Lurker Posted August 14, 2008 Posted August 14, 2008 Lurker This is the website of the temple http://ws.ori.nic.in/jagannath/ , I am not able to find if it is a private trust or a public one, do you know abt this? I am curious of how this incident relates to the property act in India. Triam. Most likely this would be a Public Trust. The board of trustees include 2 IAS officers, both based in Puri. You can check it by clicking on Contact Us link of left side menu. I dont see any reason why a Temple board would have 2 resident IAS officers on its board unless it was under Govt umbrella one way or the other.
triam Posted August 14, 2008 Posted August 14, 2008 Triam. Most likely this would be a Public Trust. The board of trustees include 2 IAS officers, both based in Puri. You can check it by clicking on Contact Us link of left side menu. I dont see any reason why a Temple board would have 2 resident IAS officers on its board unless it was under Govt umbrella one way or the other. Thats what I thought too, but wanted to be sure, since the IAS guys could be retired. if that is the case, on what legal basis can anyone stop any Indian citizen from entering? is that even legal?
Ram Posted August 14, 2008 Posted August 14, 2008 Not really , some hardcore Brahmins in Puri might be very angry .. they may not be able to issue a fatwa but for sure they'll throw me out of the temple. Like I posted before , I m not challenging to do it .. It was a comment to show that these sadhus can be fooled easily by anybody ... Ofcourse hinduism, as per my understanding is a lot more tolerant religion. I may not pray or follow it as much but its good to be a hindu No you're fine. We all know about you. So, even if your odd comment does sound a bit iffy, it doesnt really matter coz your history. BUT, some posters have a tendency to bash Hindusim without reason or provocation. Unfortunately, that will NOT be tolerated, one bit. Everyone who contributes in this forum need to know that they can keep their religious preferences to themselves. This isnt a place to either hard-sell or downplay any particular religion or community. And it particularly offends me when someone disses Hinduism because, being a Hindu myself, I know what an outstandingly tolerant and flexible religion it is.
Guest dada_rocks Posted August 14, 2008 Posted August 14, 2008 Govt has annexed more or less all hindu polgriamge sight which gets substantial gift from pilgrims.... no muslim or chistian place has suffered this high-handedness.. now psecs are justifyingthe baseless senseless edict that these pilgrimage sight shud be turned into tourist centre just because govt is in control.. Noboyd asked govt to come in they are the forcible trespassers and since hindus are not fantic so they can get away with it...... Bottomline if u don;t respect a religious place u have no business being there.. rest is incoherent gibberish ..
Lurker Posted August 14, 2008 Posted August 14, 2008 Thats what I thought too' date=' but wanted to be sure, since the IAS guys could be retired. if that is the case, on what legal basis can anyone stop any Indian citizen from entering? is that even legal?[/quote'] I am not too sure what is the legal definition in this particular case Triam. Theoretically I suppose the soldier could bring a PIL in Supreme Court saying he was discriminated against based on his religion and let law take its course. Practically this would simply become a religious affair with two groups : a) Moronic religious right, of both religions, who would go nuts suggesting how they are discriminated against while the other party eats all the goodies. b) Decent citizens who would not give a rat's to this whole issue. There would be a very small population of people who would pursue this. The strangest, and most fascinating, aspect would of course be the fact that while the Hindu religious rights will keep harping for a UCC(Uniform Civil Code), when it would come to facts on ground they are more than happy to make two set of rules. xxx
kumble_rocks Posted August 14, 2008 Posted August 14, 2008 Again the issue is not whether you actually do it or indeed beleive in what you do ... but the issue is you will find very very few people (including you perhaps ) that would say the same had this been a Mosque instead of a Temple. that right there is crux of our twisted take on secularism / liberalism / whatever. and you will agree that the % of Muslims that will stand up likewise is very small and politically negligible. How did you come to that conclusion ? I don't think any poster here will condone Muslims denying Hindus entry into their mosque ?
triam Posted August 14, 2008 Posted August 14, 2008 I agree with you DR, iam not a pseudo sec, I dont respect any religion. Thats why uniform civil code is so important for India, dont know when, how or who will implement it.
Guest dada_rocks Posted August 14, 2008 Posted August 14, 2008 It's perfectly legal forcible annexation of religious bodies by govt particualrly hindu religiouos bodis doesnt give govt right to do whatever they please... That's another beef I have with socalled secular govt it feels compelled to take possession of hindu religious bodies for some reaosn and lets others enjoy independence... And rule stands noone who thinks those gods statues residing in those religious places is abomination should be allowed entry...... And muslims/christian/jews all of them think in those terms abotu hindu deities.. It's very very simple matter, deliberate obfuscation notwithstanding..
