Time England ended their one-day madness - Derek Pringle

[King]

Anyone who felt the last World Cup was too long may have sympathy with England's one-day players, writes Derek Pringle. More... Time England ended their one-day madness By Derek Pringle Last Updated: 1:24am BST 21/08/2007 Have your say Read comments Anyone who felt the last World Cup was too long may have sympathy with England's one-day players. Beginning with today's NatWest Series match against India at the Rose Bowl, Paul Collingwood's men will be hitting, catching and bowling white balls in three different countries for the next eight weeks, an unprecedented amount even in an era obsessed with the shorter form of the game. Audio: Derek Pringle previews the one dayers Video: Collingwood interview It won't all be 50-over cricket as the Twenty20 World Championship in South Africa will take the centre ground in September. But with a five-match series in Sri Lanka to follow, it provides England with their first lengthy opportunity to find and apply some method to their usual one-day madness, too often a melange of hastily cobbled together teams and ideas. "It's a great opportunity for us of developing as a side, not just over this series but over the next two months," said Collingwood yesterday. "Working on our skills and approach to the one-day game, as individuals, will hopefully make us a better one-day side." The challenge remains substantial. As the earlier series showed, England are not very good at 50-over cricket and have not been for some time. They have their moments like any team, notably beating Australia three times in succession on their own soil earlier this year. But the consistency needed to win series, especially ones as ludicrously long as this one (seven matches), eludes them. Chief among their flaws is the failure to score heavily during the three powerplays. Although partially addressed when Marcus Trescothick was on top of his game, they have never really known who their best options are and how they might go about it. One of the reasons why this area has not been addressed is the widespread belief among the team's strategists that conditions in England offer too much to new ball bowlers, something they feel makes risk-taking early on with the bat counter-productive. That belief has usually led to a hybrid opening partnership comprising one biffer and one specialist, a combination that can hardly be hailed as a resounding success given England's habit against the top seven sides since 2005, of being bowled out inside 50 overs 52 per cent of the time. The blend could be repeated in today's day/night match with Matt Prior and Alastair Cook, though Cook, the specialist opener, will probably only play if the pitch looks testing. More likely is that Prior - keen to put his calamitous keeping at the Oval behind him - will start with Ian Bell, with either Ravi Bopara or Owais Shah coming in at No 3. In a show of force, India will open with Sachin Tendulkar and Sourav Ganguly, a formidable pairing with 683 one-day internationals and 63 hundreds between them. Their Test opener, Dinesh Karthik, will bat in the middle order, with the exciting left-hander, Yuvraj Singh, preceding him. The return of Bopara and Andrew Flintoff, after lay-offs with injury, adds depth but also energy. With Collingwood looking jaded for Durham on Saturday, their buzz will be almost as important as their contributions with bat and ball. Flintoff will bat at six, despite his no-nonsense style being best suited to either the first or last 15 overs of the innings. England's other great one-day failing is their lack of proaction with the ball. While they possess bowlers who are capable of taking wickets in the first 20 overs, they have never sought options, other than to keep things tight, to take them in the middle part of the innings (overs 20-40). Mind you, England will have to do without their new-ball swinger Ryan Sidebottom today, after the side strain he picked up in the last Test failed to clear up. Flintoff's return will introduce some pace and accuracy, which will help to apply pressure, though that does not always bring wickets. Monty Panesar operates in a similar way, though he too lacks the wicket touch, taking just one in the recent series against the West Indies, which England lost 2-1. India's spinner is likely to be 18-year-old Piyush Chawla, a player with aspirations to be an all-rounder, something his team lacks. The height and pace of Chris Tremlett could provide a cutting edge, though Shane Warne's reticence to use him for Hampshire in the Friends Provident Trophy on Saturday suggests he remains a theoretical threat. With their batting depth and canny swing bowlers, India are favourites to win the series, so an upset would be a major feather in Collingwood's cap. Yet when the captain suggests that India's swingers will be less effective because the white Kookaburra ball only swings one way, you wonder whether the pressure of raising England's one-day game has got to him already. So India to win the series, though with dew likely to affect the team batting second in the three matches under lights, there is the possibility of England, made stronger by the returns of Flintoff and Bopara, pushing them close.

