jaaye aur shayad aapki baaton mein kuch wajan ho jaaye hai na? Tab tak aap mashallah aaram farmaayein..Sabba khair! xxx

[sandtest]

And there is a proven theory that Israelis were certainly linked one-way or the other with the way Indian Peace Keeping Forces were slaughtered by LTTE in Sri Lanka. There is provent fact that LTTE cadres were trained by Mossads. Interesting since we lost one of our most visionary ex-PM to LTTE.

That's some twisted fact. In fact Israelis were involved on the behest of US, so to pre-empt the potential US involvement later. In those days, there was not much co-operation between us and Israel, but of course leftist will use this as excuse. If further seen, the Israelis ONLY interest was search of a "friendly" government for their arms service and supply. So for them it was purely commercial reason. Putting the same circumstnces in todays conditions, they will not get involved because everybody is knocking on Israel's door for defense equipment. This was not the case then, the Israeli weapons industry was a little more in embryonic stage during that time.

[sandtest]

:haha::cantstop::haha: Shabba khair !! That will get the hinduvta's goat ! :haha::haha:

One more reason, why I am happy to ignore you.

[sandtest]

It is a smoke-screen. I have given you hard numbers. 65% of Indian export is diamonds, over 65% of Indian imports is diamonds. You are free to disagree but dont try to show a moral highground here when you can simply not back up what you are insinuating. Atleast I have given you numbers, what have you given me thus far? Rhetorics galore eh?

I have given you HARD fact that when India's ENTIRE defense budget itself is merely 2.5 % of GDP, how you can compare it with commercial trade. How you can expect MoD to trade more than allotted budget...within the budget we get in defense Israel is SECOND largest supplier in a short period after Russia. is that not a hard fact ---- obviously you will conveniently avoid this and instead harp about diamond, heera-panna, moti. kohineer and what not to satisfy your apologist fetish.

Chalo boss abhi you go to sleep, kahe khaali peeli time waster kar rahe ho der raat gaye. Inshallah kal subah aapko kuch akal aa jaaye aur shayad aapki baaton mein kuch wajan ho jaaye hai na? Tab tak aap mashallah aaram farmaayein..Sabba khair!

Haan yeah samay ki barbaadi hee hai.....aap defense budget ko total commercial trade se compare kertey rehengey....aur Raat beet jayegi.:hysterical: Shubh Ratri. Ishwar apko sadbudhhi de, aur desh ke bhalai ke baare mein sochney ki oor prerit keren. :D

[Lurker]

In fact Israelis were involved on the behest of US, so to pre-empt the potential US involvement later.

And here Sir lies the difference between right wing Hindu fanatics(you in this case) and free-thinkers(like me or CC in this thread). To us country comes first, to you anyone who seems like an ally(not even an ally mind you in true sense) is worth holding onto. Thus far you have tagged on defending Israel and now even USA. Basically you are telling me Sir that Israelis were justified in doing the training, the training which ended up costing lives of Indian soldiers and an Indian PM. Now what was that you keep harping on about? Ah yes Indian defence...Sounds very hollow right now doesnt it?

In those days, there was not much co-operation between us and Israel, but of course leftist will use this as excuse.

Who exactly are these leftists you keep talking about? Come on man if you have to show disrespect atleast develop some logic first!! You somehow make it sound that half of the Indians are leftists, every single University is controlled by leftists, every ills of Indian politics is owed to leftists, when the easy fact is the leftists barely control 10% of India!(or Indian votes). You sure you dont know the difference between a free-thinker and a leftist? Pyaar se poochein main samjha doonga.

Putting the same circumstnces in todays conditions, they will not get involved because everybody is knocking on Israel's door for defense equipment. This was not the case then, the Israeli weapons industry was a little more in embryonic stage during that time.

