Is it really worth it?

[yoda]

Re: Is it really worth it? Lurker your pics are absurd. Yes, Sehwag is out of shape. But to say that we need a bunch of Andrew Symonds or else we shouldn't compete makes no sense. We are different races, DUH!

[yoda]

Re: Is it really worth it? There will always be stress and expectations when you have a widely followed sport, albeit only from a few countries. That said, we don't know why Bob passed away. It is best not to speculate as it can lead to wild theories. No, there isn't an excuse for stoning player's houses or shooting them if they don't perform to expectations. Such actions and illegal and have no place in a decent society.

[Lurker]

Re: Is it really worth it?

Lurker your pics are absurd. Yes, Sehwag is out of shape. But to say that we need a bunch of Andrew Symonds or else we shouldn't compete makes no sense. We are different races, DUH!

Humko maloom hai jannat ki haqeeqat lekin dil ke khush rakhne ko Ghalib ye khayaal accha hai. What has RACE got to do with being fit? The only reason why Indians, in general, are unfit is because of their lifestyle. An Indian who eats well, has a discplined lifestyle has as much chance of being fit as any other race. Now of course if one doesnt have enough discipline to get out of bed and do an hour of exercise everyday it becomes very easy to throw the RACE card. Look let me make something very clear here. I am NOT supporting players house getting attacked or coaches getting so much criticism that they have to pay with their life. Not at all. What I am arguing for is the amount of effort an average Indian(or Pakistani) fan puts in towards cricket, does he get the kind of return he should? Let me put 2 simple questions to everyone reading this. 1) Has Indian cricket overall achievement since arrival on world scene makes for a very positive reading? 2) Have the amount of time/money/passion that YOU as a fan has invested in Indian cricket, has that got the right return? My answer to both is NO. Heck South Africa post 1992 has pehaps achieved more than what we have in our entire history(excluding a WC win). Chokers or not I am willing to bet that Saffers Test and one day wins would be as many as India has over the years(and certainly better percentage wise). In my opinion it is not worth it for the FANS and maybe we need to get our spoiled brat of players down to earth. xxxx

[Mandrake]

Re: Is it really worth it? Its definitely not worth being fanatical about the game so much that it leads you to stone someone's home...that's barbaric.As players these guys are under lot of pressure...but then that's part of the sport....they need to learn to handle that.Like all high paid,high profile jobs pressure is part of the package.For us fans,we need to enjoy it as a sport and move on.Yes,its only a game ...its the 'religion' part of it which creates problems.So...enjoy the game,win...loss...life goes on.

[Predator_05]

Re: Is it really worth it?

So what do I expect from my cricketers? For one I would like them all to be whipped in shape. Mother effers make the most amongst the cricket playing countries and how do they look? For a professional sportsperson they are all a disgrace. Starting from Sachin and ending at Yuvraj. If it is not some shoulder injury something else will fall apart. But as they say pictures do not like. Just look at this Indian picture. Now look at this Who do you think would make for a better fielder, fitter bowler, faster running between the wickets? And I have not put pictures of the likes of Sehwag yet. So is it worth it? Not for a Indian cricket fan. Its better to put the time, money and effort on something else..atleast that will ensure an early retirement, and perhaps healthier heart too! xxxx

LMFAO !!! I have read some ridiculous things on this board before, but i never expected something like this from one of the best posters on ICF. Lurker, you have got to be sh*tting me ! Since when does a person's physique or looks determine what kind of cricketer they may become ? The argument is so absurd that i don't know why i am even responding to it. Hell, i suppose that even I would be better off playing for India now than Sachin Tendulkar because i hit the weights every other day, have shredded muscles and a six pack. Tell me Lurker, what do you make of cricketers like Viv Richards then ? He was a proper lard-@rse wasn't he ? Didn't stop him from smacking the ball around and winning two World Cups ? What about some of the Aussie cricketers from the 80's and 90's ? Allan Border, Dean Jones, David Boon, and Mark Taylor to name a few ? Were they six packs or kegs ?! Did Ranatunga's mother effing physique ever stop him from winning his country a World Cup ? Has a rounded physique deterred Shane Warne from becoming the greatest spinner ever in the history of cricket ? hmmm ?

