Murali Kartik, Pragyan Ojha, Amit Mishra

[thevortex]

For tests, I think it would be good to have a classical wrist spinner. Hence Mishy (when in-form) should be picked - even over bhajji if only 1 spinner For ODI, Mishy vs SLA is a closer call. We'd anyway have them warming the bench in most ODIs. MSD prefers HS + Jadeja. T20- M.Kartik deserves a call up Chawla will play with h4te & flemingo

Mishra is nobody's definition of a classical wrist spinner, fineleg! Also please dont get influenced by his performances in T20 games. He is, by nature, a defensive bowler. His bowling is built around the perimeter of not being hit. In Test matches, that does not work. You will have to get batsmen out even if they are defending for their life. And here Mishra fails miserably.

Mishra Ojha Karthik same order for all formats

Please tell me you are joking with placing Mishra as well as Ojha above Karthik! By the way, does nobody here have a doubt about Ojha's action? He does straighten his elbow at the point of delivery as far as I have been able to notice. Anybody else?

[achilles]

Chawla probably got recommendation from Preeti. He is only going to warm the bench anyway. They could have rather chosen Bhoomika chawla.

:hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::hysterical:

[f.b.m]

Mishra is nobody's definition of a classical wrist spinner, fineleg! Also please dont get influenced by his performances in T20 games. He is, by nature, a defensive bowler. His bowling is built around the perimeter of not being hit. In Test matches, that does not work. You will have to get batsmen out even if they are defending for their life. And here Mishra fails miserably. Please tell me you are joking with placing Mishra as well as Ojha above Karthik! By the way, does nobody here have a doubt about Ojha's action? He does straighten his elbow at the point of delivery as far as I have been able to notice. Anybody else?

Yeah, he does chuck a bit. Not as much as Botha or Harbhajan (in dart-topspinner mode) but it is quite noticeable and the chucking is even more pronounced when he's bowling to the left handers. And for the record, I dont think that Mishra is a defensive legspinner by choice anyway. His technique of bowling his stock legbreak is quite screwed up (at least its not by the book) and just ends up being a defensive bowler (unless he's bowling googlies). Its a technical thing, imo.

[gaurav92]

Um... he's not born in South Africa.

:hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::hysterical::hysterical: Now talking about second Spinners, I think Mishra is a classical leggie, so no doubt that Mishra will be the next best choice for spinner after Bhajji when it comes to Test. In ODIs, we already have Jadeja as our second choice, so we cant pick Ojha/Murali.I d pick Mishra ahead of Bhajji, if the pitch has some bounce. In T20s, it will be a close call between jadeja and Murali, i would like to strengthen the batting rather than looking for a good bowling option, so if i have to pick one spinner, it will be Bhajji and the next choice again would be Jadeja.I would like to see Murali Karthik ahead of Bhajji in T20s, he is a good bowler for T20s, he has the experience in T20s, Bhajji can be taken to the cleaners, once he gets his line wrong, and with one six, we all know Bhajji looses all his rythm and feels the pressure

[thevortex]

Yeah, he does chuck a bit. Not as much as Botha or Harbhajan (in dart-topspinner mode) but it is quite noticeable and the chucking is even more pronounced when he's bowling to the left handers. And for the record, I dont think that Mishra is a defensive legspinner by choice anyway. His technique of bowling his stock legbreak is quite screwed up (at least its not by the book) and just ends up being a defensive bowler (unless he's bowling googlies). Its a technical thing, imo.

Glad at least somebody else is noticing that kink in Ojha's action. Yeah, about Mishra if his action is like that there is not much he can do. But then he also does not throw the ball up above the eyeline of the batsman. Warne does that even in T20! Not that everybody has to do exactly as Warne does but Mishra definitely is a defensive bowler. Given a choice between another decent spinner and a defensive leg spinner I will always go for the former. Leg spin as an art is almost wasted if practiced defensively. Consider me biased for I actually bowl leg spin in the league cricket I play. :)

[f.b.m]

Glad at least somebody else is noticing that kink in Ojha's action. Yeah, about Mishra if his action is like that there is not much he can do. But then he also does not throw the ball up above the eyeline of the batsman. Warne does that even in T20! Not that everybody has to do exactly as Warne does but Mishra definitely is a defensive bowler. Given a choice between another decent spinner and a defensive leg spinner I will always go for the former. Leg spin as an art is almost wasted if practiced defensively. Consider me biased for I actually bowl leg spin in the league cricket I play. :)

As a leg spinner would know, you cant just throw the ball up in the air and expect to be penetrative. He doesnt get enough topspin on his stock ball to have any effect if he does flight it. The thing that is at the root of all this is his grip which the great Laxman Sivaramakrishnan tried to address last year. When he did (this was in the Mohali test against England) he magically became a better, more attacking bowler. He has gone back to the crap that he used to bowl for some inexplicable reason. Btw, I'm a leg-spinner in league cricket too...

