Guest dada_rocks Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 Kabloee , Difference between US and PP ... One of the mods from PP came here few months ago made some anti-India anti-Hindu comments and when me and Dada started answering his posts he quietly made an exit without even trying to substantiate his claims. But those posts still exist. The same has happened to couple of other PP Posters.... point is if I go onto your board and even make factually correct statements about your country/religion .... I can guarantee you they will not last for more than 5 minutes. That right there is the difference between us. You dont have to take my word... take a test drive yourselves. Me DR Anakin and some others take a lot of flak for our views .... but we back up what we say with facts .... something that never happens when it comes to our turn in asking some pointed questions. Precisely. Anyway my stand is clear pick any rules edict regulations only thing I expect is the same thing to be applied across the board. And I am no juvenle delinquente who needs to win online debates to massage his ego like our resident communazi clown who weaves meandering tale of words when asked to substantiate the garbage he spews. Opinions are worth crap whether it's mine or yours unless u can substantiate it with facts. And yes anecdotes/similes might pass as an argument in high-school debates but certainly has no place whatsoever in objective adult-talk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gator Posted June 13, 2007 Author Share Posted June 13, 2007 Lurks... i see ur point trying to compare them with the nris view of bollywood here... but why would the same guys there who claim they dont watch, and again rather foolishly post in some other thread about the latest blockbusters... thts a dead giveaway.... but u made a valid point about where the hate comes from.. i can understand tht...afterall, the promised land was supposed to be much better, otherwise the existence of tht land is futile... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dhondy Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 Being a Pakistani (from Karachi, and a regular visitor of the "passion" website), I feel obliged to respond. I don't quite have the time to fully organize my thoughts but I will post some responses to things said in the thread. The article is, as others have pointed how, biased. Is "Muslim culture" prevalent in Karachi? Of course, it is in an Islamic nation. That being said, the whole concept of being forced to act certain ways is not something you see there. Plenty of people go out and socialize and do everything you would see happening in any other country (some of which I disapprove of but, hey, it's not my business). The situation in Karachi currently is quite volatile. I think the timing of this visit is quite unfortunate as Pakistan is going through a time where we could see some major positive changes coming out of this whole judicial crisis. The assertion that after 7 pm, the streets are deserted is preposterous. Go to clifton beach (in the heart of Karachi) on a late weeknight and you will see the place packed. The social scene is not lacking at all in my opinion. As for the little jibe at "the passion website," I maintain that the anti-India bias there is far less than the anti-Pakistan bias here. Of course, my opinion is hardly unbiased but neither is any of yours. I myself can't stand Bollywood movies, it's just not my cup of tea. But many Pakistanis love them. My brother watches them regularly, as does my mom. A visit to Karachi will clearly show how incredibly popular they are in Pakistan. The chances of getting into a conversation about the latest Bollywood movies in Karachi are very good. A large percentage of Pakistani love Bollywood movies and have no problem admitting it. Finally, I just want to say that I make no qualms about my feelings towards India. There is a certain level of animosity there. That fact bugs me, that I would have that feeling towards a whole nation like that, but I live with it and have come to a point where I can truthfully say I have no problem with Indians (I have met enough nice ones) as individuals. The fact that the feeling is generally mutual on both sides only perpetuates the feeling it. PS: Again, I know the post really jumps all over the place but I don't have time to really organize my thoughts at the moment. Very well written and honest. I enjoyed reading that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ram Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 Being a Pakistani (from Karachi, and a regular visitor of the "passion" website), I feel obliged to respond. I don't quite have the time to fully organize my thoughts but I will post some responses to things said in the thread. The article is, as others have pointed how, biased. Is "Muslim culture" prevalent in Karachi? Of course, it is in an Islamic nation. That being said, the whole concept of being forced to act certain ways is not something you see there. Plenty of people go out and socialize and do everything you would see happening in any other country (some of which I disapprove of but, hey, it's not my business). The situation in Karachi currently is quite volatile. I think the timing of this visit is quite unfortunate as Pakistan is going through a time where we could see some major positive changes coming out of this whole judicial crisis. The assertion that after 7 pm, the streets are deserted is preposterous. Go to clifton beach (in the heart of Karachi) on a late weeknight and you will see the place packed. The social scene is not lacking at all in my opinion. As for the little jibe at "the passion website," I maintain that the anti-India bias there is far less than the anti-Pakistan bias here. Of course, my opinion is hardly unbiased but neither is any of yours. I myself can't stand Bollywood movies, it's just not my cup of tea. But many Pakistanis love them. My brother watches them regularly, as does my mom. A visit to Karachi will clearly show how incredibly popular they are in Pakistan. The chances of getting into a conversation about the latest Bollywood movies in Karachi are very good. A large percentage of Pakistani love Bollywood movies and have no problem admitting it. Finally, I just want to say that I make no qualms about my feelings towards India. There is a certain level of animosity there. That fact bugs me, that I would have that feeling towards a whole nation like that, but I live with it and have come to a point where I can truthfully say I have no problem with Indians (I have met enough nice ones) as individuals. The fact that the feeling is generally mutual on both sides only perpetuates the feeling it. PS: Again, I know the post really jumps all over the place but I don't have time to really organize my thoughts at the moment. Excellent Post... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CC1981 Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 but we back up what we say with facts Bwaahahahahah. Facts ?! Sorry but your idea of what is/isnt 'fact' is on par with Bin Laden's idea of what is/isnt fact! I've continuously answered your so-called 'facts', from a much much more knowledgable position than yourself and yet you run away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CC1981 Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 PS: CC go study at this rate given the moorn u are u will hardly be able to finish even ur under-grad. Stop bsing. Thanks for your concern but i am already done my Ugrad. PS: Kabloee, welcome to this board- i can safely say that you are saner than some of the hinduvta elements that hounds us here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dhondy Posted June 13, 2007 Share Posted June 13, 2007 Go easy with the aggro, CC.:teeth_smile: This is a friendly forum. No fisticuffs, please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MundaPakistani Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 The same has happened to couple of other PP Posters.... point is if I go onto your board and even make factually correct statements about your country/religion .... I can guarantee you they will not last for more than 5 minutes. That right there is the difference between us. That's not saying much because PP's policy is totally different from ICF's. As it has been pointed out by the ICF mods themselves that they let the POSTERS take responsibility for what ever they say e.g DSR continuously abuses Islam yet his posts are never deleted now if some one of PP comes out abusing Hinduism in a way that DSR abuses Islam then his/her posts will immediately be deleted and the person will be warned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MundaPakistani Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 One of the problems seems to be that there are SOME people(on both side) who LOVE to be HATED by people from across the border...these are the people that cause problems and our goal should be to make sure that they don't get what they love! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CC1981 Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 one of PP comes out abusing Hinduism in a way that DSR abuses Islam then his/her posts will immediately be deleted and the person will be warned. And if someone abuses islam in PP, their posts are immediately deleted, person is banned while abuses towards hinduism is tolerated....how is it different ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 That's not saying much because PP's policy is totally different from ICF's. As it has been pointed out by the ICF mods themselves that they let the POSTERS take responsibility for what ever they say e.g DSR continuously abuses Islam yet his posts are never deleted now if some one of PP comes out abusing Hinduism in a way that DSR abuses Islam then his/her posts will immediately be deleted and the person will be warned. You know Faisal there is so much exaggeration in your post than facts. We are not here to emulate PP type moderation. We don't believe we should be moderating forums as it is done else where. As for DSR's islam abuse, I would like you to point out to us the posts. You don't expect us to scan every post on this busy forums. It is impossible to moderate each and every post. If you have problem with a post and if you think it is an abuse you should use the option that is available in each post to report it. Besides we have asked our regular posters to go easy on religious topics. Hopefully in future we will see less abuses if at all there are any. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MundaPakistani Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 MP we have been thru this before .... Remember there was another poster(I forget his name) who had a problem with DRs views and we asked him to list them out in a seperate thread ? Soon after I created that thread .... the guy quitely vanished ... it took a lot of coaxing to get him to list out ONE single post from DR that he had an objection with and the reasons from both parties ... needless to say DR stood around and the guy from PP went awol .... Why talk about others I have asked you many times to list out what you constitute as abuse and wrong information ... only to see no responses. If you are so certain about what we say is wrong stand up and corroborate your point. Its my promimse that I will take corrective measures. Just running around crying foul doesn’t constitute as defence. I have already expressed my POV...remember when you posted the link to the freedomfaith website and i clarified all the issues now if you don't want to accept anything that i said then there is nothing that i can do. You know Faisal there is so much exaggeration in your post than facts. We are not here to emulate PP type moderation. We don't believe we should be moderating forums as it is done else where. Yes and that's your choice...it's quite evident that you all have worked very hard to make this place move forward so you have every right to run it in the way that you like. Similarly on PP we run things our way and are not as lenient as you guys. As for DSR's islam abuse, I would like you to point out to us the posts. You don't expect us to scan every post on this busy forums. It is impossible to moderate each and every post. If you have problem with a post and if you think it is an abuse you should use the option that is available in each post to report it. Besides we have asked our regular posters to go easy on religious topics. Hopefully in future we will see less abuses if at all there are any. Well clearly he takes a jab at Islam at every opportunity...if you remember he created a thread titled "Jaffer ruins his century by performing a Sajda"...now admittedly almost every one bashed him for making such a silly comment but still the thread wasn't deleted. So when BB says that his harsh posts on PP(which at times seem to be wind up posts) are immediately deleted it's simply due to the overall policy that we have on the forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CC1981 Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 Ok...now can we stop this 'my dik > your dik' type PP vs ICF comparisons ?