Desi Cartman Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 I am quoting your post here, but I guess the reply would be equally applicable to desi and 99.94's posts. I, nor most here, are remotely suggesting that everyone or even majority of the Aussies are racists. However, what I've noticed a very strong defense mechanism which pops up in Aussies when discussing racism. I've been in the US for many years now and would have no problems in accepting that pockets of the US are racist. Not New York, not coastal California, but I have experienced racism in the interiors first hand. Does it make US a racist country? I would say no, but it certainly shows that racism has been far from eradicated here. The problem by all accounts is more acute in Australia. Just look at cricketing examples - McGrath, Lehmann, the crowd. All have been guilty of racism. It's not going to go away by pretending everything is fine. And yes, the roots lie in legacy of institutionalized racism and is not going to go away anytime in the near future. It took Germany years to get rid of it when did I say anything else ... No one is defending Aus , the reaction you see from Sree is different from mine since he lives in Adelaide and the number of attacks in adelaide in last 12 months = 0. I accept racism, I even said that cops arent helping , I have been attacked , dont come here .. still you think im defending ? I very openly say that if I had done bachelors in IT , I would have gone to the US but since I wasnt eligible , I had canada , Aus & UK as only options. BTW one can even go to the US if you are filthy rich but how does this all come into this discussion is beyond me ... Does this mean that people who do engg from IIT are engineers and REC etc are all for losers ? Aus has some good universities and some time pass unis which help you get points to apply for PR. Bottom line, Aus needed people to move here and pay for it and Indians did it
fuub Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 Australia is a weird choice for Indian students, its a choice for loser Indian students. Those that dont get aid in US universities choose Australia just TGTFO. The returns on an American education is much better than that on an Australian education. Just saying. i agree its a choice for loser indian students especialy since its got little to do with quality of education and more to do with trying to get permanent residency
Desi Cartman Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 Attacks so often on Indians in the recent past definetely not random acts of violence. Canada had it's share of racism attacks couple of decades ago' date=' [b']but it was limited to verbal abusing & some fist fights..that's about it. now it is all very quiet here, a truly multicultural country to live in. at this moment Austrialian scene is inhuman towards fellow desis. yaar its same here as well. last few attacks are still under investigation, thats where I and sreee agree that Indian media is assuming its racist without knowing all facts. Last year an Indian reporter was attacked and Times now assumed racist attack that too on press , after 24 hrs the reporter said that an indian attacked her. Times Now withdrew the news, Im saying show all u want to show but dont assume or if u want to assume then say "WE are assuming its a hate crime". Most racist attacks are to annoy and harass Not to kill. The attacker also knows that the consequences if he is caught are very different if he kills.
Desi Cartman Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 i agree its a choice for loser indian students especialy since its got little to do with quality of education and more to do with trying to get permanent residency and how is Canada any different and how is even US any different when it comes to students who are not going to the top schools ? I dont think all desis move to the US to work for NASA or research, most if not all want to have a good lifestyle. If you mean its ok to do that in US but not in AUS then I dont know
fuub Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 im mainly referring to the cooking and hairdressing courses. i dont believe people would travel to another country just for the famed hairdressing education, maybe paris for cooking??? i dont want to be demeaning to people in those industries but it seems clear to me the only intention of going to australia to do a hairdressing course is to accumilate work experience hours then apply for permanent residency.
EnterTheVoid Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 Without commenting on these specific attacks on Indians too much' date=' which on the surface do appear to have at least some racial motivation, I would comment upon the nefarious racist policies of Australia just till 30 odd years back. [b']They had institutionalized racism till that time, kids from aborigines were taken away by the government, and immigration was only for whites. If someone thinks that all these practices can be eradicated from the minds and hearts within a generation then are living a pipe dream. Lets begin by getting one thing straight; There is absolutely no connection between those racist policies of the past and the current attacks on Indian students, absolutely none whatsoever. Accept this or you will be going round and round in circles without addressing the problem By constantly citing the excuse of institutionalized racism, as you term it, you are essentially saying this; The country was found on racist undertones and once a racist, it will always remain a racist, so these attacks should not come as a surprise to anyone. If you are the victim of a racist attack, you report it to the police not blame EVERYONE as is being currently done because that they will erase people's sympathy for you completely. My reaction is different to Desi's because I live in a different city and there are minimal or no attacks.
Desi Cartman Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 im mainly referring to the cooking and hairdressing courses. i dont believe people would travel to another country just for the famed hairdressing education' date=' maybe paris for cooking??? i dont want to be demeaning to people in those industries but it seems clear to me the only intention of going to australia to do a hairdressing course is to accumilate work experience hours then apply for permanent residency.[/quote'] yaar its ok for BBA to MBA in canada/US and live a normal life in Texas but since someone wants to do hairdressing and get a PR n live in AUs , it makes it wrong. I dont get it. If u mean that ppl are just doing to get into Aus , then I agree thats why the govt has been shutting down all dodgy cookery type schools in since last 8-10 months
Desi Cartman Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 http://www.smh.com.au/national/two-questioned-over-burnt-body-of-indian-worker-in-griffith-20100109-m03q.html This is what Im talking about, this Indian man died sometime ago and now they are closer to finding out who did it, thats where press needs to relax when they dont have confirmed reports
I_India Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 How many Indians and how many Pakis in Aus? If many Pakis are there then how come they are avoiding these attacks? Any insight?
