Indian batsmen - overshadowed by Sachin, fair claim?

[fineleg]

there is no bloody shadow or such crap. He is a legend on his own merit, and always had his own style and place. Was not and never will be in any other players' shadow. Also, he is one of the top batsmen of India all time in Tests. (Not 4th or 5th).

[graphic23]

there is no bloody shadow or such crap. He is a legend on his own merit, and always had his own style and place. Was not and never will be in any other players' shadow. Also, he is one of the top batsmen of India all time in Tests. (Not 4th or 5th).

Source Dravid has spent a lifetime in Sachin Tendulkar's shadow and the big batting records - centuries, number of runs scored - were never going to be his, but he is quite on his own in the slips. Mohammad Azharuddin will rank as the greatest all-round Indian fielder, and he was quite brilliant in the slips, but as a specialist and for sheer longevity, Dravid stands alone. Sunil Gavaskar was pretty good at first slip too, but I reckon Dravid has taken more difficult catches, and made them look easy.

It is true, whether we like it or not.

[fineleg]

graphic, just because sambit bal considers dravid as playing second or third fiddle, i don't think it becomes the truth. Yes, in different matches, there will be different heroes - thats how it is... and Dravid has his own style and matches he has won or saved for us. Anyway, this is about catches and the world record - so we'll leave this at that.

[graphic23]

graphic, just because sambit bal considers dravid as playing second or third fiddle, i don't think it becomes the truth. Yes, in different matches, there will be different heroes - thats how it is... and Dravid has his own style and matches he has won or saved for us. Anyway, this is about catches and the world record - so we'll leave this at that.

Now where did that article say that Dravid played second fiddle? It never did. You're assuming so because you're insecure and I'm not quite sure about what. Its like you own Dravid - there are other fans who are bigger fans than you, and they don't go saying, "oh he should tighten his technique" everytime he gets bowled. We stick with him through his ups and downs - just like we do with the rest of the Indian team. The part I highlighted for you was to make you see the fact that no matter how great the batsman has been, they've all been, fairly or unfairly, overshadowed by Sachin Tendulkar - since his debut. Everything has been, and will be about Sachin Tendulkar until he retires - for different reasons throughout his career. When he started out -it was, how great can this kid play against all the bowlers throughout the world, then it was, "wow, what a genius. He crossed Desmond Haynes", and then it was "wow, he crossed Gary Sobers and Donald Bradman in # of Test runs and # of test centuries", and in recent times, it has been "Wow, what a loser - he doesn't know when he should retire." - until the last 2 years, since when it has been "wow, what a great player. 20 years and you wouldn't know it." Whether it was positive or negative, if you look back at the last 20 years of Indian cricket, you'll see a WHOLE LOT of Sachin Tendulkar.

[fineleg]

alright, alright. this thread is abt dravid, so lets leave this about him.

[graphic23]

alright' date=' alright. this thread is abt dravid, so lets leave this about him.[/quote'] New thread. Now please respond to my post because you will not be derailing the original thread.

[punjabi_khota]

there is no bloody shadow or such crap. He is a legend on his own merit, and always had his own style and place. Was not and never will be in any other players' shadow. Also, he is one of the top batsmen of India all time in Tests. (Not 4th or 5th).

I think they both mean the same thing. YMMV.

[fineleg]

there was lot of news abt SRT but i dont think RD was in his shadow. He was a very important player in his own right, I always felt he was key for us in Tests.

[graphic23]

Again, you're giving me facts I've already acknowledged. I've already said that no one thought he was unimportant in any way. You claimed that he wasn't overshadowed by Sachin - which is different from being inferior or being less important to the team.

[punjabi_khota]

Now where did that article say that Dravid played second fiddle? It never did. You're assuming so because you're insecure and I'm not quite sure about what. Its like you own Dravid - there are other fans who are bigger fans than you, and they don't go saying, "oh he should tighten his technique" everytime he gets bowled. We stick with him through his ups and downs - just like we do with the rest of the Indian team.

Finey doesn't own Dravid, Sachin does.

[DomainK]

Now where did that article say that Dravid played second fiddle? It never did. You're assuming so because you're insecure and I'm not quite sure about what. Its like you own Dravid - there are other fans who are bigger fans than you, and they don't go saying, "oh he should tighten his technique" everytime he gets bowled. We stick with him through his ups and downs - just like we do with the rest of the Indian team. The part I highlighted for you was to make you see the fact that no matter how great the batsman has been, they've all been, fairly or unfairly, overshadowed by Sachin Tendulkar - since his debut. Everything has been, and will be about Sachin Tendulkar until he retires - for different reasons throughout his career. When he started out -it was, how great can this kid play against all the bowlers throughout the world, then it was, "wow, what a genius. He crossed Desmond Haynes", and then it was "wow, he crossed Gary Sobers and Donald Bradman in # of Test runs and # of test centuries", and in recent times, it has been "Wow, what a loser - he doesn't know when he should retire." - until the last 2 years, since when it has been "wow, what a great player. 20 years and you wouldn't know it." Whether it was positive or negative, if you look back at the last 20 years of Indian cricket, you'll see a WHOLE LOT of Sachin Tendulkar.

Good post.:two_thumbs_up:

[fineleg]

graphic, i disagree that everything is abt SRT. Indian team does not start and end with SRT and it is not made out to be that way either internally or externally. You may feel otherwise.

