cricket786 Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 rubbing muslims the wrong way for no reason... a guy drew osama in a sikh turban instead of a taliban one... when i pointed it out - he told me "dude who cares... they are all the same". bloody hell they are same man. What the heck? How are "they all the same"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Outsider Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 Ok so let me answer: I am a Hindu. I am hurt be insensitive and vulgar depictions of Hindu deities. I am not a Muslim. I am not religiously insulted by Mohammad paintings (though I may have aesthetic issues with them). My question was not aimed at your personal sensitivity, rather at your personal view on freedom of expression in religion and art. Do you think drawing Muhammad as a pig, in vulgar positions, or even drawing him at all(since that is not allowed in Islam) should be permitted or not? Forget about what the law in India or Chad says. I am asking about your viewpoint. If I am in India, then I reserve the right to legally challenge vulgar paintings of Hindu deities. I will also support the right of any Indian Muslim to challenge publication of Mohammad cartoons in India. I will not support violence or threats. I will accept the decision of the courts, even though I may still feel offended personally. That's exactly what Muslims in Pakistan are doing - protesting peacefully and abiding by court orders. So I gather you should support that part, if we ignore the fact that Pakistan perhaps does not accord the same to other religions? If I am in Europe - I will at most protest peacefully against vulgar depictions of Hindu deities. I wont indulge in violence and act within the laws of that land. The problem is that Muslims in Europe will utilize the freedom to demonize Jews, even Hindus but will NEVER tolerate satirical cartoons of their own faith and get violent about it. I hate it when people cave in to them. Why should cartoonists live in fear. Same goes for MF Hussain, he should be allowed to come back (but it seems he doesnt want to). Don't want to digress too much into MF Hussain as the topic has already been beaten to death, but there are death threats against him in India due to Hindu fundamentalists. Yeah, the government has offered him protection, but has the government been able to protect everyone? You keep harping in your posts about 'law this, law that' as if you agree with every law in India? We all know the laws of India and if we don't can easily look them up on the web. The point of a discussion like this is to give your point of view not quote the law which everyone is aware of. If you wish I can give you examples of laws from India which will make you cringe that you agree with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Tendulkar Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 Well at least that's something to tell your grandchildren about! Surely it's better than being a middle-aged convenience store owner/accountant/software designer with limited interaction with the real world and spending your free time behind a computer cracking lame jokes in a cricket forum. You should spend more time pleasing auntyji, unc. Being a failed suicie bomber is better then being middle aged convenience store owner etc. This is the lunacy we are dealing with here!!! I seriously worry how your grandchildren will be like with you as one of their elders!:(( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seedhi Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 You are smarter than that mate. Yes Muslims do feel insulted, as Hindus do. However not every Muslim is out there killing cartoonists now are they? Bulk of them, specially from India, South East Asia etc etc dont give a damn. This argument would have been valid if it were just an isolated incident. But just compare - how many violent educated Hindus or Buddhists do you find in Europe/USA when Krishna, Buddha and Ganesh are insulted day in and day out and how many times have we seen some Muslim attacking a cartoonist, writer etc. When was the last time you saw an Indian Muslim from Raebareli chasing Danish cartoonist with a chakoo?If you check the news when this controversy broke, there was a riot in UP (I think in Lucknow) when protesting Muslims burnt several Hindu shops and a person or two were also killed. One unfortunate thing that comes out of suc threads is an en-masse criticism of Muslims. Reality check - Indian Muslims have hardly done anything against this whole Facebook and Wikipedia saga. We should be cognizant of that and realize that in the end the problem is very much Pakistani and not Muslims, certainly not Indian Muslims. xxxThe problem is in the mentality and that mentality comes to the fore most clearly in free societies like Europe. I mean give me an equivalent of Anjem Chaudhary or Omar Bakri in amongst Hindus and Budddhists of UK. Is it not worth noting that we have extreme radicalization of Muslims in free societies like UK, Sweden etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Outsider Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 I seriously worry how your grandchildren will be like with you as one of their elders!:(( That he will have any will depend on him being accorded conjugal rights in prison, I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pioneer Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 Meanwhile some Turkish dude hacked this website: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Temujin Khaghan Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 What the heck? How are "they all the same"? u need to read it in context... "bloody hell they are same" as in asking that guy wtf are you talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seedhi Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 My question was not aimed at your personal sensitivity' date=' rather at your personal view on freedom of expression in religion and art. Do you think drawing Muhammad as a pig, in vulgar positions, or even drawing him at all(since that is not allowed in Islam) should be permitted or not? Forget about what the law in India or Chad says. I am asking about your viewpoint.[/quote']My personal viewpoint is that the law should be fair to all religions, either allow insults to all or disallow insulting any. If depicting Mohammad in sexual positions is disallowed then so be it for Hanuman. Now, which way should it be has to depend on the ground realities. For example, countries like the USA have the capability to enforce the law in a much more effective way than India - therefore a more conservative law is justified in India. That's exactly what Muslims in Pakistan are doing - protesting peacefully and abiding by court orders. So I gather you should support that part, if we ignore the fact that Pakistan perhaps does not accord the same to other religions?I have already written in this thread that I have no problem in peaceful protests. Don't want to digress too much into MF Hussain as the topic has already been beaten to death, but there are death threats against him in India due to Hindu fundamentalists. Yeah, the government has offered him protection, but has the government been able to protect everyone?There is a death threat recently against Javed Akhtar by some Muslim, govt has provided him protection, he has not fled. Taslima Nasreen lives in India. All the groups VHP, Bajrang Dal, Shiv Sena have said that they will only protest peacefully. MF Hussain is not returning by his own volition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