Guest Gunner Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 How many Indians and how many Pakis in Aus? If many Pakis are there then how come they are avoiding these attacks? Any insight? Pakiz will fight fire with fire. Indians are physically weak and will never counter attack because they are scared.
Guest Gunner Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 I, nor most here, are remotely suggesting that everyone or even majority of the Aussies are racists. However, what I've noticed a very strong defense mechanism which pops up in Aussies when discussing racism. I've been in the US for many years now and would have no problems in accepting that pockets of the US are racist. Not New York, not coastal California, but I have experienced racism in the interiors first hand. Does it make US a racist country? I would say no, but it certainly shows that racism has been far from eradicated here. The problem by all accounts is more acute in Australia. Just look at cricketing examples - McGrath, Lehmann, the crowd. All have been guilty of racism. It's not going to go away by pretending everything is fine. And yes, the roots lie in legacy of institutionalized racism and is not going to go away anytime in the near future. It took Germany years to get rid of it I doubt whether they have completely managed to be rid of it. Scratch the surface and you will find it in many German cities. But on the surface of it, Germany has done a remarkable job of turning it around.
fuub Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 Pakiz will fight fire with fire. Indians are physically weak and will never counter attack because they are scared. would a young australian thug be able to tell the difference between an indian/pakistani/srilanka/bangladesh walking past on a street? i doubt it
EnterTheVoid Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 Direct, no BS answers to hard hitting questions that are on everybody's lips; ************** 1. Is Australia racist ? No 2. Does racism exist ? Yes 3. Were these attacks racist ? Yes 4. Is Australia as racist as it is being portrayed ? No 5. Is the India media at fault ? Yes, they are automatically branding every attack on Indians racist without fully verifying the facts; 6. Should I come to Australia ? Yes, avoid Melbourne for the timebeing. Other major cities are safe enough 7. What if I live in Melbourne ? Move to safer suburbs 8. Indians in Australia, how are they coping ? Fine, alert but not alarmed 9. What can I do to stay safe ? Avoid dangerous suburbs, don't go alone at night, don't draw attention to yourself 10. International students from other countries, are they safe ? Same rules apply to them. 11. Why are only Indians attacked ? Large Indian population in Melbourne, initial attacks weren't taken seriously, Indians were than identified as soft targets. 12. Who are carrying out these attacks ? Whites, gangs of youth from different nationalities, lebanese, arab, aboriginals ***************
I_India Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 Pakiz will fight fire with fire. Indians are physically weak and will never counter attack because they are scared. O Rly? Pakis and Indians are racially same. Maybe Pakis are more streetwise though.
Desi Cartman Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 More desi students started to come here after late 90s cuz families in India were doing better. The number increased sharply once the property prices tokk of around 2003. Paks couldnt get visa easily after 9-11 , financial situation isnt well in pak so not many paki students come to Aus. I would say the ratio is 50 Indians to 1 pakistani.
I_India Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 Is it true that if you go to Aus to study then you automatically get permanent residence?
Desi Cartman Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 Is it true that if you go to Aus to study then you automatically get permanent residence? No. There are some skills for which getting PR is a little easier ( or at least used to be ) like Accountancy or IT but one needs to masters in it but then there are/were schools which make it easier than passing NIIT courses although the students from those schools never find a job in IT and end up driving cabs. In the last 2 years the rules have been changed significantly, trust me now they make people study for 2 years then wait for outcome of PR application for 12-24 months and then grant a visa of 18 months to work in the in the field of study for 12 months out of 18. Its nearly impossible to get a PR unless u decide to work in a remote area or u have a relative willing to sponsor or you have skills listed under demand list like Hair-dressers or Doctors etc .
Mr. Wicket Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 Without commenting on these specific attacks on Indians too much' date=' which on the surface do appear to have at least some racial motivation, I would comment upon the nefarious racist policies of Australia just till 30 odd years back. They had institutionalized racism till that time, [b']kids from aborigines were taken away by the government, and immigration was only for whites. If someone thinks that all these practices can be eradicated from the minds and hearts within a generation then are living a pipe dream. Worth noting that the boldfaced part of it is a clear violation of the Genocide Conventions as well. http://www.un.org/millennium/law/iv-1.htm
Desi Cartman Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 Worth noting that the boldfaced part of it is a clear violation of the Genocide Conventions as well. http://www.un.org/millennium/law/iv-1.htm Well the PM did say sorry about it ( in 2008 I guess) ... but is against compensation ... :giggle:
Indus_Army Posted January 10, 2010 Posted January 10, 2010 They are coming here to get residency and have a better lifestyle not to learn cooking I would take those guys anyday over the Faujis! If people use legal channels to further their goals, they will atleast be accounted for, in case something happens to them. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/7507064.stm
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