[graphic23]

graphic, i disagree that everything is abt SRT. Indian team does not start and end with SRT and it is not made out to be that way either internally or externally. You may feel otherwise.

Who said I feel it? I am making my claim that for the last 20 years, Indian team has improved miles above where their predecessors were. That is not being challenged here. I am telling you that the International XI, for the last 20 years, has been about Sachin Tendulkar - whether I feel it or not, whether you agree with it or not, that is true. Can you make an argument otherwise?

[fineleg]

What do you mean "it has been abt Tendulkar" - Tendulkar was top batsman hence he will be praised and talked about. But it has not been all about him only. There are people like Kumble, Dravid who helped immensely in Tests, and the Indian cricket has been about them and others too - not just about one individual.

[sangrock]

Now where did that article say that Dravid played second fiddle? It never did. You're assuming so because you're insecure and I'm not quite sure about what. Its like you own Dravid - there are other fans who are bigger fans than you, and they don't go saying, "oh he should tighten his technique" everytime he gets bowled. We stick with him through his ups and downs - just like we do with the rest of the Indian team. The part I highlighted for you was to make you see the fact that no matter how great the batsman has been, they've all been, fairly or unfairly, overshadowed by Sachin Tendulkar - since his debut. Everything has been, and will be about Sachin Tendulkar until he retires - for different reasons throughout his career. When he started out -it was, how great can this kid play against all the bowlers throughout the world, then it was, "wow, what a genius. He crossed Desmond Haynes", and then it was "wow, he crossed Gary Sobers and Donald Bradman in # of Test runs and # of test centuries", and in recent times, it has been "Wow, what a loser - he doesn't know when he should retire." - until the last 2 years, since when it has been "wow, what a great player. 20 years and you wouldn't know it." Whether it was positive or negative, if you look back at the last 20 years of Indian cricket, you'll see a WHOLE LOT of Sachin Tendulkar.

SRT's career brings everyone in a state of awe. As you mentioned, there has always been talk about SRT - about his teen debut, about his wholesome technique at a young age, about his super long career, about his records, about his humbleness, etc. All these things in an individual are so unique that a batsman of RD's caliber was forced to live in his shadow. I would go a step further and say that he lived in shadows of both Ganguly and Tendulkar. Ganguly was always in media for his extra-ordinary offside play, aggressive captaincy, etc. In contrast, Dravid was never in media limelight and thus has lived in "shadows" these individuals. Nevertheless, for true cricket fans, that has never happened. It has always been acknowledged by great teams, commentators about the importance to get "The Wall" out.

[fineleg]

sangrock, Media will do its thing. Doesnt mean that whatever they say is the only thing in Indian team. Indian team has always been about a few key players, and some support players as well.

[DomainK]

sangrock, Media will do its thing. Doesnt mean that whatever they say is the only thing in Indian team. Indian team has always been about a few key players, and some support players as well.

Forget media....think about fans. Think about yourself. How much has Sachin influenced you? Positively or negatively? You are living in constant insecurity because of Sachin Tendulkar. You think more about him that any other cricketer.

[sangrock]

sangrock, Media will do its thing. Doesnt mean that whatever they say is the only thing in Indian team. Indian team has always been about a few key players, and some support players as well.

That is exactly what I said - the hype is always about the Little Master, but on the planning board, teams make it a point to have strategies for Dravid, VVS, etc. Apart from that point, I can confidently say that after a very long time we are seeing a test batting lineup that is almost permanent (we always had problems about openers, one middle order batsmen ,etc.) , more so - the bowling lineup is almost permanent too with a strong bench strength. Earlier, this has never been seen for an Indian team. Mostly it was Tendulkar that took the onus of the team pressure and counter-attacked a team (or scored runs). Actually, he was the only regular team member who was attacking the opponent. Dravid came into the picture a little late. And, he was not playing the attacking style of cricket that Tendulkar played, he plays the typical book cricket - perfect technique and put the bad ball away! That yielded marvelous results for him, but he still lacked the image to put fear into opponent bowlers/team that Tendulkar did. The balance in the current team forces us to inspect the "key players". Otherwise, in the past, the core of the team mainly comprised of SRT.

[sangrock]

Forget media....think about fans. Think about yourself. How much has Sachin influenced you? Positively or negatively? You are living in constant insecurity because of Sachin Tendulkar. You think more about him that any other cricketer.

Well, for me as a fan, I adore both Tendulkar and Dravid. Although, I admit that I adore Tendulkar more - just because of his fearless mentality and his ability to change gears. Dravid and Tendulkar, both are humble cricketers, thus making them cricketers who should be idolized. They both are aware that they are extremely talented, but know the importance of hard work. I remember Tendulkar preparing specially for Shane Warne, having extra batting sessions to sort out his batting; More importantly, I remember reading an article where Md. Kaif (when out of form) went to Dravid and asked him for tips, Dravid handed him a book and said that he should sort out the chinks in his technique that he worried about. The bottom line that I want to say is that - Tendulkar sells (markets) more than Dravid. (Remember Gladiator - Maximus wins the crowd, so does SRT)

[Anakin]

No matter what one's personal pref :winky: is, SRT has been the greatest batsman of modern era and most likely ever, not just Sir Hadlee's opinion, ask Donald. It's only natural other batsmen will be overshadowed by SRT, it doesn't make them any less batsmen.