So, what was wrong with this pitch, Bhajji?

[saneindian]

How is the Harbhajan criticism over the top - I can't speak for others but I can put my point forth. The guy has been averaging 35+ with a strike rate of 75 for a sustained period of 5-6 years. If you want a batting equivalent it would be someone averaging 40- over a similar period. Now tell me can an Indian batsman play, survive, and be praised for that kind of a performance. Sure, he has had his good and very good performances in the time being, but they've been few and far between and the average reflects it. If you don't want to go by stats you just have to see his bowling. The number of times he starts firing darts on leg stump is simply staggering for a top level bowler. Even in his good spells like Cape Town and in the last test in West Indies he was simply unable to sustain the momentum after getting initial wickets. When a top bowler is in form, he makes it count. Getting a 4-5 wicket haul after bowling 40-50 overs is not always going to help - not often will the team have the luxury of having 120-130 overs to bowl the opposition out. The common refrain is where are the alternatives. Two things : 1. Even if Harbhajan does play, does not mean his poor and mediocre performances cannot be criticized even if there are no alternatives. 2. Which alternative has been given a sufficiently long period and consistent run to prove himself. I am not saying Ojha, Mishra, or Ashwin are going to become world beaters, but really, if the permanent fixture is a 35+ averaging and 75+ striking bowler are they not worth a punt? When Bhajji got b!tch slapped in Sri Lanka last year, Ojha helped us draw level on the series. Was he given any run worth mention after that and performing as good if not better than Harbhajan at home subsequently. He doesn't even make the squad now. Mishra had a superb ODI series followed by an ordinary test match and finds himself out of the side, but Harbhajan keeps darting away with his pathetic strike rates.

Well obviously one thing that is going in his favour is his batting. How much we may deny it, but the fact is he did save the team through his batting especially in the series where his bowling wasn't upto the mark. That Sri Lanka series was one where he failed both with the bat and ball. Did fairly well against the Aussies on unrespnsive pitches at Mohali and Bangalore, against NZ when his bowling was abysmal he hit those 2 100s to pull the team out of hole when the top order had failed, did the same at Kingston which again was a crucial knock. Yes the argument can be put forward that as a bowler his primary role is to pick wickets and he has been below par, but the team management does know his value as a overall contributor. However, I do believe there are times when even a senior player needs a tap on the shoulder and I am sure Fletcher, MSD and Simmons will do the needful. I wont be swayed by what Simmons says about Bhajji to the press. Obviously you won't expect him to trash his leading spinner openly. Such issues need to be handled internally and knowing how well man management has been under the present leadership, they will do whatever is necessary to put Bhajji back on track again.

[Fontaine]

Bhajji has developed this rare gift . of not getting drift, . . or of doing just enough to get by, . . . not doing enough to make the batsmen cry. . . . . He struggles and he flutters, . . . . . and makes you scream down the shutters. . . . . . . But to give the ball loop and air, he won't try . . . . . . . I think the physio should check his brain with an MRI!

[The Outsider]

Well obviously one thing that is going in his favour is his batting. How much we may deny it, but the fact is he did save the team through his batting especially in the series where his bowling wasn't upto the mark. That Sri Lanka series was one where he failed both with the bat and ball. Did fairly well against the Aussies on unrespnsive pitches at Mohali and Bangalore, against NZ when his bowling was abysmal he hit those 2 100s to pull the team out of hole when the top order had failed, did the same at Kingston which again was a crucial knock. Yes the argument can be put forward that as a bowler his primary role is to pick wickets and he has been below par, but the team management does know his value as a overall contributor. However, I do believe there are times when even a senior player needs a tap on the shoulder and I am sure Fletcher, MSD and Simmons will do the needful. I wont be swayed by what Simmons says about Bhajji to the press. Obviously you won't expect him to trash his leading spinner openly. Such issues need to be handled internally and knowing how well man management has been under the present leadership, they will do whatever is necessary to put Bhajji back on track again.

Obviously, his batting has come along immensely and no one criticizes him for it even if he has the occasional brain farts because after all he is not a regular batsman and is entitled to those kind of things. It also shows that he has his heart in the right place - his lack of performance is unlikely because he has become lazy. But at some point the team needs to address the question as to the effects of carrying a spinner with such poor striking abilities. Unless, Harbhajan alters something drastically in his bowling he is unlikely to become a potent force with the ball again - a 5-6 year period can hardly be attributed to lack of form. Specially, a team like India which relies heavily on it's spin attack at home even in the first innings because we play only 4 bowlers. In his current avatar, Harbhajan needs the team to give him 120-130 overs to bowl the opposition out if the attack is going to rely mainly on him - say other bowlers are off color in that innings or the pitch does not suit them. How many times will India have the luxury of declaring with 4+ sessions to go? And in the meanwhile if he gets stick from the fans, it is immediately attributed to regional slants.

[King Tendulkar]

How is the Harbhajan criticism over the top - I can't speak for others but I can put my point forth. The guy has been averaging 35+ with a strike rate of 75 for a sustained period of 5-6 years. If you want a batting equivalent it would be someone averaging 40- over a similar period. Now tell me can an Indian batsman play, survive, and be praised for that kind of a performance.

Over last 4 years is way out ahead as our top wicket taker. Selective use of stats is in play here! In fact lets look at his stats in 2011, average of 26, fantastic:two_thumbs_up: Amazing he is getting his heaviest criticism ever, despite having one of his best years ever:cantstop: Many batters have had a dodgy year or two. So what, would we really want our top wicket taker over last 4 years dropped

[Fontaine]

If the team really wants to help Bhajji then they should let him slap the crap out of Sreesanth. He was bowling much better around that time. Plus, sree could have some emotional experience/motivation for his next song.