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kablooee87 Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 I will say this much: I find dada_rocks posts to be the most demeaning and hate filled posts on this forum. I can't point out exact posts to you because I haven't been keeping track, but that's just the way his posts have come off. I'm sorry if DR takes offense to that, but that's how I've interpreted most of his posts regarding Islam/Pakistan. I don't like it but I also understand that it's his opinion and I just have to deal with it rather than going after him in some sort of childish attack. In the end though, it comes back to my original point. It doesn't really matter. Most users on this forum (and PP for that matter) and too well set in their opinion in issues like that for it to actually matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaurav Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 I will say this much: I find dada_rocks posts to be the most demeaning and hate filled posts on this forum. What about my posts? Are they not bad? :tounge_smile: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dhondy Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 This is just unnecessary publicity for that site, I am afraid. I would recommend it myself if it were any good, but it largely isn't. The Pakistani posters who post here are the best of the lot, certainly the most tolerant and intrepid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dhondy Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 That's not saying much because PP's policy is totally different from ICF's. As it has been pointed out by the ICF mods themselves that they let the POSTERS take responsibility for what ever they say e.g DSR continuously abuses Islam yet his posts are never deleted now if some one of PP comes out abusing Hinduism in a way that DSR abuses Islam then his/her posts will immediately be deleted and the person will be warned. Not true, MP. You are an integral member of this site...how can you say that? Can you give even a single example of this kind of thing? I thought it was transparently obvious that there are no deletions and almost no warnings or bans on this site, a bit too laissez-faire perhaps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CC1981 Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 So when BB says that his harsh posts on PP(which at times seem to be wind up posts) are immediately deleted it's simply due to the overall policy that we have on the forum.And that is the essential crux of the difference that you are not appreciating. You say that Islam gets jabbed here by many and that nonsense isn't tolerated at PP at all. But do you have muslims there discussing Islam and criticising an idea/tenet etc ? Hardly. There was only one thread i noticed (i hvnt been there for years i just did a quick search in OT) that discussed whether sharia was just to all or not. Here, you have criticism of hinduism by hindus and non-hindus alike too- hell, i've been vocally against some aspects of hinduism here and my stuff still survives in the OT. And you surely can't call me a total muslim basher either- coz i get called muslim bootlicker from the other side... What you or PP does not get is that there is a difference between criticism and denigration. What you or PP does not get is that if ANY topic is closed to criticism or critical analysis, then it becomes a BLIND DOGMA. What you or PP do not get is that it is a very useful & important lesson to train yourself to hear thy/thy beleif's criticism. Not shut it out. And surely you cannot think that moderation there is more consistent- while there is little or any jibe vs Islam tolerated there, there are snippets of jibs denegrating everyone else throughout PP- with 'racist aussie' comment to ' weak hindu' comments. I agree that this site has a large volume of Islam's criticism than any other criticism but that is because of the demographics of the site. But in terms of level of criticism tolerated, all are pretty equally tolerated. I've made comments akin to 'if you are saying this, then by your logic, Krishna was a man-slut' and its still here...that is about as critical of hinduism as any of Islam in here. What we try to cut out is denigrating name-calling. In short, i hate to say this but PP is far more closeminded than ICF is - and this is as objective and factual an observation as it gets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dada_rocks Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 I will say this much: I find dada_rocks posts to be the most demeaning and hate filled posts on this forum. I can't point out exact posts to you because I haven't been keeping track, but that's just the way his posts have come off. I'm sorry if DR takes offense to that, but that's how I've interpreted most of his posts regarding Islam/Pakistan. I don't like it but I also understand that it's his opinion and I just have to deal with it rather than going after him in some sort of childish attack. In the end though, it comes back to my original point. It doesn't really matter. Most users on this forum (and PP for that matter) and too well set in their opinion in issues like that for it to actually matter. I have had one to one with baadshaha and quasimodoand none of those two folks cud substantiate their charges on the contraray they disapepared.. if u are interested we can have one to one but am afraid u too will disappear and I don't want this place to lose one more member so I will live with those charges.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dada_rocks Posted June 14, 2007 Share Posted June 14, 2007 Talking of PP's tolerance I was banned just because I questioned MIG in one of my avtaar's there..Here u can call a mod moron and still be around:giggle: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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