Basically if we go by right wing Hindu fanatics like you we shall be relegated to a country who always go to its master with a begging bowl, be it US or Israel. Reality check ST, its a world of paisa phenk tamasha dekh. We have paisa, US is dying to get in bed with us, by all accounts we are improving everyday so what is this obsession to prostrate yourself infront of any other country? Why doesnt it surprise me that Hindu fanatic will use this tutelage - "Everyone is knocking on Israeli door...lets go for it". Man you peeps seriosly need to develop some back bone, if not ball$. Have some respect for your country if not yourself. xxxx

[Lurker]

I have given you HARD fact that when India's ENTIRE defense budget itself is merely 2.5 % of GDP, how you can compare it with commercial trade.

lol...Is that your best shot? Cos it makes you look like stupid ST, sorry to say. India's 2.5% defence GDP still comes to about 20 billion USD(804 billion USD in 2006). Since Indo-Israel trade is about 2 billion USD in 2004, of which 65% plus is diamonds it means 1.3 billion USD was in diamonds, leaving about 700 million USD for everything under the sun...Even if 50% of the whole deal was defence(which it was not) it would be 350 million dollars Yes please check that number again, 350 million dollars. A littttttttttttle blip on Indian radar. :haha:

is that not a hard fact ---- obviously you will conveniently avoid this and instead harp about diamond, heera-panna, moti. kohineer and what not to satisfy your apologist fetish.

Please repeat with me - Indo/Israel diamond trade exceeds Indo-Israeli defence by 10:1 if not more. Go ahead you may see the light some day.

Haan yeah samay ki barbaadi hee hai.....aap defense budget ko total commercial trade se compare kertey rehengey....aur Raat beet jayegi.

Hum Allahtaala se yeh dua karenge ke aapko itni samajh aa jaaye ke hamesha darte na rahein sab se. Yeh baat pata hai na ke those who live by sword die by it. Bas aisa hi hota hai bhagwa logon ke saath. Issiliye aapko aadat par gayi hai dar ke jeene ki. Main Allahtaala se gujaarish karoonga ke aapka yeh khauf dil se nikaala de..Aamen..Summ-aamen. Sabba khair. xxx

[Lurker]

Their 'balls and backbone' doesnt extend much beyond whining about parts of Indian history (and yet contributing nothing concerete to address it) and destroying the occasional muslim mosque/killing the occasional muslim bunch.

The part of Indian history that is concentrated upon by such right wingers is selective. As you have rightly pointed out - towards Muslim actions. Only a couple of days back there was this article in Guardian where it was disclosed how Indian soldiers were used as Guinea Pigs for Mustard Gas testing before World War II by British. Rest assured you shall never hear such issues raised, but a stupid fatwa raised in some area which most Indians dont give a damn about shall make it right here. xxx

[Guest dada_rocks]

Typical twisting of facts. Most of the countries who accepted Israel were ALL either part of NATO/American-British alliance or inherited the recognition deal with Israel that britain/France signed for them. So France/Britain signs recognition of Israel and then two dozen nations each become independent by 1948, inheriting the deal the colonialists made for them. Whopee ding. And let the demonspawn loose into your system. What an awesome idea. But the again, you are the blatant liar who twists facts when it goes against your beloved Israelis butchering palestinians- you even deny terrorism from them when their own president openly gloated from the white house lawns about terrorist attacks he planned and executed. You have zero credibility in this issue.

ponga 52 states out of 59 ,, i will break ti down further for ur dope-effected mind.. this means 88% of the countries accorded Israel recognition.. last time I checked this is overwhelming support.. rest of the garbage is ponga-stuff so will let u enjoy that alone

[Guest dada_rocks]

Where does China fall into equation? Or India?? Either you conceive both Indo-China as Muslim nation of USSR block countries I would be interested in knowing your answer. By the way you mentined which countries voted against Israel, but the link shows anything but that. Could you give specifics on who voted for and against Israel? Have you checked this website at all? This is a pro-Israeli website whose very first line about Israel goes thus "Israel's enemies would like to portray Israel as a recent contaminant" http://www.palestinefacts.org/pf_faq_palestine_other_countries.php Look around and you will see everything from Why do Christian Zionists support Israel to Why was Gandhi against Zionists. Not to say that the author goes on to show why Gandhi was misled, how Muslims misled him and how Jews were right all along. Go ahead and take a look. xxxx