[The Outsider]

Re: Is it really worth it? Predator, I can see where Lurker is coming from and you are missing the point. Sure, having a better physique and fitness is not going to hone one's cricketing skills. But good fitness will improve fielding, running between wickets, and the propensity to get injured frequently. However, I am not sure what kind of a physique is best suited for which aspect of cricket. I have noticed fit fast bowlers to be generally lean and not necessarily muscular. Thats just a layman observation and best left for the professionals to decide what kind of fitness regimen suits whom. But one thing is for sure, excess fat can NEVER be good unless you are stranded in the Sahara or the Arctic.

[Predator_05]

Re: Is it really worth it? No, i am not. The premise of Lurker's argument was that cricketers in better shape would, and i am quoting him here --> "make for a better fielder, fitter bowler, faster runners between the wickets". I think he is completely off the mark with that.

But good fitness will improve fielding, running between wickets, and the propensity to get injured frequently. However, I am not sure what kind of a physique is best suited for which aspect of cricket. I have noticed fit fast bowlers to be generally lean and not necessarily muscular. Thats just a layman observation and best left for the professionals to decide what kind of fitness regimen suits whom. But one thing is for sure, excess fat can NEVER be good unless you are stranded in the Sahara or the Arctic.

Excess fat does limit you somewhat as far as fielding and bowling is concerned, but it would never hinder a spinner or a batsman. You know that. ...and if being fit (i mean fit in terms of how Lurker would probably define it, ie; muscle) then explain to me how cricketers like Shane Watson, Bond, Shoaib and many others have failed to sustain themselves over a long period of time ? That argument holds no water.

[King]

Re: Is it really worth it? I'm with Predator on this one. Fitness sure is required but a lot of times it is overstated. It is not the muscle power or the good looking 6 pack that helps a cricketer but agility, stamina and endurance does. Any day Rahul Dravid or a Laxman will do 10 times better than your Symonds or Watson in testing conditions. Moreover for all that great looking body have you guys ever wondered how often they break down? Even over excercise causes injuries if people did not know.

[The Outsider]

Re: Is it really worth it?

and if being fit (i mean fit in terms of how Lurker would probably define it, ie; muscle) then explain to me how cricketers like Shane Watson, Bond, Shoaib and many others have failed to sustain themselves over a long period of time

I dont agree with Lurker's defintition of fitness. Fitness in cricket is more to do with being lean, suple, and agile. Thats just my observation based on guys like Azhar, Jadeja, Kaif, Ponting, Rhodes, Kapil, Hadlee, McGrath, Lee etc. Dont think beefing up with muscles helps in cricket except to biff the ball like Symonds. On the other hand as you pointed out muscular bowlers have been very injury prone. Even Pathan when he beefed up for the '04 Aussie series started getting injury problems.

[Bumper]

Re: Is it really worth it? IMO, being fit and agile is far more important than being muscular. If being muscular lets u be fit and agile, am all for it. Tho, there are examples for every type of cricketer: Ponting is very fit, athletic but not muscular Symonds is both muscular & athletic Shoiab Akhtar is just muscular but not athletic Danish Kaneria is neither muscular nor athletic. Rahul Dravid is fit, neither muscular, nor athletic Go figure :hic: Its easy to come up with examples to justify your points. I hope i have added enuff confusion to the discussion :hic:

[Gaurav]

Re: Is it really worth it? I am not defending Lurker as he can speak for himself but surely fitness is very important. By fitness I don't mean "HE MAN" like muscular body. I mean cardio fitness, lean key muscles that aid the sport you play. Sure Ranatunga, Shane, Boon etc performed well despite being lard asses but the argument can be made that if they were fitter they could have taken more wickets, scored more runs, run more singles, fielded better etc etc. I will pick a talented fit player over a talented lard ass any day.

[Gaurav]

Re: Is it really worth it?