prince40 Posted August 14, 2008 Posted August 14, 2008 How did you come to that conclusion ? I don't think any poster here will condone Muslims denying Hindus entry into their mosque ? lol u dont know crap dude, many mosques do not allow non-muslims as a policy
kumble_rocks Posted August 14, 2008 Posted August 14, 2008 lol u dont know crap dude' date=' many mosques do not allow non-muslims as a policy[/quote'] You are talking from backside again ! What part of this post is not clear to you , moron ? I don't think any poster here will condone Muslims denying Hindus entry into their mosque ? Try English 101 for dummies !:--D
triam Posted August 14, 2008 Posted August 14, 2008 It's perfectly legal forcible annexation of religious bodies by govt particualrly hindu religiouos bodis doesnt give govt right to do whatever they please... That's another beef I have with socalled secular govt it feels compelled to take possession of hindu religious bodies for some reaosn and lets others enjoy independence... And rule stands noone who thinks those gods statues residing in those religious places is abomination should be allowed entry...... And muslims/christian/jews all of them think in those terms abotu hindu deities.. It's very very simple matter, deliberate obfuscation notwithstanding.. All these rules are farcical, Leave religious institutions to manage themselves, no subsidies, no take overs, no land allocated etc, or if that is tough take over the management of all religious institutions and implement no discrimination towards anything everywhere. Implement uniform civil code across religions. Strengthen the property law with no loopholes whereby even the government cannot abuse it. And one question, is there a mosque or church in India where hindus are not allowed, the keyword being "in India" . As an aside dont know if many people here know of JesuDas, he is a carnatic singer, has sung tonnes of devotional songs both Hindu and christian ones, he was not allowed into guruvayoor temple once, that just sounds illogical.
Guest dada_rocks Posted August 14, 2008 Posted August 14, 2008 I have been to mosques pretending to be muslim rest assured you would be denied entry if you go there as hindu.. moreover this quid pro quo is wrong on two counts.. First: Mosque is not the house of their deity unlike our teple. it's just a place of congregation for prayer heck the very fact that they are against worship through idol tells they got to have no idol of their god in those msques.. And where they do idolatry i.e. Mecca Medina they not only deny you entry from just place of worship but the whole city. Second:Hinduism accepts all path no matter how freaky as legitmate ways to seek siritual salvation. Hindus don't believe you ore anyone else will go to hell just because he she prays in different way.
prince40 Posted August 14, 2008 Posted August 14, 2008 You are talking from backside again ! What part of this post is not clear to you , moron ? Try English 101 for dummies !:--D Thats not necessary prince Take it Easy -BossBhai.
Guest dada_rocks Posted August 14, 2008 Posted August 14, 2008 All these rules are farcical, Leave religious institutions to manage themselves, no subsidies, no take overs, no land allocated etc, or if that is tough take over the management of all religious institutions and implement no discrimination towards anything everywhere. Implement uniform civil code across religions. Strengthen the property law with no loopholes whereby even the government cannot abuse it. And one question, is there a mosque or church in India where hindus are not allowed, the keyword being "in India" . As an aside dont know if many people here know of JesuDas, he is a carnatic singer, has sung tonnes of devotional songs both Hindu and christian ones, he was not allowed into guruvayoor temple once, that just sounds illogical. I have no idea about church but mosques denies you entry even if you are muslim, if you happen to don some hindu stuff.. Like one of my acquaintance and close family friend endearingly called nihal mama , a muslim, got denied entry into a kolkata mosque just because he had rudraksh bead garland on... they asked him to take that off he refused and returned without entering mosque..
Guest dada_rocks Posted August 14, 2008 Posted August 14, 2008 Thats not necessary prince Take it Easy BossBhai. Yes no abuse please not to mommy daddy and anyone other than the poster for sure..
triam Posted August 14, 2008 Posted August 14, 2008 Ok DR, didnt know, when I was in India I have accompanied some friends to mosques, guess each mosque differs then. Churches I dont think they stop you at all, been to numerous when in India
Guest dada_rocks Posted August 14, 2008 Posted August 14, 2008 triam not even all temples stop you. I havesat for hours with burqua clad gals in vishwanath temple inside BHU.. There are few temples who do that and I understand why.. We are making too much fuss about nothing.. IN varanasi which is a city of temples other than one temple near durga kund for instance in all the temples anyone can enter., there is no check whatsoever.. I am just making a point why certain temples do and sincerely object equating their directive to talibanism..
triam Posted August 14, 2008 Posted August 14, 2008 I know that not all temples stop people. Equating with taliban is also ridiculous. did you know abt the jesudas incident?
Guest dada_rocks Posted August 14, 2008 Posted August 14, 2008 BTW one of the most liberal muslim I am happen to know at my work.. Well he eats pork so he has to be liberal.:--D. even he refused to accompany us to the temple for wedding of a colleague today .. I guess idolatrous place is no go zone even for liberal muslim...... Wonder why are we clamoring for their entry in temple anyway.. Yes Jesudas too was denied entry in certain temple because he is christian or sthg..
Guest dada_rocks Posted August 14, 2008 Posted August 14, 2008 Anyway let me cap this debate with following assertion (1) poor soldier was not at fault because he didn't know (2) All that gimmic about throwing all the food just because a muslim soldier by mistake entered remains a gimmic and smacks off same crap which muslims dole when they ban entry of non-muslim to mecca/medinah.. (3) I certainly can understand ban on entry on matter of principle which is if you don;t respect then why both and why sud you be allowed.. but certainly the way puri temple authority has behaved they have other reason than the principle I talking about and I am not in agreement with temple authority there (4) Yes architecure aprpeciation is certainly a point but consideration of religious sanctity trumps it by miles EOD for me
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