communist lobby that's where india/china falls.. and accept it u were lyign blatnalty when claimign not many states recognised israel fact is 88% of states did .... Gandhi was against israel for the same reason as today's psec politicains are.. heck at that time he had to appease 33% of muslim population as opposed to today's politicos.... gandhi also supported khilfata totally conveneint politcis had nothing to do with any sort of prinicipled stand.. fact is: most of the states which were not encumbered by leftist/islimst ideology accepted israel, Nehru chose not to most probably he had no other option but to take brief from ussr.... I am fine with that line of thinking but to spin it as some sort of pirnicpled stand is utter bogus

[Guest dada_rocks]

And open up India for Jewish invasion. Protecting our own interest would mean having a very good idea of the nature of the beast we are dealing with. Which is why ideological fetishes of the hinduvta, hiding Israeli dark episodes in history and their barbarity is doing a disservice to India and its people. It is your warped ideological hatred of the muslims that leads you guys to such stunning lies and smokescreen- such as Israel didnt commit war crimes, terrorism & genocides despite their leaders OPENLY admitting and gloating about it. The hinduvta types are the ones who pose a real danger- for anyone who is willing to hide/deny israel's terrorism is simply speaking, hiding the truth in this matter.

Jewish invasion of india , sounds like dope overdose to me,, ..:hysterical:

[Guest dada_rocks]

Idiot, it is called 'inheriting the deals your master made for you'. England signs for recogition of israel = automatically everyone else signs. India had the balls to PULL OUT of such nonsense- most other English/French colonies did not. But a liar like you has no understanding of that.

Dope-head y same thign can be said about leftist/islimist countries their master ussr didn;t sign hence they follwoed suit.. point remains 88% ratified it .. but u jew-hater dope-head won't get it anyway.. so continue now I have done my job

[Lurker]

communist lobby that's where india/china falls..

Hahahaha..India as a Communist lobby Country...Even your right winger friends will find it hard to support you on that! Atleast you were consistent on China.

Gandhi was against israel for the same reason as today's psec politicains are.. heck at that time he had to appease 33% of muslim population as opposed to today's politicos.... gandhi also supported khilfata totally conveneint politcis had nothing to do with any sort of prinicipled stand..

Goes to show right wing Hindu fanatics are essentially the same.(please check my response to ST). At the end of the day you would prostrate infront of your new master, Israel and be more than happy to throw dirt on the Father of Nation. Incidentally do you beleive Gandhi as Father of Nation DR?

fact is: most of the states which were not encumbered by leftist/islimst ideology accepted israel, Nehru chose not to most probably he had no other option but to take brief from ussr.... I am fine with that line of thinking but to spin it as some sort of pirnicpled stand is utter bogus

In other words countries like US/UK had a principled stand as they accepted Israel, even though history will show Israel-Palestine issue as a problem due to them. Man you are truly cluless, arent you? xxx

[Lurker]

88% of an organization encompassing 50% of the nations recognised Israel.

Who are these 88% nations you keep talking about DR? The website you quoted from is a pro-Israeli website. I would be interested in getting some Independent numbers, giving me the list of names of these countries who voted. xxx

[Guest dada_rocks]

You must be living in some lala land here. 1) Israel's investment in India in terms of education is hilarious. For one Israel is a country that is heavily dependent on US loans. Take away USA's loan to Israel and see what happens to the country. 2) Israel's opening of Jew/Hebrew studies in India shall generate job creation??? :haha: How many jobs are we talking of here? 5-10? 20 tops? Do you seriously see it go beyond 20??? 3) What is this hurry to learn Hebrew and that part of the world?? Why not learn Bengali? Afterall it is a language that is "neighbouring" to most Biharis. It is a language that has perhaps given us the best literature in India. It is a language that has generated great music. And of course it is a language that will help you understand the very people you castigate everyday - leftists? Why not try to make an effort to learn Bangla first DR? xxx

