Desi Cartman Posted January 12, 2009 Posted January 12, 2009 Who rules India? Sunday, September 14, 2008 By Aakar Patel Political power in India has shifted from the three upper castes to the fourth 'middle' caste through elections since 1952. A parallel cultural process has blurred identities within that fourth caste and it no longer sees itself as defined in Hindu doctrine. Hindu doctrine defines four castes: Brahmin, Kshtriya (warrior) and Vaishya (merchant) are the upper castes, which are twice-born. The fourth, Shudra, is the peasant caste, banned from learning, but not untouchable. Everyone who is not of these specific castes (Dalits, Muslims, Christians) is outside the caste system and an untouchable, by doctrine. In 1950, the Constitution of India abolished doctrinal Hinduism, under Articles 15 and 17. Article 15 opens up free access for all citizens to all public places, including "wells, tanks, bathing ghats...". Article 17 abolishes untouchability. The Supreme Court of India ruled that it was not necessary to be Brahmin to officiate at temples, ending a 3500 year monopoly. In terms of population, about 50 per cent of all Indians would be Shudra, but a cultural process known as Sankritization has led to Hindus, especially Shudras, rejecting their lower caste and defining themselves in terms of Jati or sub-caste, through which they claim higher status. India's Constitution was finished on November 26, 1949 and adopted on January 26, 1950, Republic Day. After India's first general election in 1952, the structure of power was not dissimilar to what came before it. However, over decades of elections, the structure has changed; one could say it has inverted itself. In the years after Independence, the most populous states of India were ruled by upper caste chief ministers, who were in power in 13 out of these 15 states. Ten of these chief ministers were Brahmin. At the centre, India had a Brahmin prime minister (Nehru) and a Brahmin president (Dr Rajendra Prasad). The man considered the nation's leader, Gandhi, was of the merchant caste. In Uttar Pradesh, India's largest state, the chief minister was Pandit Govind Ballabh Pant (Brahmin). Today the state of UP, with a population of 190 million, is headed by a Dalit woman, Mayawati. It is possible she will become prime minister after the next elections, the first untouchable to hold that position. Politics in Maharashtra, India's second biggest state with 97 million people, is dominated by Marathas, a peasant caste that claimed martial ancestry through enlistment in the Muslim armies of the Deccan, and then through ruling large parts of India after the collapse of the Mughals. The state's first chief minister (YB Chavan) and current one (Vilasrao Deshmukh) are both Marathas. Bihar's first chief minister was from the warrior caste, Sri Kumar Sinha. India's third biggest state with a population of 83 million, it is ruled today by a leader of the Other Backward Classes (OBC) Nitish Kumar, who is a Kurmi peasant. India's fourth biggest state is West Bengal, with 81 million people. Its current chief minister is Budhdhadeb Bhattacharya of the CPM. He is a Brahmin, the only one on this list, though being Communist he denies caste. The first chief minister of his state was PC Ghosh, from a caste that defines itself by its sub-caste, Kayastha but is actually part of the peasantry. The fifth biggest state in India is Andhra Pradesh, with a population of 78 million. Its first chief minister was VN Menon, a Brahmin. Its current chief minister is a Christian from an OBC caste, YSR Reddy. Next is Tamil Nadu with 68 million people. Its leader is the fiery Dravidian leader Karunanidhi, whose party's identity rose from an anti-Brahmin, anti-Aryan movement. Tamil Nadu's first chief minister, founder of the Dravidian political movement, was CN Annadurai, who came from a caste of weavers. Madhya Pradesh's first chief minister was Pandit Ravishankar Shukla, a Brahmin. Today its leader is the BJP's Shivraj Chouhan, of the warrior caste. The state's population is 62 million. The first chief minister of Rajasthan, home of the Rajputs and with a population of 58 million, was HL