What to do with Kashmir ?

[triam]

Ans is simple' date=' did you ever found a single Pakistani asking India to poll people of say Gujrat, Bihar, Assam or Manipur to ask what they want? No... same way you cant compare NWFP and Balochistan with Kashmir in this issue because Kashmir is called a "disputed area" and honestly speaking personally I would like ANY... PEACEFUL solution and you can understand it wont be possible unless you dont take people of Kashmir themselves on board...[/quote'] NWFP is a disputed area between Afghanistan and Pakistan (durand line read abt it if you dont know). So my qn still stands.

[ViruRulez]

Indian part of Kashmir is ours and should remain as any other part of the nation. Terrorism needs to ended and Kashmir needs to be administered with an iron fist if needed. And with end of terrorism economic and social development would improve and they can move ahead with the rest of the nation in its economic development. If terrorism ends just by the virtue of tourism to the "Switzerland of India" the overall per capita income would increase a lot. LOC should me made the border and I dont see the BS of India asking for Pakistani or Chinese part of Kashmir and vice versa. There is no point in asking for Pakistani or Chinese part of Kashmir unless they poke us. If China pokes us in Andhra Pradesh then raise cry over Chinese occupied part of Kashmir and about Tibet. Otherwise let the dust settle and make it the international border. Even not declaring it might not be that bad as it might simply remove the dust already settled to a large extent on the issue. Time should settle it. Just rule it with an iron fist especially against any anti-India elements.

[Asim]

^ if there is any... it is a conflict of border line not the whole NWFP yar... and supposidly even if it is about NWFP, what it got to do with india? Thats is only why I named few states of india, (not necessarily mean there you have such issues but just for example) if there is ever any issue, Pakistani people wont try to get involved in that. So we got to keep it within Pak, Ind and more importantly Kashmir...

[ViruRulez]

Gujrat and Bihar dont have any secessionist movements. Assam and Manipur do have some level of secessionist sentiments but if you hold a referendum' date= majority will still prefer to stay with India. Kashmir wouldnt even have been with India if Pakistan had not started the tribal invasion of 1948. Maharaja Hari Singh was looking for a way to stay independent and not accede to either India or Pakistan. But to pressurize him, Pakistan organized its military and some militia and invaded J&K. Hari singh's forces were too little to resist Pak forces, so he asked India to help. Indian government refused to send in troops without the state acceding to India first, which Hari Singh reluctantly agreed to. It was then the Indian army set foot in Kashmir and took control of what is Indian administered Kashmir today. There was a UN resolution demanding Pakistan to withdraw its forces (which was summarily ignored) Meanwhile Pakistan handed over control of 1/5 th of Kashmir to China (Aksai Chin) bringing in one more party to the already crowded conflict. My solution is for Kashmiris to have complete administrative autonomy in the region with their elected representatives making decisions for them. The visible security forces should be cut down in the cities. However the army presence in the border areas should not be reduced. The local government can take charge of all decisions except defense and foreign policy.

Assam or any of the northeast never had any secessionist movement where public was directly involved. To be fair enough if Northeast was not given the step-motherly treatment by the rest of India in all these decades since independence then probably secessionist movements would never have got started at the first place. There was massive discrimination although those were some of the most productive states of India and gave huge revenues to the nation be it in oil, tea, coal or other natural resources etc. If they had got even 70% of the benefits given to Kashmir then probably the problems there would have never started in the first place though they have almost got solved now. So, both cases cannot be compared as Kashmir was treated like a "bigra hua aulaad" while Northeast was treated like a "step-son". Vastly different scenarios in both cases. And to add to that Bangladesh border was opened or made porous by India making huge influx of these illegal foreigners to those states where the actual localites were becoming a minority gradually.

[ganeshran]

Assam or any of the northeast never had any secessionist movement where public was directly involved. To be fair enough if Northeast was not given the step-motherly treatment by the rest of India in all these decades since independence then probably secessionist movements would never have got started at the first place. There was massive discrimination although those were some of the most productive states of India and gave huge revenues to the city be it oil' date=' tea, coal or other natural resources etc. If they had got even 70% of the benefits given to Kashmir then probably the problems there would have never started in the first place though they have almost got solved now. So, both cases cannot be compared as Kashmir was treated like a "bigra hua aulaad" while Northeast was treated like a "step-son". Vastly different scenarios in both cases.[/quote'] Totally agree. We have had the history of neglecting the northeast which is very wrong. It is painful to see so little attention being given to such a big and diverse part of India.

[ViruRulez]

Ans is simple' date=' did you ever found a single Pakistani asking India to poll people of say Gujrat, Bihar, Assam or Manipur to ask what they want? No... same way you cant compare NWFP and Balochistan with Kashmir in this issue because Kashmir is called a "disputed area" and honestly speaking personally I would like ANY... PEACEFUL solution and you can understand [b']it wont be possible unless you dont take people of Kashmir themselves on board...

