Meanwhile, the chucker gets another 5'fer

[yoda]

calling murali a cheat is like saying it is illegal to drive at 65 mph in the US cause once upon a time speed limit used to be 55.

[The Outsider]

I didn't see a single doosra in the Oval test match clipping.

[Bumper]

I dont see any doosra in the Predz's clip. But when he started bowling doosra is moot. Clearly he is a MUCH BETTER bowler with doosra in his arsenal. All ramblings about legalities aside, i dont think his doosra is a fair delivery (he almost turns it like a leg break). If Murali stops bowling that contraversial delivery today, he wouldnt be half as effective. I would really like Murali to be filmed bowling his doosras in real match situations as opposed to some lab in Australia.

[King]

LMFAO ! Keep reading your match-reports. I seriously doubt you watched that match' date=' BTW. I did...and I found the video of that 9 wicket haul. [url']http://www.veoh.com/videos/v284897kYm5y6rf?searchId=1661721519565991597&rank=0 Watch it. Tell me, which ball is he delivering from around the wicket ? :haha: ...and those are just the balls which took wickets. He bowled that doosra every other over in that match. First time i saw him bowl that delivery - he didn't use it when India played SL in 97

That was one fantastic spell, awesome. It's not just the huge turn but the speed at which it turns makes it really hard for the batters. I've seem Murali bowl in the nets closely and I can assure you he doesn't look as bad as he does when on TV. BTW there was not one doosra in that clip you posted. Every ball in that clip was an offiie.

[Gaurav]

murali the great...keep it going...we are all proud of you...:thumbs_up:

Why are you proud of him? Do you hold his hand when he bowls? :hysterical::P

[yoda]

Why are you proud of him? Do you hold his hand when he bowls? :hysterical::P

proud cause he is from our part of the world. some of us are still proud of where we come from. :wink_smile:

[gator]

proud cause he is from our part of the world. some of us are still proud of where we come from. :wink_smile:

aha... tht explains the defence...

[yoda]

aha... tht explains the defence...

nah, two different topics. defense of his action is cause it is legal. proud of him cause he is from the sub-continent (minus the jihadists).

[gator]

nah' date=' two different topics. defense of his action is cause it is legal. proud of him cause he is from the sub-continent (minus the jihadists).[/quote'] no need for explanations.... i got it...

[Ram]

I dont see any doosra in the Predz's clip. But when he started bowling doosra is moot. Clearly he is a MUCH BETTER bowler with doosra in his arsenal. All ramblings about legalities aside, i dont think his doosra is a fair delivery (he almost turns it like a leg break). If Murali stops bowling that contraversial delivery today, he wouldnt be half as effective. I would really like Murali to be filmed bowling his doosras in real match situations as opposed to some lab in Australia.

I would really like to know on what basis you call the doosra or for that matter any of murali's deliveries as illegal. I dont understand the law. But i do know that a law that was written eons ago , is ill-equipped to deal with all situations. So , passing judgments on a bowler which in itself isnt that sophisticated is very unfair.

[gator]

I would really like to know on what basis you call the doosra or for that matter any of murali's deliveries as illegal. I dont understand the law. But i do know that a law that was written eons ago , is ill-equipped to deal with all situations. So , passing judgments on a bowler which in itself isnt that sophisticated is very unfair.

ok, here is the deal.... i dont think, steroids were used as a supplement back when the laws were written... but then, they were added to prevent people taking unfair advantage.... back then, they didnt know, a guy will come and spin the ball a mile cos u can do tht with ur arm bent without having to straighten it... now, we tried to stop him... but no, the ultra-rich friggin indian board, the SL govt, everyone in the subcontinent got in, with the same mentality tht most of u have.... tht he is from our region...

[Ram]

ok, here is the deal.... i dont think, steroids were used as a supplement back when the laws were written... but then, they were added to prevent people taking unfair advantage.... back then, they didnt know, a guy will come and spin the ball a mile cos u can do tht with ur arm bent without having to straighten it... now, we tried to stop him... but no, the ultra-rich friggin indian board, the SL govt, everyone in the subcontinent got in, with the same mentality tht most of u have.... tht he is from our region...