Shastri, a Brahmin. Today the chief minister is a woman, and a Maratha, the BJP's Vasundhara Raje Scindia. Martial Rajputs accept her because she is from a family of Marathas that ruled over large parts of central India. Her patronymic 'Raje' is from Raja, and Scindia is a corruption of the Marathi name Shinde. Gujarat has a population of 55 million and its first chief minister was Dr Jivraj Mehta, from the merchant caste and married to a Brahmin. Narendra Modi, its current leader, is from an OBC caste of oil pressers, called Ghanchi in Gujarati. Despite coming from an OBC caste, and one that is not populous, Modi has retained his power by owning a Gujarati identity rather than a caste-based one. The dominant caste in Gujarat is the peasant community of Patels. Karnataka with 54 million people also has a BJP government, with BS Yeddyurappa of the Lingayat community as its current chief minister. The Lingayats are followers of a 12th century saint who preached ecumenical Hinduism, and the group rejects caste. In India, naturally, they are The-caste-that-rejects-caste. The first chief minister of Karnataka was also Lingayat, K Hanumanthaiah. The eastern state of Orissa with 38 million people was headed first by a Brahmin, Hare Krushna Mahtab, and now by Naveen Patnaik of the caste of merchants. Kerala in the south has 32 million people and its first chief minister was the Brahmin EMS Namboodiripad, a Communist. The current chief minister is also Communist, VS Achuthanandan of the OBC caste of Ezhavas. Assam in the north-east has 27 million people. Its first chief minister was Gopinath Bordoloi, a Brahmin. It is headed currently by Tarun Kumar Gogoi, from an OBC caste. Punjab has 26 million people and its first chief minister was Dr Gopi Chand Bhargava, a Brahmin. Since the mid-60s it has been ruled by the Sikhs, most of the peasant caste of Jats including the incumbent, Parkash Singh Badal. Haryana has 21 million people. Its first chief minister was a Brahmin, Pandit Bhagwat Dayal Sharma. Since the 70s (the state was formed when East Punjab was divided in 1966) the state has been ruled mostly by Jats of the peasant caste. The present chief minister is Bhupinder Singh Hooda, also a Jat. The oligarchy of Nehruvian India has come to an end, and the bottom caste has seized power. Even the BJP, India's party of Hindu high culture, has been forced to shift its position. Its ideologues and founders were Brahmins from SP Mookerjee to Vajpayee. The RSS is entirely Brahmin from its ideologues - Savarkar, Hedgewar, Golwalkar, Upadhyaya - to all its chiefs, except one. But the BJP has been forced from within to cede power to middle and lower caste leaders because religion is not an identity for Hindus as much as first sub-caste and then language are. English-speaking Indians, most of whom would be from upper castes, have removed themselves from politics. They first lost their position as the middle and low castes pressed their democratic advantage through elections. Then, as the economy changed, they exited politics fully because they did not need to depend on the state any longer. In India, the state offers protection and employment, the two promises politicians hold out to their supporters. Upper-caste, English-speaking Indians are not vulnerable to India's mindless violence and do not depend on the state for employment. Political discourse in India is emotional and cannot deliver itself in English. But the language of governance is English. from The News (pak)
Guest dada_rocks Posted January 12, 2009 Posted January 12, 2009 Dr Rajendra Prasad was kayasth not brahmin.. Bihar's firct CM Shri Krishan Sinha was bhumihaar brahmin not of warrior caste i.e rajput..
Lurker Posted January 12, 2009 Posted January 12, 2009 Dr Rajendra Prasad was kayasth not brahmin.. Bihar's firct CM Shri Krishan Sinha was bhumihaar brahmin not of warrior caste i.e rajput.. Ex Bihar CM KB Sahay was also a Kayastha. By the way why are we highlighting Kayastha again? :nervous:
Desi Cartman Posted January 12, 2009 Posted January 12, 2009 ^ because its an article from across the borer so thats why they investigated who was kshatriya and was brahmin...