Why dont you ask your so called best friend and savior China to take the opinion of the people of Tibet and Uyghur people if you are so interested in taking opinions. India part of Kashmir is Indian territory and Pakistani part of Kashmir should remain with you. That is the only solution that would work fine.

[Asim]

Why dont you ask your so called best friend and savior China to take the opinion of the people of Tibet and Uyghur people if you are so interested in taking opinions. India part of Kashmir is Indian territory and Pakistani part of Kashmir should remain with you. That is the only solution that would work fine.

:--D @ so called because its ind-china dispute, we got to deal only with Pak-India disputes... and so in your part of Kashmir, matter of fact; the freedom fight will remain continue...

[ViruRulez]

:--D @ so called because its ind-china dispute, we got to deal only with Pak-India disputes... and so in your part of Kashmir, matter of fact; the freedom fight will remain continue...

Dont worry. The terrorists you are sending are sending are almost becoming ineffective nowadays but you have dug a grave for your own nation by creating those Frankenstein and those are ending your country at an amazing pace. At least we do not believe in self-destruction mode like you guys. :giggle: I do not like being happy over any deaths but sometimes ridiculous statements from people like you make me think if you guys deserve to be in the **** you are in already. If a somewhat sensible Paki poster like you can utter such statements I am really worried about what the rest of your nation is bred with. :facepalm: I did not want to give special mention to Balochistan or other such issues as you are already doing 100 more self-destructing acts and the products of your terrorist factories are ending the nation and yet you guys are on the self-destruction terrorism production path. :clap:

[Asim]

Dont worry. The terrorists you are sending are sending are almost becoming ineffective nowadays but you have dug a grave for your own nation by creating those Frankenstein and those are ending your country at an amazing pace. At least we do not believe in self-destruction mode like you guys. :giggle: I do not like being happy over any deaths but sometimes ridiculous statements from people like you make me think if you guys deserve to be in the **** you are in already. If a somewhat sensible Paki poster like you can utter such statements I am really worried about what the rest of your nation is bred with. :facepalm: I did not want to give special mention to Balochistan or other such issues as you are already doing 100 more self-destructing acts and the products of your terrorist factories are ending the nation and yet you guys are on the self-destruction terrorism production path. :clap:

so your all aggression is aactually a response to on one word "Freedom-fight" ? But do you really feel you had not ever have faced any militant reaction within your occupied Kashmir and everything there is "exported" only?

[ViruRulez]

so your all aggression is aactually a response to on one word "Freedom-fight" ? But do you really feel you had not ever have faced any militant reaction within your occupied Kashmir and everything there is "exported" only?

I am not sure why you dont refer to the Tibet and Uyghur situation against your beloved China as Freedom Fight too. :winky: I am against referring your sponsored terrorism as freedom fight. You have bloody occupied Kashmir by illegal means and here in India we have Indian Kashmir which is a part of this great democratic secular nation India. Pakistani Kashmir is occupied Kashmir and please mind your language while using crap words. It is PoK (Pakistani Occupied Kashmir) and not vice versa. Cut the crap. I did not mention it earlier but you lot seem to be bloody inciters who can never be peaceful and I am not at all surprised that your nation is in the accelerated stage of self-destruction. Regarding your second point, it does not take a lot of incitements to make a few out of a bunch of illiterate people rogue elements. But one thing is for sure. If not for your incitements and "export of terrorism" Kashmir would have been solved a long time ago. Sometimes I feel that why should I hate a whole nation like Pakistan for some rogue elements. But when I see such posts from educated and somewhat sensible posters like you then I realize why the elimination of your nation from the earth's map would not be a bad thing. Pakistan and Pakistanis seem to be a lost case for this world. :facepalm:

[Asim]

^ I think you are very much over-reacting here and rather getting personal... personal attacks not a good idea :) I am from Pakistan and this fact alone means you and I would disagree on majority of the issues but I think at the same time we got to learn how to talk on such conflicting issues yet in respectful manner...

[triam]

^ if there is any... it is a conflict of border line not the whole NWFP yar... and supposidly even if it is about NWFP' date=' what it got to do with india? Thats is only why I named few states of india, (not necessarily mean there you have such issues but just for example) if there is ever any issue, Pakistani people wont try to get involved in that. So we got to keep it within Pak, Ind and more importantly Kashmir...[/quote'] But, what if one of the states you talked about muslims are majority? would Pak get involved?

[jonas10]

Could there be any better solution than asking Kashmiris themselves what they want...