[King]

Most reckon India starts as favorites but I don't quite see how. India IMO is not a good ODI side at all. I hope they prove me wrong but am expecting India to struggle in the ODI series even if it is against England.

[Ram]

I dont understand why you feel India is a bad side Ravi. From the beginning of this year , we have played and won series against West Indies , Srilanka , South Africa, Bangladesh and won the one of matches against Ireland and Scotland. England , on the other hand , have always been a PATHETIC odi side. It was a miracle they won that triangular series in Australia before the world cup. Other than that, they have NOTHING to show as far as ODI achievements are concerned.

[Donny]

Ditto. England isn't languishing at the bottom of the world rankings for no reason.

[King]

I dont understand why you feel India is a bad side Ravi. From the beginning of this year , we have played and won series against West Indies , Srilanka , South Africa, Bangladesh and won the one of matches against Ireland and Scotland. England , on the other hand , have always been a PATHETIC odi side. It was a miracle they won that triangular series in Australia before the world cup. Other than that, they have NOTHING to show as far as ODI achievements are concerned.

That's because I've seen India walloped in ODIs by the likes of WI in WI, South Africa in South Africa, the ICC champions trophy at home and the world cup debacle. I don't rate India in ODIs at all. England at least has the VB series win to their credit but I haven't seen India win anything outside India after that ODI series against Pakistan.

[Ram]

When we got walloped in Windies and S.Africa , we were in our worst form for a long time. That was when we really lost our way under Chappell. The total team's performance started to degenerate. So , from being absolute world beaters in late 2005 to early parts of 2006, our performance declined dramatically after that. But from beginning of 2007 onwards , we really picked up the pieces and have been doing well , throughout this year. Dont hold the team ransom to the world cup debacle. Teams can suffer loss of form for a couple of games easily. Aus were beaten 2-0 in the VB series and Pak were eliminated in the first round , but went on to hammer Sri Lanka in the home odi series that followed. India is indeed, an excellent ODI team.

[The Outsider]

India is indeed, an excellent ODI team.

I wouldn't go that far.

[King]

I commend your enthusiasm but I cannot see how you can call them excellent? Where are the results to back it up though? I'm sure you would have watched India play against Bangladesh in the ODIs. The series win against South Africa in Ireland was quite a good one but one win cannot erase the losses to Wi 4-1, South Africa 4-0, not being able to make it to finals in Malaysia against Aus and WI, not even able to reach semis in the ICC champions trophy.... do you consider these losses at all? Even though India lost 4-1 against WI they still won the test series. Don't confuse the test form with ODI form Sriram. Far from excellent, they are in the worst form during this century in ODIs.

[Ram]

We have all the makings of an excellent team Shwetabh, atleast in the batting department. Assuming Uthappa and Sachin , Saurav at no.3 , Dravid at 4 , Yuvi at 5 , Karthik at 6 and Dhoni at 7 , that is really one hell of an batting combination. It has got everything that you want - Explosive starts , experienced middle order , power hitters in the lower middle order. Our bowling combo of Zak , Agarkar , RP and Powar is not bad too, though i would prefer an in-form Pathan and Harbhajan instead of RP and Powar. Its not without reason we won 16 consecutive matches chasing.

[Ram]

I commend your enthusiasm but I cannot see how you can call them excellent? Where are the results to back it up though? I'm sure you would have watched India play against Bangladesh in the ODIs. The series win against South Africa in Ireland was quite a good one but one win cannot erase the losses to Wi 4-1' date=' South Africa 4-0, not being able to make it to finals in Malaysia against Aus and WI, not even able to reach semis in the ICC champions trophy.... do you consider these losses at all? Even though India lost 4-1 against WI they still won the test series. Don't confuse the test form with ODI form Sriram. Far from excellent, they are in the worst form during this century in ODIs.[/quote'] Ravi , this year, we have played 18 ODI matches , won 13 and lost 5. That is nearly 70% success rate. Find me 2 other teams that have better record as far as 2007 is concerned.

[gator]

FACT: in neutral conditions, we won the odi series against the number 2 odi side, who were number 1 in the world not long back....