someone Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 Stupid decision and another reason why for fear muslims so much. They can say anything about other religions and when someone else even says a single word or question about islam weather it actually offends or not. Bang, there will demonstrations around the world and perhaps some foul play. This is unique to muslims as I can gurantee you if anyone says something bad about Hindus, most would not care but in their case, everyone is influenced and wants revenge It really would not surprise me if their are protests in India and our wonderful Congress government might really think of banning the sites. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Outsider Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 My personal viewpoint is that the law should be fair to all religions, either allow insults to all or disallow insulting any. If depicting Mohammad in sexual positions is disallowed then so be it for Hanuman. Now, which way should it be has to depend on the ground realities. For example, countries like the USA have the capability to enforce the law in a much more effective way than India - therefore a more conservative law is justified in India. What's offensive in one religion is fair game in another. You cannot have universal laws across religions. Portraying Hindu Gods in general is fine, but just depicting Muhammad in any form is against Islam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sachinism Posted May 20, 2010 Author Share Posted May 20, 2010 rubbing muslims the wrong way for no reason... a guy drew osama in a sikh turban instead of a taliban one... when i pointed it out - he told me "dude who cares... they are all the same". bloody hell they are same man. It started out as a protest for free speech but quickly turned into a hate group Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seedhi Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 What's offensive in one religion is fair game in another. You cannot have universal laws across religions. Portraying Hindu Gods in general is fine, but just depicting Muhammad in any form is against Islam.At the basic minimum one should not be able to do to religious figures what is not allowed in portrayal of living persons. For example, if I am not allowed to draw Sonia Gandhi having sex with a tiger then I should not be able to draw Durga similarly either. I think this is the most reasonable thing to do. Of course, Islam is a bit unreasonable that they wont even allow respectful portrayals - well what can one do except agree to it. Mind you I am saying this in context of India where, if absolute freedom is allowed then there will be riots and violence. I personally would be happy with the US system as well (I am living in the USA) but that wont work in India anytime soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ludhianvi Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 There is a difference between free speech and hate speech. Trying to hide hate speech under the blanket of free speech is the new "in thing" these days. I am not sure how this sort of act has so many supporters. Today, this might be hate against a religious group, what about tomorrow? It could well be racist cartoons, racist hate speech and where do you draw the line? Now it wont be pretty when "you" are the target and being made fun of. Plus these sort of acts further develop the sterotypes many Americans have in their minds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cricket786 Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 Why do "they" want to tick Muslims off? You think they weren't aware of the fact that such a thing was bound to tick off any Muslim? Of course they did, but they still are calling this a "freedom of speech" group when it clearly has just started to express hate. Despite all the boyvott facebook groups etc, this group is reaching nearly 100,000 members and many are just laughing at what Pakistan has done, stating how they'd knew many Muslims would get ticked off, thus, "we've succeeded." Such a group is getting all the attention in the world, it was better to just ignore these people and I'm pretty sure the group would've gone no where. The more people get furious about this, Muslims that is, the more you'll see thousands of people joining this group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Params7 Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 lol @ Pakistan They keep doing things like these and their people outside then pretend to be Indians. That country just needs to nuke itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nballa Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 The muslims are strong minded, they go for 30 days consecutively without food or water(between sunrise and sunset i.e 11:00 am to 3:00 pm) so they certainly have the will power to stay strong. Boycotting these godless sites should be a cakewalk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cricket786 Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 - Edited Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jadoo Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 The muslims are strong minded' date=' they go for 30 days consecutively without food or water(between sunrise and sunset i.e 11:00 am to 3:00 pm) so they certainly have the will power to stay strong. Boycotting these godless sites should be a cakewalk.[/quote'] :haha::haha: nballa your on a roll today dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nballa Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 Facebook Earning $11000000000 Facebook Users 4609,221,00 Per User Earning $2.9 Pakistani Users 2349620 Total Revenue From Us $ 5,631,281,29= 461,765,066Pkr Pakistan Revenue 47.5% of Facebook Earning = $517,000,000 are you talking about ICF$? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Temujin Khaghan Posted May 20, 2010 Share Posted May 20, 2010 The muslims are strong minded' date=' they go for 30 days consecutively without food or water([b']between sunrise and sunset i.e 11:00 am to 3:00 pm) so they certainly have the will power to stay strong. Boycotting these godless sites should be a cakewalk. either u are being sarcastic or u live in alaska and have a 4 hour day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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