[King Tendulkar]

Over the last 4 years bhaji is our top wicket taker Over the last 3 years bhaji is our top wicket taker Over the last 2 years bhaji is our top wicket taker And wait for it, over last 12 months Bhaji is our top wicket taker:cantstop: Me thinks some folks have gone a bit OTT in hammering him. Just imagine if the above stats were for one of our batsman in terms of runs. Anyone calling for his head would be hammered. Yet Bhaji is not just asked to be dropped but hammered and ridiculed. You ungrateful so and sos

[The Outsider]

Over last 4 years is way out ahead as our top wicket taker. Selective use of stats is in play here! In fact lets look at his stats in 2011, average of 26, fantastic:two_thumbs_up: Amazing he is getting his heaviest criticism ever, despite having one of his best years ever:cantstop: Many batters have had a dodgy year or two. So what, would we really want our top wicket taker over last 4 years dropped

How about this - if Harbhajan averages less than 30 in England I'll carry the signature, "Bhajji haters proved wrong - he rocks!" for 3 months. If he averages more than 35 you carry the signature, "Bhajji critics were right - he is crap"? Between 30 and 35 we are in neutral territory.

[King Tendulkar]

How about this - if Harbhajan averages less than 30 in England I'll carry the signature' date=' "Bhajji haters proved wrong - he rocks!" for 3 months. If he averages more than 35 you carry the signature, "Bhajji critics were right - he is crap"? Between 30 and 35 we are in neutral territory.[/quote'] Nah. I prefer a straight shoot out between your beloved Swann and Bhaji.

[ganeshran]

Nah. I prefer a straight shoot out between your beloved Swann and Bhaji.

No faith on Bhajji kya? :nervous:

[The Outsider]

Nah. I prefer a straight shoot out between your beloved Swann and Bhaji.

You don't even back him for averaging less than 30 in a series and make all these grandiose statements? :hysterical:

[King Tendulkar]

Anyway i would never carry a signature calling an indian legend crap(400 test wickets). I leave that to others

[Fontaine]

Over the last 4 years bhaji is our top wicket taker Over the last 3 years bhaji is our top wicket taker Over the last 2 years bhaji is our top wicket taker And wait for it, over last 12 months Bhaji is our top wicket taker:cantstop: Me thinks some folks have gone a bit OTT in hammering him. Just imagine if the above stats were for one of our batsman in terms of runs. Anyone calling for his head would be hammered. Yet Bhaji is not just asked to be dropped but hammered and ridiculed. You ungrateful so and sos

Uh, he's also bowled the most overs. He's bowled nearly TWICE as many bowlers as the 2nd guy in Zaheer. Not to mention his strike of 72 during this time around the crappiest amongst lead spinners. When you really get down to it, comparing his numbers over that past 4 years (and stats obviously don't tell the whole story) his average/strike rate etc are pretty much the exact same as Monty Panesar!!

[King Tendulkar]

You don't even back him for averaging less than 30 in a series and make all these grandiose statements? :hysterical:

refuse to ever call him crap, thats for the mob.:finger:

[Laaloo]

Uh, he's also bowled the most overs. He's bowled nearly TWICE as many bowlers as the 2nd guy in Zaheer. Not to mention his strike of 72 during this time around the crappiest amongst lead spinners.

No selective use of stats please

[The Outsider]

refuse to ever call him crap' date=' thats for the mob.:finger:[/quote'] Mediocre chalega, oh touchy one?

[King Tendulkar]

Uh, he's also bowled the most overs. He's bowled nearly TWICE as many bowlers as the 2nd guy in Zaheer. Not to mention his strike of 72 during this time around the crappiest amongst lead spinners.

Testimony to his stamina. During this crappy bhaji era we have gone to no 1 in world and won 2 diff world cups. With bhaji being constant theme. Apparently he has played no part in this, none at all!

[punjabi_khota]

How about this - if Harbhajan averages less than 30 in England I'll carry the signature' date=' "Bhajji haters proved wrong - he rocks!" for 3 months. If he averages more than 35 you carry the signature, "Bhajji critics were right - he is crap"? Between 30 and 35 we are in neutral territory.[/quote'] Dude you were singing similar bhajans about harbhajan before the SA tour "If Bhajji gets 10 wickets in the 3 games, he would have done well cuz Swanzzz took 10 in one game " blah blah blah. He got 15 at under 30. Now you are at it again :hysterical::hysterical:

[King Tendulkar]

Mediocre chalega' date=' oh touchy one?[/quote'] no just will never carry a signature calling a player with over a decade of great service for india in tests crap. i would say the same if someone said for me to do same with for example dravid

[The Outsider]

Dude you were singing similar bhajans about harbhajan before the SA tour "If Bhajji gets 10 wickets in the 3 games, he would have done well cuz Swanzzz took 10 in one game " blah blah blah. He got 15. Now you are at it again :hysterical::hysterical:

Yeah, he did better than I expected - picked up a bunch of drippings at Durban and players out for a slog at Cape Town, but good enough performance. But how come the Bhajji fanatics are so reluctant to take up the challenge - 30 ka average, 20 nahin? :hmmm:

[King Tendulkar]

Yeah, he did better than I expected - picked up a bunch of drippings at Durban and players out for a slog at Cape Town, but good enough performance. But how come the Bhajji fanatics are so reluctant to take up the challenge - 30 ka average, 20 nahin? :hmmm:

wow what away to degenerate a great bowling display in tough foreign tour. o well looks like ipl bowling is more appreciated these days. really sad way to describe a sterling effort by an indian in sa. things are to easy for fans these days, they forget pre 2000 dark tours