Honestly u have no clue about israel's economic strength.. just do a simple comparison of usa aid and their GDP u will see the light..... high tech industry's life-line is israel .... same with agrilcutlural innovation.. They have brought green revolution to desert ( incidentally india has woken up late and delgates after delgates keep visiting israel these days to learn ropes on thsi issue).. their achievement is too big to fit in here.. will start another thread.. now let me ask you one thing what does india have to lose if israel starts some hebrew/jewish chair in some university........... find me just one negative given we won;t be putting even a dime in that project so .... u might laugh at number 20 but it still is better than zero at zero cost to tax-payers money again hebrew chair doesn't mean whole india will be forced to learn hebrew.. man do u gusy have even idea what chair position is, u talking like some ganwaar here..:devil_smile:... There already exists bengali/oria yadaa yada langauge chair in one or other universities does that mean everyone gets force-fed those langauges.. wonder what my learnign this or that lanaguge has got to do with this debate..... PS: I won't be learnign hebrew even when hebrew chair comes to JNU.. hope u see the ridiculousness of the bogey u have raised..

[Guest dada_rocks]

Jew hater ? Look, jew-bootlicker, you have zero credibility. You are the moron liar who argues that israel didnt engage in terrorism when its own Prime minister, Menachim Begin openly took credit for planning and blowing up a Hotel full of British, arab and israeli women& children and common citizen. A liar like you has no credibility to judge. 88% of an organization encompassing 50% of the nations recognised Israel. But hey, numbers and percentages were never your strong point - you still do not get the basic idea that % of votes won in a referendum related issue is irrelevant without saying what % of voting population voted. Carry on, ponga pandit and agyaani maharishi of ponga panditgiri hinduvta hinduism.

see dope-head idiot in ur support as usual u have got zilch data...... number of states in 48 were not the sam as of today get it in your thick skull....... nations which mattered overwhelmingly supported israel and today more or less all do.. eod

[Guest dada_rocks]

Who are these 88% nations you keep talking about DR? The website you quoted from is a pro-Israeli website. I would be interested in getting some Independent numbers, giving me the list of names of these countries who voted. xxx

everything is online..even in UN's page is online if u don't belive me try disporving me .. pro-palestine or pro-israel numbers are nto going to change.. I have noticed u guys never bother to substantiate any claim just throw it and disappear when i show ur blatant attempt of misinformation campaign then u either sulk or disappaear or start nit-picking...........

[Guest dada_rocks]

What is utter bogus is to potray nehru as taking orders from Russia' date=' since India was the leading proponent of [b']non-aligned movement.

That was BS of highest order......1962 put the seal of BSness to that delusional experiment..

[Lurker]

Honestly u have no clue about israel's economic strength.. just do a simple comparison of usa aid and their GDP u will see the light..... high tech industry's life-line is israel .... same with agrilcutlural innovation.. They have brought green revolution to desert ( incidentally india has woken up late and delgates after delgates keep visiting israel these days to learn ropes on thsi issue).. their achievement is too big to fit in here.. will start another thread..

Yes I have heard all of that. A quick question now - Does this country(Israel) who is supposed to be super-economic country and all, does this country get US Aid every year or not?

let me ask you one thing what does india have to lose if israel starts some hebrew/jewish chair in some university...........find me just one negative given we won;t be putting even a dime in that project so ....u might laugh at number 20 but it still is better than zero at zero cost to tax-payers money

I suppose you could not even defend 20 jobs now eh DR? What was that whole shenaigan about job-creation then? I have already mentioned my issues with Hebrew university etc. Just to repeat one more time, I would be more interested in seeing an Indian learn an Indian language first. As it stands our language(Urdu comes quick to mind) are dieing and we have people suggesting - Lets go learn Hebrew!!

There already exists bengali/oria yadaa yada langauge chair in one or other universities does that mean everyone gets force-fed those langauges.. wonder what my learnign this or that lanaguge has got to do with this debate.....

It is rather simple. You do not live more than 300 kilometers away from Bengali land and you have no clue. Actually you do not have any clue of a language other than Hindi or English(I am including Maithili, Bhojpuri etc in Hindi). Please place your effort in learning an extra Indian language before you start suggesting Hebrew etc etc. xxx