Lord Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 Like when Dhoni won the 20/20 WC? Yeah that was a champion team allright, I wonder what happened to the mighty champions Joginder Sharma, Uthappa. Not only did we have so many young players, but we were missing some of our best in SRT, ZK etc. It wasn't all because of Dhoni, but every time this man has been captain he's sent the same consistent message to his team which to play hard/aggressive cricket and enjoy yourselves and back each other up. Obviously young and old players have responded to that alike. There are many, many other captains, past and present who couldn't even do that. 20/20 WORLD CUP?pakistan made it to finals n almost won it.so shoaib malik is a great captaan?:cantstop:
Shane Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 u say aussies dont need ponting?:giggle:. all i meant was captaincy doesnt matter too much wen it comes to champion sides like current indian team or aussies of past. Ur wrong it does matter ... get AB, tugga and Clive Lloyd out of their captaincy and replace them with Mcdorment, Langer and Larry Gomes as captain ... Now please tell me it doesnt matter !!!
Shane Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 20/20 WORLD CUP?pakistan made it to finals n almost won it.so shoaib malik is a great captaan?:cantstop: 'almost' had he been great, he would have won it, thats the difference u see rox !!!
cochise Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 u say aussies dont need ponting?. all i meant was captaincy doesnt matter too much wen it comes to champion sides like current indian team or aussies of past. Sorry, but you cannot be more wrong. Ponting is a good example. He inherited a champion team from Waugh and look where it is now? Granted, they have lost great players, but they still have enough good players in the side to have put up a much better show than they have in the last season. Champions sides are made up of individuals with a lot of talent pooling it together to achieve a common objective. Note, talent normally comes with a large ego as well. The captain is the most important individual to articulate the common aim, motivate the individuals in that direction and control and direct the egos in the team towards the objective. Without a good captain, you may have a team of champions, but not a champion team.
Lord Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 Ur wrong it does matter ... get AB' date=' tugga and Clive Lloyd out of their captaincy and replace them with Mcdorment, Langer and Larry Gomes as captain ... Now please tell me it doesnt matter !!![/quote'] if y r giving the same team as they had,it wouldnt matter too much.ofcourse captain should have permanent place in the side,n the names u mentioned arent that
Shane Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 ^^ U mean larry gomes and langer wernt permanent fixtures ... that actually shows how much u know abt the sport !!!
Lord Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 'almost' had he been great' date=' he would have won it, thats the difference u see rox !!![/quote'] so the difference b/w being great n being poor is 5 runs??:cantstop:
Fontaine Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 u say aussies dont need ponting?:giggle:. all i meant was captaincy doesnt matter too much wen it comes to champion sides like current indian team or aussies of past. That's where you're are completely wrong. Take a look into any auto biography of any major cricketer and almost all of them cite the captain as the guy who sets the tone, the attitude and the nature of the team. You think it's coincidence that Sehwag isn't being questioned by the media and fans every time gets out playing a loose stroke now compared to a couple of years ago? Or how so many young players are playing well when it was so difficult for young batsmen in particular to have any consistent success under Dravid/Chappell? I don't expect your provincial outlook to grasp this now but Dhoni is in the process of changing the landscape of how Indian cricket is portrayed in the subcontinent. He's completely shifted the focus of the media, and obsessive fans from ranting and raving at every high and low, to a more balanced and even handed outlook. You know why? Because his message and outlook has been constant. He's said every single time that the team has to go out and enjoy themselves, play aggressively and be confident. That message has been constant win, lose or draw and you can almost sense that most of the main stream media and fans trust that so they don't go over the top as much. Whether he's just won the 20/20 WC or lost a match in the Asia Cup final Dhoni has stayed consistent and the same instead of getting emotionally charged up or down and the fans/media reflect that. It's the same with the make up of our ODI team. Most of the ODI players we have like SRT, Bhajji, ZK, Gambhir, Yuvi etc are naturally aggressive players. Dhoni allows them to play their natural game and be aggressive. Other conservative captains wouldn't. Dhoni has been one of the most influential factors in the last 18 months of Indian Limited overs cricket be it how he's shaped the selection policy, how he's handled the players, and media relations, and all of that has immensely helped in the success they've had. But you don't have to take my word for it. Most of the former greats who are in the media now all agree that Dhoni is probably one of the best ODI captains in the world if not the best.