IMO' date=' being fit and agile is far more important than being muscular. [/quote'] Well being fit and agile comes by exercising (I am not talking about meat head type of muscle building). Being fit and agile does not come by being a fatty lard ass and eating ladoo and khir for breakfast, lunch and dinner :hic:

[Guest dada_rocks]

Re: Is it really worth it?

What has RACE got to do with being fit?

It has got to do with athleticism do some googling u will know.. am too numb to do it on ur behalf and post

[Gaurav]

Re: Is it really worth it?

What has RACE got to do with being fit?

It has got to do with athleticism do some googling u will know.. am too numb to do it on ur behalf and post

Agreed but surely it's better to be the fittest that your racial make up allows you to be rather than use that as a license to be a lard ass :hic:

[veer]

Re: Is it really worth it? so what is this thread about?? death always changes perspective of life.... specially in sports.. but after some times everything comes back to normal.. sorry but thats life..

[Gaurav]

Re: Is it really worth it? This is what Bob chacha said about fitness- Taken from PP interview. "For years fitness in asian cricket has been of minor importance and slowly other countries have pulled past Pakistan and India in performance because they are stronger and fitter, faster and more atheltic. This has nullified Pakistan and India have relied on talent for too long and they need to catch up. If I were to explain the fitness parameters simply. There are levels of aerobic and anaerobic levels, Upper body and stomach, leg strength and speed. All these are important to catch up to teh Australia's and South Africa's of the world. The biggest example of how fitness can improve your game is Fredddie Flintoff."

[Guest dada_rocks]

Re: Is it really worth it?

What has RACE got to do with being fit?

It has got to do with athleticism do some googling u will know.. am too numb to do it on ur behalf and post

Agreed but surely it's better to be the fittest that your racial make up allows you to be rather than use that as a license to be a lard ass :hic:

Abhi main mood mein nahin hun nahin to can u list me few players who have played ten years of uninterrupted cricket without missing a match like (1) kapil (2)Sachin every player is not sehwag tendulkar is as fit as an indian player could be heck i would say more fit than those steroid-monkeys that have been mentioned. just do a comparison of number of years of cricket played and number of games missed due to injury.. I am not sure many if any can beat sachin and kapil

[Gaurav]

Re: Is it really worth it?

What has RACE got to do with being fit?

It has got to do with athleticism do some googling u will know.. am too numb to do it on ur behalf and post

Agreed but surely it's better to be the fittest that your racial make up allows you to be rather than use that as a license to be a lard ass :hic:

Abhi main mood mein nahin hun nahin to can u list me few players who have played ten years of uninterrupted cricket without missing a match like (1) kapil (2)Sachin every player is not sehwag tendulkar is as fit as an indian player could be heck i would say more fit than those steroid-monkeys that have been mentioned. just do a comparison of number of years of cricket played and number of games missed due to injury.. I am not sure many if any can beat sachin and kapil

Hum steriods monkey ki bate nahin kar rahe thee. Lurker kar raha tha. Hum simple fitness ki bate kar rahen hain :lmao: Tendu has kept himself in reasonable shape so I think he is not a bad example anyway. Kapil seemed pretty fit to me during his playing days as well.

[Lurker]

Re: Is it really worth it? I would like to address all those critics of my fitness theory here in this post.

When I look back now and see the pictures it's obvious that I was out of shape. The newspapers called me all sorts of name - I was a porker, a fat sloger. you name it. This was a very low period of my life and I questioned if whether it was all worth it. The root of my problem was down to my lifestyle. Cooking isnt a lot of fun for me and it was so easy to go out and get a takeaway.You could walk out of your flat and within minutes there was chip-shops and kebab houses. When I look back now it is clear I lost sight of what I was doing and what I should have been doing. Keeping fit and training hard has now become a major part of my life. The trick is to have a routine and that is what I have now. I still do not look forward to doing it, and sometimes I still dig my heels in but once I come out I feel pretty good about myself. When I look back I am not very proud of how I turned my career around although I am not too proud of having to turn it around in the first place!