[ViruRulez]

where has Chawla gone in the title .. why is he left out when the thread was about Mishra, Ojha and Chawla :hitler: Frankly speaking I dont find any of the spinners brilliant. We somehow seem to have forgot the art of spin which we used to specialize. Even Venkatpati Raju looks like a master infront of these bits and bieces bowlers. For me, Murali Karthik is the best bet but age is not on his end but I dont think age should be much of a concern for spin bowlers. For ODIs, I would still go with Jadeja as the fifth bowler/second spinner .. for T20s I would go with Kartik and for tests I would go with Ojha/Mishra .. I also find Mishra too defensive and Ojha has been much effective and so I would perhaps go with Ojha .. anyways Ojha has been given lesser opportunity but he has performed very well in every test he was given a chance. Till the next few years to be quite frank another spinner would not get chance easily in ODIs/T20s unless it is a turning track where we need two specialist spinners .. the second spinner would do nothing except warming the benches in those two formats .. the only place where another spinner might be accommodated is tests and I think Ojha should be given the chance now .. Mishra's average is 72 against South Africa and 203 against SL and 42 against England which are not something he can justify for his inclusion .. he is anyways 27 years old and if the team management is looking for youngsters and hence neglecting Kartik then I dont see much reason of banking on Mishra too as he is not that young anymore .. Piyush Chawla is the youngest and on second thought he might not be a very bad bet either ... we need to try out a few spinners till we find great spinners like Jumbo and co. in the last generation

[thevortex]

As a leg spinner would know, you cant just throw the ball up in the air and expect to be penetrative. He doesnt get enough topspin on his stock ball to have any effect if he does flight it. The thing that is at the root of all this is his grip which the great Laxman Sivaramakrishnan tried to address last year. When he did (this was in the Mohali test against England) he magically became a better, more attacking bowler. He has gone back to the crap that he used to bowl for some inexplicable reason. Btw, I'm a leg-spinner in league cricket too...

Good to meet a fellow leggie. Always a pleasure. We should compare notes some time. There are multiple things wrong with Mishra - in my opinion. The first is his approach which is at an angle and his release point at the crease which is always wide of the wicket. He does not vary this - at all. Not in Tests, not in limited overs, not ever. His bowling arm is also quite close to his right ear which means that while he has a high arm, he is not really going to get any real drift into the right hander. That also means that his away spin will be both limited and predictable. Perhaps Mishra understood that his googly and his top spinner have to be his greatest strengths. Regularly he tends to get wickets with those balls and very rarely with his stock ball. However these are not among his biggest mistakes. The biggest one undoubtedly has to be one of temperament. A leg spinner who is not fast through the air like Kumble absolutely as to master the art of drawing a batsman out of both his shell and his crease. For that he has to occasionally float the ball around the eyeline of the batsman. Mishra is a defensive bowler - out and out. He never throws the ball up as he is mortally afraid of being smashed. I am afraid with that kind of fear he cannot become a very good leg spinner - leave alone a great one. A traditional leg spinner will have to cop punishment. That is the name of the game! :). And in the process he will get you wickets. Thats how it works. Multiply whatever I said a few times. That is how bad Piyush Chawla is. At least Mishra turns the occasional leg spinner appreciably. Chawla can hardly ever get a batsman playing and missing with his stock ball - especially if the batsman is in his crease.

[Gunner_Mania]

Murali Kartik made his first significant contribution as Somerset's overseas player as they completed a nine-wicket victory over Warwickshire at Taunton. Playing in only his second County Championship match for the county, the Indian left-arm spinner took 6 for 61, including five third-day wickets, as the visitors crumbled from an overnight 111 for 3 to 207 all out shortly after lunch.

http://www.cricinfo.com/countycricket2010/content/story/460990.html

[thevortex]

As somebody above said, I really hope Murali Karthik gets to play at least for England. He is too good a bowler to be wasted in this fashion.

