2G scam: Kanimozhi arrested, sent to Tihar jail

[ganeshran]

K8Jn1ziQmaQ&feature=player_detailpage amlSDPQ8oKY http://www.time.com/time/magazine/1998/int/980209/tigers.html

Until then, the Tamil militant groups were not much better than petty crooks armed with pistols and shotguns. Together, the various gangs could muster only 150 men. Their militancy gained momentum after the 1983 riots. Thousands of Tamils living in Sinhalese areas headed over to India to sign up at Tamil militants' training camps, many of which were sponsored covertly by Indian intelligence, a bit of intrigue that was to backfire horrendously on the Indians. In Tamil Nadu, Prabhakaran's exploits turned him into a folk hero. His fierce eyes glared from calendars. He was courted by Tamil Nadu's powerful chief minister, M.G. Ramachandran, a former movie star, who encouraged the young man to bring around his latest weapons. These lethal toys were used against other Tamil militant leaders, as well as the Sri Lankan army. Tiger ideologue Anton Balasingham once gave this explanation for the internecine massacres: "Down the history of liberation struggles all over the world, the big fish swallows the smaller fish. In the end, only the big fish remains."

[Ram]

Oh no! My bad.. I didnt realize we were comparing K'nidhi and M.G.R.. :hysterical:

[ganeshran]

Didnt compare them, just pointed out that both of them supported the LTTE which is something JJ hasnt done. Which is exactly what I wrote two posts back and you contradicted. Nothing but smileys and diversions in your posts. :headshake: Its obvious why you dont want to continue the debate.

[Ram]

Didnt compare them, just pointed out that both of them supported the LTTE which is something JJ hasnt done. Which is exactly what I wrote two posts back and you contradicted. Nothing but smileys and diversions in your posts. :headshake: Its obvious why you dont want to continue the debate.

Pardon me my friend.. I don’t know if you have ever realized, it is sorta hard to debate with a staight face, wih someone who says ‘Oh well, K’nidhi supported LTTE.. The same LTTE that actually assassinated India’s first citizen, our prime minister, on Indian soil.. I know that almost tantamounts to treason. But never mind, the LTTE isn’t here.. So that doesn’t really count anymore.. Now lets talk about the Flyover K’nidhi built in T.Nager..’. :hysterical: And pasting links about M.G.R in a thread about JJ vs. K’nidhi.. Classic! :cantstop:

[Aaku]

Southie scamz :headshake:

[ganeshran]

Pardon me my friend.. I don’t know if you have ever realized' date=' it is sorta hard to debate with a staight face, wih someone who says ‘[i']Oh well, K’nidhi supported LTTE.. The same LTTE that actually assassinated India’s first citizen, our prime minister, on Indian soil.. I know that almost tantamounts to treason. But never mind, the LTTE isn’t here.. So that doesn’t really count anymore.. Now lets talk about the Flyover K’nidhi built in T.Nager..’. :hysterical: And pasting links about M.G.R in a thread about JJ vs. K’nidhi.. Classic! :canstop:

All Dravidian parties have supported LTTE actively in the past. MGR made a statement to the Tamilnadu state assembly in 1986 that he will give 4 crores to LTTE to help them survive and paid up to avoid them teaming up with DMK. After MGR's death Karunanidhi also shamelessly exploited the Tamil Eelam issue to garner votes. JJ's first term as CM came immediately after Rajiv Gandhi's assasination. The sympathy wave for Rajiv was a massive factor in her election (ADMK won 224 out of 234 seats ) and also the LTTE had become a major political liability at that time. The fact is, she never needed the LTTE for garnering votes. After 1991, opposition parties merely rode on each other's anti-incumbency factors and gained huge majorities. Today LTTE is irrelevant. I dont care what my CM does for Tamils in Sri Lanka. However I do care what my CM does for Tamils in Tamilnadu. What he/she does to create economic growth, infrastructure of the state, job opportunities for youth, education opportunities for students etc. Karunanidhi has outscored JJ on all these points. Whether she does better in the next 5 years remains to be seen, but if the past is any indicator, then the signs aren't too encouraging.

[Guest Gunner]

All Dravidian parties have supported LTTE actively in the past. MGR made a statement to the Tamilnadu state assembly in 1986 that he will give 4 crores to LTTE to help them survive and paid up to avoid them teaming up with DMK. After MGR's death Karunanidhi also shamelessly exploited the Tamil Eelam issue to garner votes. JJ's first term as CM came immediately after Rajiv Gandhi's assasination. The sympathy wave for Rajiv was a massive factor in her election (ADMK won 224 out of 234 seats ) and also the LTTE had become a major political liability at that time. The fact is, she never needed the LTTE for garnering votes. After 1991, opposition parties merely rode on each other's anti-incumbency factors and gained huge majorities. Today LTTE is irrelevant. I dont care what my CM does for Tamils in Sri Lanka. However I do care what my CM does for Tamils in Tamilnadu. What he/she does to create economic growth, infrastructure of the state, job opportunities for youth, education opportunities for students etc. Karunanidhi has outscored JJ on all these points. Whether she does better in the next 5 years remains to be seen, but if the past is any indicator, then the signs aren't too encouraging.

