Dad v/s Facebook

[someone]

I think it has a lot to do with the cost of education. Usually higher education (under-graduate courses and beyond) are very expensive in the US and most West European nations. Many parents cannot afford it (or haven't planned for educating the kids by stashing away money in investments' date=' etc like our middle class parents do). Given this, what is the kid going to do sitting at home? They generally start earning money and some of the wisely brought up ones use that money to pay for their own education.[/quote'] To be fair, education is expensive in Asian countries. I am pretty sure there are tons who cannot afford their children's education here. Maybe, it is all about the concept of individualism followed there, being more independent in the sense. Back to this topic, had this thing had happened in Asian countries, their are chances that this man could have gone to jail as emotional unstable to use a licensed gun. And the most surprising incident for me is how anybody can praise this dad for what was a coward act.

[anotherhawkeye]

Back to this topic, had this thing had happened in Asian countries, their are chances that this man could have gone to jail as emotional unstable to use a licensed gun. And the most surprising incident for me is how anybody can praise this dad for what was a coward act.

Hmmm...no chance in hell he would have used a gun in India where owning gun is not common. He would have used a hammer to break it and no judge would put him on jail for breaking his own laptop.

[RoxSTR]

Either way - parenting fail.

true!

[ViruRulez]

I think it has a lot to do with the cost of education. Usually higher education (under-graduate courses and beyond) are very expensive in the US and most West European nations. Many parents cannot afford it (or haven't planned for educating the kids by stashing away money in investments, etc like our middle class parents do). Given this, what is the kid going to do sitting at home? They generally start earning money and some of the wisely brought up ones use that money to pay for their own education. Doing an Engg course or for that matter even a normal Bachelor of Arts course in the US is probably 10 times more expensive than in India. In India even a maid servant can afford to send her children to do a BA course but in the US and western Europe that is just not the case. Others can provide more relevant information on this ...

In that case, maybe US and the Western countries need to fix their education system as well as their family values. Education can be somewhat expensive but must be within limits of affordability for the lower middle class and even slightly poor if needed. An Indian govt. college would probably cost around less than 5000 rs. a year for college fees which is only $100 and that is for govt. colleges in Delhi University etc. Similarly, it is quite less for govt. colleges around the country. Even in IITs,IIMs loans are available at flexible patterns so that students can easily repay them within years of landing a good job (which is again guaranteed from institutions of that reputation). To be honest, the only things extremely expensive are the commercialization of eduction in some private colleges which have only happened in the last couple of decades and in those cases the donation fees or other lavish and unnecessary fees are the expensive ones and not the college fees. And a poor or middle class student does not need to approach private colleges which demand such huge money as they can easily join some govt. college if they are talented enough. And some of the extremely poor are also quota people at times and so, their entrance into good govt. colleges is even easier. I am against quota system in its current form of caste, religion etc. basis though unless it is only for economically backward people. Even in schools, it is quite affordable. When I studied in a private school in India and one of the best ones in my state more than a dozen years ago, it cost only Rs.100 or only $2 as the monthly fees. Having said that, the same school is now charging more than a thousand rupees for monthly fees. And other schools are charging a lot more. So, as Ron Paul says, inflation itself is a tax and I have realized that with time. Sadly India and especially the private sector is also becoming quite expensive (though a lot lesser than the US) with time whereas it was extremely cheap in the past. But govt. college hardly hikes a lot of fees and so, it will remain quite cheap forever and the poor and the middle will always have options. So, US needs to rethink on the fees in their education system if that is the reason that children are in a way forced to work so early in life. Another thing which US and the West as a whole needs to rethink is the savings and monetary planning. Even when we were a poor country, all Indians used to save a portion of their income even if they have to live in pathetic conditions. Saving money for any emergency and for future planning of children's education etc. has always been an important part of Indian culture. So, US and Western middle class and poor (I doubt even their poor would be as poor as the Indian poor who still save money for children's education etc. ) needs to rethink their spending habits and plan their and their children's future accordingly. Though I do not like everything in our country but I have to acknowledge that Indians are still risk free irrespective of their monetary conditions compared to the West. And I also have problems with some countries in the way their people think. For example, Greece citizens are behaving carelessly and are hardly thinking of the nation and are not willing to cut any costs whereas their country is almost near bankruptcy. In that regards, Indians have never been dependent too much on anyone due to their future and monetary planning and at the same time, Indians understand that lavish expenses should not be made when the economy is not good.