[saneindian]

As somebody above said' date=' I really hope Murali Karthik gets to play at least for England. He is too good a bowler to be wasted in this fashion.[/quote'] Murali Kartik is no Bedi. Yes he is a very good classical spinner with a lovely action and good control, but in terms of results (taking wickets) he hasn't done much to force his way into the Indian team. Be it his stints in county cricket , ranji cricket or even IPL, he hasn't taken enough wickets to come in ahead of Bhajji or the others liek Mishra, Ojha and Ashwin. He has had his stints with team India, didn't do much except for that 6 wicket haul against Aussies. AT 34 , he isn't getting younger, so why not promote someone like Ojha ahead of him.

[Lord]

Mishra for all forms

[saneindian]

Mishra seems to have put on a lot of weight post IPL. Was already a bad fielder , now with this paunch he will become worse. Kirsten isn't going to be happy at all. Mishra is surely in trouble unless he picks truckloads of wickets.

[bhajji]

rather going for murali and all i would certainly stick to Bhajji, the best off spinner among Indian cricket tem

[thevortex]

Murali Kartik is no Bedi. Yes he is a very good classical spinner with a lovely action and good control, but in terms of results (taking wickets) he hasn't done much to force his way into the Indian team. Be it his stints in county cricket , ranji cricket or even IPL, he hasn't taken enough wickets to come in ahead of Bhajji or the others liek Mishra, Ojha and Ashwin. He has had his stints with team India, didn't do much except for that 6 wicket haul against Aussies. AT 34 , he isn't getting younger, so why not promote someone like Ojha ahead of him.

Believe me 34 is not a bad age for spin bowling by any stretch of imagination. Consider me biased but I think spinners like fine wine mature very well with age. :) And oh by the way look at his records over the years. In Ranji as well as in the county circuit. He is a genuine match winner. On all surfaces. When looking at domestic performances, one needs to consider the weak team he plays for. So he may not get as many opportunities as somebody like Mishra who plays for Delhi. On principle I do not like Ojha because I think his action is doubtable. Well, Harbhajan's action too is the same. We badly need new blood in the spin department. But we dont have it. Sad story.

[thevortex]

Oh by the way, Murali Karthik certainly is today's Bedi. As far as can be. He is the world's best left arm spinner - by a distance. And to the Vettori fans - I am sorry, but he is the world's best defensive left arm spinner. Beyond perfection for limited overs matches. But once the batsmen start defending and building innings, he is ineffective.

[diegovegaz]

rather going for murali and all i would certainly stick to Bhajji' date=' the best off spinner among Indian cricket tem[/quote'] ashwin>>bhajji

[saneindian]

Believe me 34 is not a bad age for spin bowling by any stretch of imagination. Consider me biased but I think spinners like fine wine mature very well with age. :) And oh by the way look at his records over the years. In Ranji as well as in the county circuit. He is a genuine match winner. On all surfaces. When looking at domestic performances, one needs to consider the weak team he plays for. So he may not get as many opportunities as somebody like Mishra who plays for Delhi. On principle I do not like Ojha because I think his action is doubtable. Well, Harbhajan's action too is the same. We badly need new blood in the spin department. But we dont have it. Sad story.

Really? Railways have been in the semis of the Ranji trophy in at least 3-4 seasons in the 2000s. Last 2 years haven't been good for them as a number of their players moved to ICL, but till 2007 they were one of the most consistent teams. First class record 151 matches, 502 wickets @26, Those are good numbers but nothing great. BTW is he was as good as Bedi, why couldn't he produce the goods when he got his chances with team India?

[thevortex]

Really? Railways have been in the semis of the Ranji trophy in at least 3-4 seasons in the 2000s. Last 2 years haven't been good for them as a number of their players moved to ICL, but till 2007 they were one of the most consistent teams. First class record 151 matches, 502 wickets @26, Those are good numbers but nothing great. BTW is he was as good as Bedi, why couldn't he produce the goods when he got his chances with team India?

Why would you say that? He has a decent career record. Lets not forget that he was always the number 3 option as far as spinners go. That is not a complaint. Just a statement of fact. And as such could only play when there was sufficient spin in the pitch to field 3 spinners. For most of his career.

[saneindian]

Why would you say that? He has a decent career record. Lets not forget that he was always the number 3 option as far as spinners go. That is not a complaint. Just a statement of fact. And as such could only play when there was sufficient spin in the pitch to field 3 spinners. For most of his career.

Nothing against Kartik as such. He was/is a good bowler , no second thoughts about that.