Double standard of Islamic countries -

[King Tendulkar]

Where did he say that? KR' date=' along with Lurker, MM etc. are some of the harshest critics of BJP and yet we choose to criticize the Chinese for what they have done in Uighur. Uighur and Palestine are two Muslim based movements which would find support in most sane people's minds.[/quote'] O yeah Mr Sane. You no doubt support all the many islamic speratist movements of the poor persecuted muslims

[The Outsider]

O yeah Mr Sane. You no doubt support all the many islamic speratist movements of the poor persecuted muslims

You surely have either a reading or a comprehension problem. Read my post again.

[kumble_rocks]

Double standard of kumble rocks: BJP persecution of muslims = good, chinese persecution of muslims = bad. why are you so pro-uighur these days?

Moronic statement by kriterion. As usual you are deluding yourself . Care to comment about the OP. I don't care about BJP and am reasonably happy with the present government of Dr Singh. Uighur , Kurdistan , Palestine are genuine causes wherein my support is generally with the muslim community. Especially Palestine !

[Kriterion]

Moronic statement by kriterion. As usual you are deluding yourself . Care to comment about the OP. I don't care about BJP and am reasonably happy with the present government of Dr Singh. Uighur ' date= Kurdistan , Palestine are genuine causes wherein my support is generally with the muslim community. Especially Palestine !

already commented on the OP...see the above links i posted about muslim "condemnation" on the china situation. personally you might not care about the BJP, but generally ppl who would make hte double standard speech would, 90% of the time.

[Kriterion]

Put up or shut up.

don't have a legit answer as to why a supposedly hindu organization spends so much time obsessing over christians and muslims, do you?

[seedhi]

don't have a legit answer as to why a supposedly hindu organization spends so much time obsessing over christians and muslims' date=' do you?[/quote'] Of the top of my head these are some of the achievements of Muslims: 1. Destroyed thousands of Hindu temples in India 2. Destroyed Nalanda, Vikramshila and other great universities 3. Razed to ground the city of Vijayanagar 4. Destroyed the Somnath temple 6 times, everytime after a Hindu ruler rebuilt it 5. Destroyed the Keshav Rai temple in Mathura and buried the statues of Hindu deities under the footsteps of a mosque in Agra to be continually trampled by muslims. 6. Stopped the growth of science and technology in India. Before they arrived India was a leader in math and science, and lost to Europe during muslim dominance. 7. Partitioned India in 1947. 90% of muslims voted for Jinnah and his partition plan. Considering history, I am not surprised that some Hindus today might be a bit obsessed with muslims. It is but an article, in comparison to centuries of atrocities.

[THX_1138]

Of the top of my head these are some of the achievements of Muslims: 1. Destroyed thousands of Hindu temples in India 2. Destroyed Nalanda, Vikramshila and other great universities 3. Razed to ground the city of Vijayanagar 4. Destroyed the Somnath temple 6 times, everytime after a Hindu ruler rebuilt it 5. Destroyed the Keshav Rai temple in Mathura and buried the statues of Hindu deities under the footsteps of a mosque in Agra to be continually trampled by muslims. 6. Stopped the growth of science and technology in India. Before they arrived India was a leader in math and science, and lost to Europe during muslim dominance. 7. Partitioned India in 1947. 90% of muslims voted for Jinnah and his partition plan. Considering history, I am not surprised that some Hindus today might be a bit obsessed with muslims. It is but an article, in comparison to centuries of atrocities.

Somehow i dont see why i should be upset with points 1, 4, and 5. furthermore, you are mistaken with point number 6. islamic scholars were the harbingers of mathematics and astronomy, however, it was with the emergence philosophers such as al gazali that such advancements ceased. nonetheless, none of the intermediate rulers of india, either in the west or in between islamic kingdoms, made any efforts to regress that imbalance. if anything, most indian rulers have been obsessing with the reconstruction of temples and other places of worship which were well, nothing but a massive waste of resources and means to exploit the local population and haul in money in wheel barrows. as for point 7, that is self determination. there have been countless incidents in the history of india where muslims and hindus were at logger horns, and thus, as a means of self preservation, muslims chose to have a country of their own (one that they could frack up with absolute independence). i must ask one thing of our pakistani brothers... there is a general sentiment amongst you guys that you are 'superior' or failing that, 'stronger' and more 'robust'... then why did they not feel that they could handle their own amongst hindus? were they scared of the scrawny, 'dal eating', inferior hindus? tsk tsk.