Taken from "Being Freddie" by Freddie Flintoff. The above excerpts was one that flashed infront of my eyes when I saw some people take pot-shots at fitness. What kind of makes it come full circle in a most weird way is that Bob Woolmer was one person who always suggested to keep fit and one example he always gave as to how fitness can make a player go from good to great was the turnaround achieved by Flintoff. English fans would remember how he went from a "Fat Lad" to a Fiery Fred. But why should we have English examples? Lets take our own backard now. Virendra Sehwag. Did his greatest run, in test or one day cricket, come when he developed a pot pelly? Or did his large scores happen at a time when he was more fit? Who amongst us thinks today that Sehwag(of today) has the fitness and stamina to compile another 309? You surely have got to be kidding me. Zaheer Khan. His bowling went down the tube the moment his spare tire/love handles came out. Yeah he huffed and puffed to 130s and shouted at Chappell for his outster but the fact is that he was hardly fit. The moment he was sent to English county, played enough cricket, he lost weight, gained rhthym and now he breaks into high 130 and early 140s without breaking a sweat. He is the first person who says how fitness has helped him. Even look at Saurav Ganguly, his resurrgence has not only been due to mental hunger, I personally think he has looked his best in a long long time. Oldtimers would remember how the greatest of players started losing their game once the weight came on their body. Gundappa Vishwanath was a shadow of his self towards the end, the reflexes were still there but the body was just not chugging along. In the history of cricket there has been NO team that has dominated, that which is NOT fit. The West Indies of 70s 80s were marvellous physical specimen. You looked at Viv Richards and you felt an awe for his sheer presence. Every fast bowler was obviously in great shape. Even the batsmen, Greenidge, Haynes, Lloyd etc were physically very fit. No surprises then that their fielding was top class. Aussies of today(or 90s) have players like Watson, Hayden, Symonds who would look fit to walk on a ramp. And even the lesser mortals Ponting, Clarke, Langer, Mcgrath are anything but fit. Sure there are exceptions - like Warne - but I have no doubt that if a team has to be the best in world cricket they also have to be one of the fittest, if not the fittest. And here is my issue with fitness of our players that fans havent quite understood(or maybe I was not very expressive) - These are the players who have access to the best facility in the country, best personal trainers, best diet, supplements, doctors etc. So what exactly is their excuse for not being fit? xxx

[vroomfondel]

Re: Is it really worth it?

Gambit Wrote: It's in our blood. It's not just some form of entertainment for us. It is a matter of national pride and honour. A medium to cover for our failings, whatever we may have, as a nation. Every victory is celebrated as a personal success and every loss is depressing. It unites the country. There is a sense of togetherness. Yes, you,I, the paanwala, the rickshaw wala, everyone is behind 11 Indians today. They are representing us and our nation in front of the world. They have to win. They must. So what if my boss shouted at me today? So what if I'm close to financial ruin? So what if my wife ran away with the dhobi wala? 11 of my countrymen will ease my pain. They will make sure that atleast my dignity and pride is intact and that I can walk with my head held high. Defeat is simply not an option. It will push me over the edge. THAT is cricket for us.

Post of the Week, Gambit. This is how it is, whether we like it or not. Ironically, people who derive their livelihoods from the sport -- coaches, players etc. -- probably have the greatest perspective on the game. They understand that loss is part of any sport and know that it's not the 'end of the world'. As Gangs recently said, there's a lot more to life than just cricket. It's part of the reason I think that Bob's death is not purely because of the 'stress' of the loss to Ireland. It makes for great copy to say that a comitted coach died of heartbreak. But I think, medically, it's more a case of an unfit (at least in physical appearance) diabetic's untimely demise -- Dhondy et. al., feel free to obliterate my naive assertion. It could easily have happened even as Pakistan qualified for the Super 8. Woolmer went through the 'tied' WC match with SA, and the match fixing scandal, and the death of Hansie -- that was all stress, and I would like to think that he was used to handling what cricket dished out at him. That said -- I will think twice before ever calling players uncomitted, or calling for castrations with rusty knives, justified or not. I hope our beloved effigy burning industry also takes note.