Fontaine Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 20/20 WORLD CUP?pakistan made it to finals n almost won it.so shoaib malik is a great captaan?:cantstop: I really don't think you're this stupid so please drop the act. Malik had almost a full strength team and the Pak situation is totally different because they have so many cliques in the team and they've always been historically divided. Even on that occasion I think Yousuf was making headlines because he wasn't in the team so the role of the captain doesn't even come into it for Pakistan.
Shane Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 so the difference b/w being great n being poor is 5 runs??:cantstop: 5 runs is the margin of victory ... greatness is the steel and determination to go out there and churn out that victory ... ur malik certainly is doing that against the zimz and bangoz and sl oww wait 230 runs margin of defeat and a cricket board in turmoil ... may be malik just lost his captaincy ... sad he couldnt be great A massive loss to the world of cricket !!!
Shane Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 I really don't think you're this stupid so please drop the act. Oyy yes, he is !!!
Lord Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 ^^ U mean larry gomes and langer wernt permanent fixtures ... that actually shows how much u know abt the sport !!! i meant wen Clive loyd n steve waugh became captains
cochise Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 Having said all of that...I still think Dhoni should have scored 180 (minimum) from the 45 balls he faced instead of 35...shame Dhoni shame! You weren't clear in your thinking. :D
Fontaine Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 Oyy yes' date=' he is !!![/quote'] You may be right. You really have to question the basic cricket understanding of someone when they can't even fathom just how much of an effect Dhoni had when he took over the captaincy briefly of the same team that Kumble had against the Australia series. The entire team looked more energetic, sharper in the field and more focused.
Lord Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 I really don't think you're this stupid so please drop the act. Malik had almost a full strength team and the Pak situation is totally different because they have so many cliques in the team and they've always been historically divided. Even on that occasion I think Yousuf was making headlines because he wasn't in the team so the role of the captain doesn't even come into it for Pakistan. Razzaq,yusuf werent selected,so i dunno how it was full strength team.i am not saying mallik was great.he was poor.but still took the team to finals
Shane Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 Having said all of that...I still think Dhoni should have scored 180 (minimum) from the 45 balls he faced instead of 35...shame Dhoni shame! You weren't clear in your thinking. :D No, he should have got some extras by dancing around the stumps ... 190 was a must what else do u expect from a batsman who comes in at no 5 !!!
Shane Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 Razzaq' date='yusuf werent selected,so i dunno how it was full strength team.i am not saying mallik was great.he was poor.but still took the team to finals[/quote'] MoYo in a T20 match :hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::hysterical:
Lord Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 You may be right. You really have to question the basic cricket understanding of someone when they can't even fathom just how much of an effect Dhoni had when he took over the captaincy briefly of the same team that Kumble had against the Australia series. The entire team looked more energetic, sharper in the field and more focused. o really?so we werent focussed wen we won in perth,or galle?the team looked energetic bcoz on oldie was replaced by a youngster
Fontaine Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 Razzaq' date='yusuf werent selected,so i dunno how it was full strength team.i am not saying mallik was great.he was poor.but still took the team to finals[/quote'] Look mate, no disrespect, but piss off. You're not making a counter argument, or even making it clear how/why/what your objections of Dhoni are whether it's his captaincy etc (even though I asked you to do this earlier). All you're doing is picking minor holes into whatever myself or Shane are saying that have very little to do with the original point almost as if you have not real discussion point or anything original to say.
Lord Posted February 4, 2009 Posted February 4, 2009 Look mate, no disrespect, but piss off. You're not making a counter argument, or even making it clear how/why/what your objections of Dhoni are whether it's his captaincy etc (even though I asked you to do this earlier). All you're doing is picking minor holes into whatever myself or Shane are saying that have very little to do with the original point almost as if you have not real discussion point or anything original to say. i actually made a comment only about his batting yesterday.to me he was too slow.thats it.
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