I would totally love that on one condition if we ask the Balouchis what they want as well. Would you agree?

[jonas10]

Bro! you have very much rightly pointed out that why Muslims only responds to any conflicts in far-off lands, fair enough but have you ever tried to thought other way around, the problem you told is EFFECT, try to find the CAUSE which lies in other side of picture. It’s true that Muslims react together in some far-off land issue that is because that far-off land directly targets Islam in each incident. Suppose any killing by some Mr John or Tom in USA will always be one incident within that individual and got nothing to do with his religion but if same crime is committed by any Muslim; it will be a breaking news that a MUSLIM terrorists did blah blah and the religion of Islam will be declared responsible in that incident.... so tell me why the Muslim people and states from far far off lands will not object when their whole religion is blamed for any individual act. No matter if it is one person or one organization is involved, as long as they will try to deal with "ISLAM" instead of only those particular responsible object, you will continue getting this type of reaction which is very obvious. In short, muslims reacts tgether because muslims and their religion gets targeted together from other nations and in each corner of world.

LOL muslim brother hood. These Pakistani muslims who have never stepped out of the west or subcontinent where 99% of these posters are located should go to Saudi Arabia. See in the house of Saud how Pakistani muslims are treated worse than dogs and work in virtual slavery.

[jonas10]

:--D @ so called because its ind-china dispute, we got to deal only with Pak-India disputes... and so in your part of Kashmir, matter of fact; the freedom fight will remain continue...

Asim it makes absolutely no sense why Pakistan is obsessed with Kashmir independence and care nothing about Uyghurs. They are both Muslim period. Only problem is daddy China would rape Pakistan so hard if they ever raised a single question about the treatment of their muslim brothers there. India a country which has had Muslim Army Generals, Chief of Staff, President, Supreme Court Justice, Cricket Captain, Top Painter, Musician, Actor treats muslims bad according to Pakistanis. China which have none of the above treat Muslims how? Oh thats right Gujrats which the Pakistanis scream from the ceiling are happening everyday there. Bloody hypocrites get over your blind hatred for India - if Kashmir is resolved tomorrow you will want Mahrashtra to compensate for the humiliation of losing East Pakistan.

[Asim]

I would totally love that on one condition if we ask the Balouchis what they want as well. Would you agree?

then why to stop at Balochistan, lets do it in each n every corner of India and Pakistan :winky:

[jonas10]

then why to stop at Balochistan' date=' lets do it in each n every corner of India and Pakistan :winky:[/quote'] Just showing what a hypocrite you are. You care nothing for those suffering anywhere unless its a problem for India or appeases your Arab heros that think Pakistanis are born to be Gulf Slaves.

[King Tendulkar]

India should give it up to Pakistan so that we can see what their next excuse for terrorism is.

so true.:giggle:

[achilles]

Hey Asim... I have done an extensive study of geopolitics and there is one fact which I am sure that no one of you guys even know about. NWFP is Afghanistan's territory that is illegally occupied by your country and based on a resolution (look up the UN website), you were supposed to return it back to them in 1999-2000. There is an agreement to that effect and your country has defaulted on the same. So playing the victim card over NWFP is bull sheet of the highest order. Secondly, Pakistan was created on the basis of the same document that granted Jammu & Kashmir to India. So before your country starts playing a victim card on Kashmir as well, be happy that we have still given you a part of it, which you don't deserve. Thirdly, the reason I was away from ICF for a month was because I was in Kashmir. And dude, I've got news. KASHMIRI'S DO NOT WANT TO BE A PART OF PAKISTAN, NOR DO THEY WANT INDEPENDENCE. They are happy being a part of India, and are SICK OF YOUR COUNTRY'S NOSE-POKING in a matter that is none of your business. You have destroyed a part of our country in your mad horde of having a jewel on your crown you don't even deserve. Fourthly, if you guys REALLY care for the sentiments of people, why is Baluchistan a part of your country? Fifthly, you should visit Kashmir before bullsheeting about how bad it is doing. It is doing phenomenally well and development is on track. Sorry to disappoint you. Sixthly, when I spoke to traders out there about being a part of Pakistan, they said, "Sahab, Hindustan mein hai toh itna dhandha toh hota hai. Agar woh bhikari country ka part honge, toh kaun aayega Kashmir? Kaun paise kharch karega Kashmir main? Humara pet kaise bharega? Hume yeh seeyasat se door rehna hai aur hume Hindustan mein rehna hai." Give me a point by point reply or don't at all reply. Thanks.

[ravishingravi]

^Can you present some stats to attest some of these "facts" about Kashmir ? Btw I did not know about NWFP. This is news to me. Btw guys do not gang up on Asim. He is presenting his side with what he understands. You can counter it but do not get personal.