[Vijay.Sharma]

Another thing which US and the West as a whole needs to rethink is the savings and monetary planning. Even when we were a poor country' date=' all Indians used to save a portion of their income even if they have to live in pathetic conditions. Saving money for any emergency and for future planning of children's education etc. has always been an important part of Indian culture. So, US and Western middle class and poor (I doubt even their poor would be as poor as the Indian poor who still save money for children's education etc. ) needs to rethink their spending habits and plan their and their children's future accordingly.[/quote']One of the main reasons for this is the materialism in US and UK societies. And I do not say this with any moral connotation whatsoever. Materialistic behavior patterns have been engineered in the US by corporations right from the early 1900s. Here is a beautiful documentary by BBC about how the evolution to a consumerist society happened in the US and UK since the early 1900s. When you watch the documentary you will see parallels of the same happening in India in the last 10 years. Indian society is going through the same consumerist evolution that the US and UK societies had gone through during the mid 20th century. It's a four part series but if you are seriously interested in social sciences then this is one documentary that will open your eyes and make you much the wiser especially about your own self when it comes to what your consumer values are. You will also be introduced to Edward Bernays, the father of Engineered Consumerism (and incidentally the nephew of Sigmund Freud). B7HClTMzW9g

[anotherhawkeye]

^ the documentary looks good. Thanks for the link.

[f.b.m]

The Century of Self is one of the best documentaries that I have ever watched. I'd also recommend the Power of Nightmares. Still, helps to have a healthy skepticism of anything that Adam Curtis does.

[Vijay.Sharma]

The Century of Self is one of the best documentaries that I have ever watched. I'd also recommend the Power of Nightmares. Still' date=' helps to have a healthy skepticism of anything that Adam Curtis does.[/quote']I've heard about Power of Nightmares a lot but have never gotten to watch it...but I guess I will now

[f.b.m]

btw on that documentary: It completely ignores the fact that consumerism coincided with the creation of a middle class due to increased productivity (Same in India since the 90s as well). Its not as if a country suddenly plunges into being a consumerist society because of the work of sneaky psychoanalysts. There was a new market being created and it was a case of who could cash in. Also, as terrible or depressing as being conditioned for consumption sounds, I would say that its not even close to being as insidious or as harmful as being indoctrinated for religion or for the use of the state. I think its even worse how women were conditioned into believing that their role was basically in the kitchen (Kinder, Küche, Kirche). So as bad and as evil as Bernays was, I think that some historical context would help.

[Vijay.Sharma]

I've heard about Power of Nightmares a lot but have never gotten to watch it...but I guess I will now

I watched it a few days back but I got the feeling that I had watched this documentary some time back - about 3 years back. I distinctly remember that Egyptian guy's disillusion with the US in the 50s and then the torture of that chap and then the guy shouting in the court "who we are. who we are" Amazing documentary though

[Vijay.Sharma]

btw on that documentary: It completely ignores the fact that consumerism coincided with the creation of a middle class due to increased productivity (Same in India since the 90s as well). Its not as if a country suddenly plunges into being a consumerist society because of the work of sneaky psychoanalysts. There was a new market being created and it was a case of who could cash in.

I don't think it ignores it at all although they don't say it explicitly. I think it is implied that the desires of people increased because they were in a position to make good on those desires and that is how Bernays projected things for the masses. Moreover I think consumerism and increase in productivity go hand in hand. It is very difficult to say one is the "x" and the other is the "y". They interchange roles - it's like a closed feedback loop.

Also' date=' as terrible or depressing as being conditioned for consumption sounds, I would say that its not even close to being as insidious or as harmful as being indoctrinated for religion or for the use of the state. I think its even worse how women were conditioned into believing that their role was basically in the kitchen (Kinder, Küche, Kirche). So as bad and as evil as Bernays was, I think that some historical context would help.[/quote']No moral judgment whatsoever from my part. I don't even think Barneys was bad or what he did was bad. Let me put it this way - I try not to have a moral compass on such things because, as I have said this a thousand times here, every human act changes its goodness/badness in space, time, perspective, and context. I am not too big on morality but ethics is what interests me. I view it this way - ethics is an internal dialogue that I have with myself, morality is what society tells me to think, perceive, believe. And I believe I am born with a mind exactly to choose my own perspectives and viewpoints.