This is the part I have a problem with. You haven't actually provided any evidence to support that JJ doesn't assist economic ggrowth in the state. You just keep saying it as if we should accept that it is true.

[Guest Gunner]

Yep this is what I hear from ppl back in Madras. The thing is - Jaya is superior compared to Karuna, but that does not make her Thatcher either. She is a crook (and Sasikala too), Karuna is a bigger crook. They'll both indulge in corruption to swindle crores, just that Karuna does it to unprecedented levels. Its worse vs worst in TN (or perhaps many places in India too).

What do you know about thatcher to keep bangin' on as if thatcher is the greatest thing since sliced bread? She crushed the unions and destroyed manufacturing in this country. Thanks to her there won't be a made in Great Britain label on anything anytime soon.

[suraj]

As always this thread again proves the most important point that Northies > Southies:two_thumbs_up:

[yoda]

As always this thread again proves the most important point that Northies > Southies:two_thumbs_up:

Yes, in their delusional level. :hahaha:

[ganeshran]

This is the part I have a problem with. You haven't actually provided any evidence to support that JJ doesn't assist economic ggrowth in the state. You just keep saying it as if we should accept that it is true.

In her two reigns as CM, JJ has paid far lesser attention to economic growth than DMK. DMK has invited and signed MoUs with many more companies to invite them to set shop in Tamilnadu. If you see Sriperumputhur on the journey from chennai to Kanchipuram, it was empty 4-5 years ago. Today there are so many companies there which give employment to thousands. Using their clout at the center, DMK (especially Dayanidhi Maran) brought many new companies to Chennai to give it a foothold in manufacturing and not only the traditional services industry. An indispensable prerequisite for new industries coming to the state is the available infrastructure. Companies prefer cities with good airports, railway stations and bus facilities because it makes their logistics easier and also makes it easier for employees. Large industries in the state also encourage secondary growth where smaller units pop up to provide services. e.g travel, accommodation, food etc which further increase employment. JJ hasnt paid enough attention to this crucial component. She didnt start enough flyovers, didnt upgrade the MTC bus fleet properly, paid no attention to the need for a more modern airport (Chennai Airport now lags behind Bangalore, Hyderabad and Delhi). One of the huge flaws on her part was the inability to get a Metro project started during her reign. The DMRC had proven its expertise in setting up a metro rail network in Delhi and its head Sreetharan met JJ way back in 2003 with a proposal to implement a similar project in Chennai (50 lakhs were spent on the feasibility report alone). The Chennai MRTS (Parakkum Rail) never performed well and Metro was desperately needed in the state. If the project had taken off in 2003 itself, we would have had atleast 2-3 routes operational by now. http://www.hinduonnet.com/2003/08/22/stories/2003082206110400.htm But for some strange reason JJ never implemented it and the project was put on the backburner for 3 whole years in favor of the untested monorail technology. But then even Monorail was not implemented and the tender taken out in Feb 2006, just few months before being voted out of power. Then DMK came to power and put the Metro project back on track. Today construction is being carried on and the project will be completed by 2014-2015.

[cricfan001]

All the politicians who "ate" people's money should be booked. None should be spared. I want my country to be corruption free and terror free. Also, all the media outlets/middlemen who ate in this scam too should be booked. People like Anna Hazare are doing a crusade to wipe this menace and we all should support wherever possible such initiatives. Also, wherever possible expose all these corrupt politicians/bureaucrats irrespective of their regional/religious/political affiliations. Corruption is the biggest menace we are encountering now in all forms of life, and once we get rid of this menace, we sure will progress greatly and alleviate our poverty.

[suraj]

All the politicians who "ate" people's money should be booked. None should be spared. I want my country to be corruption free and terror free. Also, all the media outlets/middlemen who ate in this scam too should be booked. People like Anna Hazare are doing a crusade to wipe this menace and we all should support wherever possible such initiatives. Also, wherever possible expose all these corrupt politicians/bureaucrats irrespective of their regional/religious/political affiliations. Corruption is the biggest menace we are encountering now in all forms of life, and once we get rid of this menace, we sure will progress greatly and alleviate our poverty.

Great post

[triam]

Just to give some counter points regarding DK and Periyar etc, DK and to a big extent the earlier DMK (1960s etc) were much needed and very important organizations within Tamilnadu atleast. As the first rational organization they played a HUGE part in eradicating a lot of superstitions and also untouchability etc. Back in those days pretty much every industry in TN was dominated by the upper castes like TVS etc (pretty much guaranteed a job as long as you are an iyengar) . The reformation was pretty much necessary.