[Macj]

Somehow i dont see why i should be upset with points 1' date=' 4, and 5. furthermore, you are mistaken with point number 6. i[b']slamic scholars were the harbingers of mathematics and astronomy, however, it was with the emergence philosophers such as al gazali that such advancements ceased. nonetheless, none of the intermediate rulers of india, either in the west or in between islamic kingdoms, made any efforts to regress that imbalance.

This is horse pucky, it is a known fact that Arabs copied a lot of their Mathematics from Sanskritic treatises of Indian mathematicians and astrologers. Read about Brahmaguptas mathematical treatises and how they found themselves in Arab lands as an e.g. Secondly the conquest of Sindh and the conquest of Al Andalus happened in the same century , knowledge transfer between east and west thus was far quicker. In fact Arabs use Al Hindsa to describe certain areas of Mathematics that came from India (From Hind)

[Macj]

To quote from Carl B. Boyer in his "History of Mathematics", “...Mohammed ibn-Musa al-Khwarizmi, ..., who died sometime before 850, wrote more than a half dozen astronomical and mathematical works, of which the earliest were probably based on the Sindhind derived from India. Besides ... [he] wrote two books on arithmetic and algebra which played very important roles in the history of mathematics. ... In this work, based presumably on an Arabic translation of Brahmagupta, al-Khwarizmi gave so full an account of the Hindu numerals that he probably is responsible for the widespread but false impression that our system of numeration is Arabic in origin. ... [pages 227-228]...â€. In a translation of Alberuni ‘s “Indicaâ€, a seminal work of this period (c.1030 AD), Edward Sachau, writes this in his introduction, “Many Arab authors took up the subjects communicated to them by the Hindus and worked them out in original compositions , commentaries and extracts. A favourite subject of theirs was Indian mathematics..." etc. “ Al-Khwarizmi wrote numerous books that played important roles in arithematic and algebra. In his work, De numero indorum (Concerning the Hindu Art of Reckoning), it was based presumably on an Arabic translation of Brahmagupta where he gave a full account of the Hindu numerals which was the first to expound the system with its digits 0,1,2,3,....,9 and decimal place value which was a fairly recent arrival from India. Because of this book with the Latin translations made a false inquiry that our system of numeration is arabic in origin. The new notation came to be known as that of al-Khwarizmi, or more carelessly, algorismi; ultimately the scheme of numeration making use of the Hindu numerals came to be called simply algorism or algorithm, a word that, originally derived from the name al-Khwarizmi, now means, more generally, any peculiar rule of procedure or operation.

http://www.ivarta.com/columns/OL_051210.htm

[seedhi]

Somehow i dont see why i should be upset with points 1' date=' 4, and 5. furthermore, you are mistaken with point number 6. islamic scholars were the harbingers of mathematics and astronomy, however, it was with the emergence philosophers such as al gazali that such advancements ceased. nonetheless, none of the intermediate rulers of india, either in the west or in between islamic kingdoms, made any efforts to regress that imbalance. [/quote'] Firstly, it may not upset you that temples were destroyed by Muslims, but it does matter to many Hindus. Secondly, I was speaking about muslims in India. In India, there was zero progress in math and science during muslim dominance. Its all about what muslims did in India, not in Arabia, that matters. Muslim rule in India was a disaster in terms of technological advancement and was marked by continuous conflict.

if anything, most indian rulers have been obsessing with the reconstruction of temples and other places of worship which were well, nothing but a massive waste of resources and means to exploit the local population and haul in money in wheel barrows.

That does not justify demolishing temples. Muslims could have built their mosques at some other place, instead of destroying temples.

as for point 7, that is self determination. there have been countless incidents in the history of india where muslims and hindus were at logger horns, and thus, as a means of self preservation, muslims chose to have a country of their own (one that they could frack up with absolute independence). i must ask one thing of our pakistani brothers... there is a general sentiment amongst you guys that you are 'superior' or failing that, 'stronger' and more 'robust'... then why did they not feel that they could handle their own amongst hindus? were they scared of the scrawny, 'dal eating', inferior hindus? tsk tsk.