Thats a VERY simplistic view of things i would say. The bending-arm thingy was first incorporated in the chucking rule so that faster bowlers couldnt chuck away and bowl due to increased arm speeds. How can you apply the same logic to a spinner who releases the ball from either the top or the side of the hand ?

[gator]

The bending-arm thingy was first incorporated in the chucking rule so that faster bowlers couldnt chuck away and bowl due to increased arm speeds. How can you apply the same logic to a spinner who releases the ball from either the top or the side of the hand ?

u cant.... tht is my contention, when his defenders give mcgrath's straightening degree and compare it with Murali..... secondly, spinners dont benefit from straightening their arm.... they benefit from keeping their arms bent... while the law only measures and looks for the straightening... the change to the law which was required was shot down by politics before it could even take shape....

[Ram]

secondly, spinners dont benefit from straightening their arm. they benefit from keeping their arms bent...

Every bowler ( be it a fast bowler or a spinner) HAS to straighten his arm to generate momentum for the ball to travel the 22 yards it has cover. Only, the law says the straightning shall not occur AFTER the arm has reached shoulder level. There is obviously a compromise here. The cricket gurus realized that almost all bowlers straightened the arm to generate ball speed , but to stop chuckers , concluded that straightning of the arm ABOVE shoulder level is illegal.

while the law only measures and looks for the straightening... the change to the law which was required was shot down by politics before it could even take shape....

As i told before , the chucking law was for fast bowlers , then how can you label murali illegal based on that ? What aspect of Murali's action do you think is illegal ? And which law change are you talking about ?

[yoda]

no need for explanations.... i got it...

you compare drug cheats with him, no, you don't get it.

[Sachin_Rulez]

Those who have been saying that murali had never bowled any doosra before 2004 are clearly living in some lala land. If I remember correctly, murali infact bowled one leg-break (perhaps in mohali) when Indian batsmen were pounding him during SL tour of India 97-98. (his doosra during that time was still in its infancy though...) Later when India toured SL in 2001, by that time Murali had lot of variety in his bowling. He used to get the ball dirft away from right hander, starightens after pitching, etc..... Just read the below two articles published in sportstar magazine http://www.hinduonnet.com/tss/tss2437/24370120.htm (Sep 15-21, 2001 ) "There was just a hint of bounce on day one, but Murali exploited this to perfection, getting the ball to both spin away from the right-hander, straighten into him, and drift away from him. There was the occasional leg-break thrown in as well." and http://www.hinduonnet.com/tss/tss2502/25020420.htm (Jan 12-18, 2002) "Indeed, Warne's awesome leg-breaks, trademark flippers and sizzling top-spinners pose searching questions, while Muralitharan's heady mix of deadly off-spin, the straighter one, the arm ball and the away spinner has made him Predator No. 1 in recent times." Though its true that it (doosra or whatever) hasn't become official until 2004

[The Outsider]

Later when India toured SL in 2001, by that time Murali had lot of variety in his bowling. He used to get the ball dirft away from right hander, starightens after pitching, etc.....

SR, every off spinner worth his salt has a top spinner and arm ball. The doosra is something completely different and while I am not sure when Murali started applying it on a regular basis it wasn't till much later in his career and he was the last among Saqlain, Harbhajan, and himself to use it which would put it around the 2002 mark.

[gator]

http://www.hinduonnet.com/tss/tss2502/25020420.htm (Jan 12-18, 2002) "Indeed, Warne's awesome leg-breaks, trademark flippers and sizzling top-spinners pose searching questions, while Muralitharan's heady mix of deadly off-spin, the straighter one, the arm ball and the away spinner has made him Predator No. 1 in recent times."

Mars-man.... i would like ur response on this one...

[Ram]

Mars-man.... i would like ur response on this one...

I saw that Gats. My only contention is , is the "away going delivery" bowled the same way as the doosra is ? As Shwetabh has mentioned, any good spinner will have the these weapons in his arsenal anyway. Remember, Murali's doosra was banned in may of 2004. If and indeed he started bowling it in 2002 , then i dont know how they could have possibly allowed to bowl it for over 2 years. Anyways, this article is the first time i have seen proof that Murali bowled the "away going delivery" even in 2002. IF it is the doosra , then i admit to have made a mistake in saying that Murali started bowling the doosra maybe in late 2003.