Lurker Posted January 12, 2009 Posted January 12, 2009 ^ because its an article from across the borer so thats why they investigated who was kshatriya and was brahmin... Oh. Galti wahin pe ho gaya. Across the border article will concentrate on Brahmin nonsense. Fact is it hardly matters in India.
Desi Cartman Posted January 12, 2009 Posted January 12, 2009 Oh. Galti wahin pe ho gaya. Across the border article will concentrate on Brahmin nonsense. Fact is it hardly matters in India. but it shows how most states were lead by high caste Hindus and now its not .. IMO caste should not matter education , experience , leadership qualities should ... :orderorder:
fineleg Posted January 12, 2009 Posted January 12, 2009 .. IMO caste should not matter education ' date=' experience , leadership qualities should ... :orderorder:[/quote'] exactly
Guest dada_rocks Posted January 12, 2009 Posted January 12, 2009 Ex Bihar CM KB Sahay was also a Kayastha. By the way why are we highlighting Kayastha again? :nervous: are yaar wo upar wali article mein galat information diaa hai ki rajendra prsad barhmin the.. i was just correcting it
Guest dada_rocks Posted January 12, 2009 Posted January 12, 2009 Ilaiyya talks similar nonsense, as per him Gandhji was killed because he was taking over brahmin dominance.. nobody told this mororn if that was the case then he wud have been killed earlier nto when he already had attained whatever he wanted and had gone into political retirement. Another nonsense of Ilaiyya is that Swami Vivekanand is not respected by hindutva group and when he died he was quite healthy and there was some brahmanical conpsiracy in Swami vivekananad's killing.. Someone tell thsi mororn in RSS sakha Vivekanad is by far the most talked about most respected figure..
Guest dada_rocks Posted January 12, 2009 Posted January 12, 2009 Interesting question but as usual cop-out answer ANAND: At one level the hindutva movement has forced itself upon the dalits in a better way than say the communist/ leftist movement. The BJP has more dalits, shudras and women at different publicly important positions -- as spokespersons, in party/ cabinet posts etc. -- unlike the CPI/ CPM where top jobs are still reserved for only upper-caste men. ILAIAH:The CPI-CPM have to now rethink their understanding of the caste and hinduism questions. The question also is not how many SCAs or women get to the top positions in an organisation. The question is one of decasteing the hindu temples and the religion as such... this is the key to the removal of caste inequalities. If the RSS wants to foreclose thinking among the people on this front, that is because it is a casteist, status-quoist formation. The communists thought that that since they [personally] are not going to the temples, the 'temples do not exist at all'; they have neither assessed nor understood the role of hindu religion and brahmanism in Indian history... Now they must think about it. http://www.ambedkar.org/News/hl/Interview%20with.htm
sandtest Posted January 12, 2009 Author Posted January 12, 2009 I don't buy this propaganda BS of communists and Kaangressis that BJP or Sangh promotes Brahmins.It is in fact opposite. RSS has many non-Brahmins, SCs, OBCs as their Shakha heads. Majority of Karsevaks who participated in Ayodhya movement were not brahmins but belonged to each and every section of India. Hinduism has a philosophy to unite India irrespective of caste, language, region etc. A leader and political will is needed.
Lurker Posted January 12, 2009 Posted January 12, 2009 are yaar wo upar wali article mein galat information diaa hai ki rajendra prsad barhmin the.. i was just correcting it Sure. Ab samajh mein aaya. By the way if I am not mistaken that extra param chew*** Bal Thackeray is also a Kayastha. So arguably the most prominent Hindu in Indian politics is not a Brahmin. Go figure.
kumble_rocks Posted January 12, 2009 Posted January 12, 2009 Sure. Ab samajh mein aaya. By the way if I am not mistaken that extra param chew*** Bal Thackeray is also a Kayastha. So arguably the most prominent Hindu in Indian politics is not a Brahmin. Go figure. Lurker , Bal Thackeray is a brahmin.