But is it not true that there are 13% muslims in India currently, they did not all migrate to pakistan. In 1947, the muslim majority areas became another country. In Kashmir where muslims are in majority, they want independence. So it is natural that a Hindu may ask why the responsibility to keep the country together falls only on the shoulder of Hindus and other non-Muslims, not Muslims. Is secularism meant only for areas with Hindu majority, while fundamentalism is acceptable in Kashmir where muslims are in majority?

[Texy]

no need to waste your time.... THX doesn't bother going back into the part of history where Hindus got abused and slaughtered and force fully converted and made to pay to triple the tax under Islamic rule

[Macj]

Remember Hindus were not people of the book and hence the Jizya tax was imposed very harshly, not only that but their lives were constantly under threat.When Islamic rule came over a certain area - property was immediately confiscated and temples destroyed and large population transfers to Hindu ruled areas took place. Now the likes of THX will scoff at such destruction deeming it inconsequential but in towns and villages across Hindu India , temples were the focal point of trade, industry and commerce. By destroying the means of commerce people starved to death.

[THX_1138]

Oh boo hoo you who bemoan the loss of the ancient relics and temples with meaningless idols. Temples in medieval india were often beacons of everything that has gone wrong with the philosophy of hinduism: they became centers for accumulating wealth. Idols made of gold and other precious metals, embedded with jewels; all at the expense of a marginal society where often the poor peasant was coaxed into making 'offerings' at his/her local temple in hope of a better harvest. These temples were the engines of the caste system and they were instrumental in creation of social hierarchies so rigid that contemporary india is still left to wrestle with their demons. What particular benefit did these temples serve? None. Were they places of learning? Not unless regurgitating thousand year old literature is deemed learning. Were they centers of science or mathematics? Far from it... after the Gupta civilization, science and mathematics were relegated to the doldrums of society and the presence of islamic kings who aggressively persecuted science that was not consistent with their punk **** mumbo jumbo, it was this period that led to our slide down the slipper slope of decadence, stagnation and vulnerability. True, these temples were particularly dear to those who had sentiments attached to them, but frack that! Just about everything these age old scriptures have to say is either borrowed or has been found to be rather impractical. not to mention that there are better alternatives that do not require half as much self imposed, ritualistic suffering! If you must believe in some supernatural entity in the face of conflicting evidence, there is little i can say that will prevent you from changing your views, but I for one, do not regret the demolishing of meaningless houses of wealth that did not serve a single purpose. I say destroy them all... burn all the scripture, melt all the idols, blow up all the stones... start with that engine of hatred and misogyny that resides in the middle east, then head a little north to israel, and thereafter, take a sharp turn to the east.

[THX_1138]

Firstly, it may not upset you that temples were destroyed by Muslims, but it does matter to many Hindus. Secondly, I was speaking about muslims in India. In India, there was zero progress in math and science during muslim dominance. Its all about what muslims did in India, not in Arabia, that matters. Muslim rule in India was a disaster in terms of technological advancement and was marked by continuous conflict. That does not justify demolishing temples. Muslims could have built their mosques at some other place, instead of destroying temples. But is it not true that there are 13% muslims in India currently, they did not all migrate to pakistan. In 1947, the muslim majority areas became another country. In Kashmir where muslims are in majority, they want independence. So it is natural that a Hindu may ask why the responsibility to keep the country together falls only on the shoulder of Hindus and other non-Muslims, not Muslims. Is secularism meant only for areas with Hindu majority, while fundamentalism is acceptable in Kashmir where muslims are in majority?

a very valid point, and honestly i dont have an answer for you. prior to 1947, all these talks about a shelter for the muslims was nothing but a farcical dog and pony show by the muslim league, that i view as a collection of individuals who wanted influence and power to match their ambition, but were not versatile enough to advance through the ranks of the indian national congress.