[Ram]

^ Special bump for Ganesh. Have you been following the developments in T.N lately, Ganesh? J’tha has increased the prices of every single basic commodity that’s out there – Milk, Electricity, bus fares, train fares.. You name it, she’s done it. Which takes us back to the original point that I have been trying to make in this thread which is – J’tha is one of the few CMs in the whole country out there that has the genuine interests of the state at heart. No populist CM whose sole intent is to retain power will ever double prices of all essential commodities within months of taking office. On the contrary, the DMK regime has repeatedly bankrupted the state giving away doles and subsidies that the state treasury could never afford. Every time she’s come into office, she has had to clean up the mess.

[Stuge]

THese days Kanimozi is enjoying life after bail in backwaters of Kerala :P

[ganeshran]

^ Special bump for Ganesh. Have you been following the developments in T.N lately, Ganesh? JÃÕha has increased the prices of every single basic commodity thatÃÔ out there Milk, Electricity, bus fares, train fares.. You name it, sheÃÔ done it. Which takes us back to the original point that I have been trying to make in this thread which is JÃÕha is one of the few CMs in the whole country out there that has the genuine interests of the state at heart. No populist CM whose sole intent is to retain power will ever double prices of all essential commodities within months of taking office. On the contrary, the DMK regime has repeatedly bankrupted the state giving away doles and subsidies that the state treasury could never afford. Every time sheÃÔ come into office, she has had to clean up the mess.

Ram, I have always praised the political will of JJ to take difficult political and pragmatic decisions and criticized DMK's constant bending to public pressure. She is a wonderful manager to have for the state. By the time she quits she would have brought the treasury back to healthy levels. (even though she has promised some equally foolhardy freebies that she first needs to deliver) However, my issue with JJ has always been her lack of long term planning around the infrastructure in the state and long term economic investment. By the time she quits, she would also have messed up the metro project by starting a ill conceived monorail project and spoiling the entire mass transit plans for the city. Given her past record and poor relations with the center, I am pretty sure she would not be able to bring new companies to invest in the state and increase employment. JJ's autocratic style of governance is a boon in some areas and bane in others. Her government simply doesnt have any leaders of considerable political stature. Everything revolves around her and a few stooges who lack the intellectual wherewithal for fulfilling responsibilities entrusted to them. JJ's ego and unwillingness to play ball with the center hurts the state- you can take a look at the economic development that happened between 2001-06 and 2006-11 and observe the contrast. I would gladly take JJ as a leader if she does better in these 5 years. With the old man's health worsening and both Stalin and Azhagiri being plain incompetent, the DMK will be relegated to the sidelines by the time next elections arrive. MDMK has a great chance of being the primary opposition party in 2016.

[Ram]

Ram, I have always praised the political will of JJ to take difficult political and pragmatic decisions and criticized DMK's constant bending to public pressure. She is a wonderful manager to have for the state. By the time she quits she would have brought the treasury back to healthy levels. (even though she has promised some equally foolhardy freebies that she first needs to deliver) However, my issue with JJ has always been her lack of long term planning around the infrastructure in the state and long term economic investment. By the time she quits, she would also have messed up the metro project by starting a ill conceived monorail project and spoiling the entire mass transit plans for the city. Given her past record and poor relations with the center, I am pretty sure she would not be able to bring new companies to invest in the state and increase employment. JJ's autocratic style of governance is a boon in some areas and bane in others. Her government simply doesnt have any leaders of considerable political stature. Everything revolves around her and a few stooges who lack the intellectual wherewithal for fulfilling responsibilities entrusted to them. JJ's ego and unwillingness to play ball with the center hurts the state- you can take a look at the economic development that happened between 2001-06 and 2006-11 and observe the contrast. I would gladly take JJ as a leader if she does better in these 5 years. With the old man's health worsening and both Stalin and Azhagiri being plain incompetent, the DMK will be relegated to the sidelines by the time next elections arrive. MDMK has a great chance of being the primary opposition party in 2016.

I am really clueless as to what you're talking about when you keep referring to 'Infrastructure' and 'long term economic investment? As I said before, unlike you, I was actually a resident of madras for 21 years (again, that doesnt automatically make me any more knowledgeable on this subject than you are, but surely, it should count for something at least..) As far as I could tell, the only real infrastructural 'achievements' of the DMK regime in the times they were in power was to build flyovers at some of the most irrelevant places in the city. And they too have started to crumble. On the contrary, the damage they have done to the people of the state and the state in general is immense. I could go pages and pages about how theyÃÓe a destructive influence in our society but I simply do not have the time to do at this point. JJ has her faults, but unlike that villainous crook K'nidhi, she's interested in real governance. She's probably the ONLY CM I know in all of india that governs the state in a manner that is similar to what we find in the West. She talks about fiscal responsibility, balanced budgets, caps to state employee benefits etc. Again, I am not saying she's perfect. Her record between 91 and 96 was, simply put, appalling. But she showed enough signs of reform in her last term. And now, she's back on the path of reforming the state and restructuring the finances. I hope she succeeds.