Lurker Posted January 12, 2009 Posted January 12, 2009 Lurker ' date=' Bal Thackeray is a brahmin.[/quote'] Maybe KR. He has an entry under Kayastha list, though for the love of God it beats me who in the world has the time, or patience, to compile such a list. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Kayasthas
triam Posted January 12, 2009 Posted January 12, 2009 Next is Tamil Nadu with 68 million people. Its leader is the fiery Dravidian leader Karunanidhi, whose party's identity rose from an anti-Brahmin, anti-Aryan movement. Tamil Nadu's first chief minister, founder of the Dravidian political movement, was CN Annadurai, who came from a caste of weavers. Fiery, I dont know what can be termed as fiery from a 87 year old grand father.
Macj Posted January 13, 2009 Posted January 13, 2009 Who rules India? Sunday, September 14, 2008 By Aakar Patel In terms of population, about 50 per cent of all Indians would be Shudra, but a cultural process known as Sankritization has led to Hindus, especially Shudras, rejecting their lower caste and defining themselves in terms of Jati or sub-caste, through which they claim higher status. Even those lower caste people who convert to other religions tend to be associated by their birth caste. Case in point Muslim converts from the lower castes in UP still cannot perform namaz with Shariefs or Ashraffs. Same holds true for Christians too, though there is no restriction from them entering churches. In the years after Independence, the most populous states of India were ruled by upper caste chief ministers, who were in power in 13 out of these 15 states. Ten of these chief ministers were Brahmin. This is an accurate statement but has to be put in context,ill ask that you look farther back. When the princely states were put firmly under first the East India Company and the British Monarchy directly , the British wanted locals to participate in the Civil Services as soon as possible. The Brahmins being the highest of the varnas and also being the most literate were the first to embrace English wholeheartedly. Furthmore they werent aligned with either left or right handed castes which plagued the nation at the time. Since they were outside of Dual handed caste system thus they also were best arbiters of justice or dispute resolution, a task they eventually performed on behalf of the British Crown. In the Madras Presidency census of 1931 60% of Civil Services jobs were performed by Brahmins, mostly Tamil Iyers. This proved to be their bane and the reason why the Dravidian Rationalists hunted them down almost without mercy. Did you know that there was a cry by these Dravidian Rationalists (the DK party) to 'nationalize' Brahmin women? Next is Tamil Nadu with 68 million people. Its leader is the fiery Dravidian leader Karunanidhi, whose party's identity rose from an anti-Brahmin, anti-Aryan movement. Tamil Nadu's first chief minister, founder of the Dravidian political movement, was CN Annadurai, who came from a caste of weavers. Karunanidhi is exactly why TN is so pressed along caste lines. Ironically he has 2 grandsons married to Brahmins. He is a pure vegetarian and the 'sandhanam' shawl is not a mere coincidence.
theguyinallblue Posted January 13, 2009 Posted January 13, 2009 Long Live israel I wish and Pray that Israel remains the most powerful COUNTRY in the middle east to check the talibanisation and wahabinisation of Middle east countries.. i fully support the actions of israel... what they are doing is a great service to the world peace... radical islamic terrorists are the clear and present danger to the world peace..and Pakistan is the center of all this.. Get Rid of Pakistan...Half of the world problems will be solved which are related to terrorists. Israel..Every patriotic indian si with you...will always be with you. Jai Hind
EnterTheVoid Posted January 13, 2009 Posted January 13, 2009 ^^ I am with you there Long Live Israel Israel, once you're done with Palestine, target Iran next
Macj Posted January 13, 2009 Posted January 13, 2009 ^^ I am with you there Long Live Israel Israel, once you're done with Palestine, target Iran next Arent we thick as thieves with Iran?Or do we think of them as a nuisance now that Unkill Sam and us are closer than brothers.
EnterTheVoid Posted January 13, 2009 Posted January 13, 2009 ^^ iran, you're next (hopefully) I read somewhere that Israel asked the U.S. for bunker busting bombs so as to target iran's underground nuclear facilities
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