[THX_1138]

This is horse pucky, it is a known fact that Arabs copied a lot of their Mathematics from Sanskritic treatises of Indian mathematicians and astrologers. Read about Brahmaguptas mathematical treatises and how they found themselves in Arab lands as an e.g. Secondly the conquest of Sindh and the conquest of Al Andalus happened in the same century , knowledge transfer between east and west thus was far quicker. In fact Arabs use Al Hindsa to describe certain areas of Mathematics that came from India (From Hind)

you need to find me a source for this. i feel it is you who is not granting adequate acknowledgment. but as always, i would like to know if what i have known to be accurate is indeed inaccurate.

[THX_1138]

Firstly' date=' it may not upset you that temples were destroyed by Muslims, but it does matter to many Hindus. Secondly, I was speaking about muslims in India. In India, there was zero progress in math and science during muslim dominance.[b'] Its all about what muslims did in India, not in Arabia, that matters. Muslim rule in India was a disaster in terms of technological advancement and was marked by continuous conflict. That does not justify demolishing temples. Muslims could have built their mosques at some other place, instead of destroying temples.But is it not true that there are 13% muslims in India currently, they did not all migrate to pakistan. In 1947, the muslim majority areas became another country. In Kashmir where muslims are in majority, they want independence. So it is natural that a Hindu may ask why the responsibility to keep the country together falls only on the shoulder of Hindus and other non-Muslims, not Muslims. Is secularism meant only for areas with Hindu majority, while fundamentalism is acceptable in Kashmir where muslims are in majority?

true, but i am not contesting that am i? i am stating that the destruction of the medieval india's temples and their subsequent looting was not something worth our pity or consideration.

[Macj]

you need to find me a source for this. i feel it is you who is not granting adequate acknowledgment. but as always' date=' i would like to know if what i have known to be accurate is indeed inaccurate.[/quote'] Read the link in my post and then you can delve deeper into the specifics that were plagiarized by the Arabs. Regarding temples, yes they were a place of learning, you see unlike today learning wasnt sequestered , but a holistic concept where Mathematics , Science and Theology all flowed in unison.

[Online]

Isnt this a religious discussion? Wasn't BossBhai heckled out of here for the very same reasons?

[Macj]

Isnt this a religious discussion? Wasn't BossBhai heckled out of here for the very same reasons?

Talking about destruction of temples is a political discussion about the desecration of religious entities.

[graphic23]

Oh boo hoo you who bemoan the loss of the ancient relics and temples with meaningless idols. Temples in medieval india were often beacons of everything that has gone wrong with the philosophy of hinduism: they became centers for accumulating wealth. Idols made of gold and other precious metals, embedded with jewels; all at the expense of a marginal society where often the poor peasant was coaxed into making 'offerings' at his/her local temple in hope of a better harvest. These temples were the engines of the caste system and they were instrumental in creation of social hierarchies so rigid that contemporary india is still left to wrestle with their demons. What particular benefit did these temples serve? None. Were they places of learning? Not unless regurgitating thousand year old literature is deemed learning. Were they centers of science or mathematics? Far from it... after the Gupta civilization, science and mathematics were relegated to the doldrums of society and the presence of islamic kings who aggressively persecuted science that was not consistent with their punk **** mumbo jumbo, it was this period that led to our slide down the slipper slope of decadence, stagnation and vulnerability. True, these temples were particularly dear to those who had sentiments attached to them, but frack that! Just about everything these age old scriptures have to say is either borrowed or has been found to be rather impractical. not to mention that there are better alternatives that do not require half as much self imposed, ritualistic suffering! If you must believe in some supernatural entity in the face of conflicting evidence, there is little i can say that will prevent you from changing your views, but I for one, do not regret the demolishing of meaningless houses of wealth that did not serve a single purpose. I say destroy them all... burn all the scripture, melt all the idols, blow up all the stones... start with that engine of hatred and misogyny that resides in the middle east, then head a little north to israel, and thereafter, take a sharp turn to the east.

Whether the temples may or may not have stood for the stuff you mentioned, one cannot deny that some (if not all) were superb pieces of architecture. I've read and seen some stuff that built in Krishnadeva Raya's kingdom - in Hampi, and some temples in western Karnataka - the sculptures are just phenomenal. Our artists (musicians, sculptors, painters, etc.) all showed off their expertise in praise of Hindu idols or Hindu Gods, and it is unfortunate that the people who destroyed them only saw the Hinduism aspect and couldn't see the art behind it. For that, I'm sad that there were a lot of them destroyed.