achilles Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 India is not competing with Pakistan. Please be informed that despite all its shortcomings, our country is one of the best on this planet when it comes to defending itself and devising ways, ammunitions and equipments to. We should be proud :isalute:
ganeshran Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 Don't worry' date=' fellow Indians. We shall soon have our own fleet of outdated and second-hand aircraft carriers :(([/quote'] Fleet of Aircraft carriers? :omg:
jairamesh Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 An anti-ship missile is no brahmastra... doesn't matter if China calls it ridiculous names like " carrier killer"... Aircraft carrier groups always have layers and layers of anti-missile defence systems overlapping... it would take one incredbile/lucky missile to penetrate all that and strike a carrier.. I already said that noone's sailing an aircraft carrier all by itself..its a big target floating in the sea..if you have no idea about the kind of ships that escort an aircraft carrier,you better read up before posting. Submarines also act as escort vessels for the aircraft carriers... Like i said, ACs are offensive weapons..not defensive. And you keep singing the tune of defending the coastline using frigates and subs.. :facepalm: How can you be so sure that we will never launch a land attack ever ? ..in that case we don't even need the ICBMs which are going to be test fired this year.. You are playing too many Command & Conquer games, India's fractious central government will never be able to contemplate launching an attack in faraway lands. India has no enemies except Pakistan, and the only other discernible threat is China's growing economy and military. What's the point of having an offensive weapon when Indian can't secure it's own coastlines. An Aircraft Carrier won't stop Paki terrorists coming in dingys. Aircraft Carriers won't stop all the smuggling that happens via India's shores. Aircraft Carriers won't be able secure shipping routes. Your point of having an Aircraft Carrier is moot considering India is hopelessly exposed when coming to defend itself. And as you pointed out:hehe: what's the point of having more Aircraft Carriers when Indian Navy doesn't even have enough subs, frigates and destroyers to escort the Carriers. :hehe: Forget subs, even the number of Indian Frigates (10) is pathetic compared to US (30) and China (50!!). Here is a famous thought: "Hence that general is skilful in attack whose opponent does not know what to defend; and he is skilful in defense whose opponent does not know what to attack." -Sun Tzu. India needs to play smart, it doesn't have the money available to China or the appetite of the US to be the world police/imperialistic stomper, India needs to do an Isreal, pursue top-of-the-line weapons/training/kit to fully secure it's borders and citizens in an event of an attack, no Arab country would effing dream to invade Isreal, and those who have, well we all know what happens to them. This Aircraft Carrier fleet proposition is a Admiral's wet dream and central government's chest thumping attempt to gain a seat at Security Council. The government will be building another white elephant at the expense of taxpayers and probably peoples' lives.
Clarke Posted March 12, 2012 Posted March 12, 2012 ^ Kabhi keyboard cricketer, kabhi warrior. That makes u a cricket board administrator :beee:
anotherhawkeye Posted March 13, 2012 Posted March 13, 2012 India is not competing with Pakistan. Please be informed that despite all its shortcomings, our country is one of the best on this planet when it comes to defending itself and devising ways, ammunitions and equipments to. We should be proud :isalute: How do you say that India is the best defended country? Really curious, not trying to pick up a fight.
achilles Posted March 13, 2012 Posted March 13, 2012 How do you say that India is the best defended country? Really curious' date=' not trying to pick up a fight.[/quote'] The army, the navy, the airforce. The best in the business.
gs Posted March 13, 2012 Posted March 13, 2012 The army' date=' the navy, the airforce. The best in the business.[/quote'] And we still have half a dozen terrorist attacks year after year? I feel your patriotism, but we need to be realistic as well.
punjabi_khota Posted March 13, 2012 Posted March 13, 2012 The army' date=' the navy, the airforce. The best in the business.[/quote'] :haha: Is it ? no clue you were american
jairamesh Posted March 13, 2012 Posted March 13, 2012 The army' date=' the navy, the airforce. The best in the business.[/quote'] wtf?! In relation to population, land mass, and coast line, India is very very poorly equipped in terms of hardware to defend it self. India's Naval and Air fleet are woefully short in numbers, and that's why it's important they develop and DELIVER on indigenous products rather than buy expesive foreign kit. Currently India's best defensive weapon is its foreign policy and diplomacy.
hari504504 Posted March 13, 2012 Author Posted March 13, 2012 You are playing too many Command & Conquer games, India's fractious central government will never be able to contemplate launching an attack in faraway lands. India has no enemies except Pakistan, and the only other discernible threat is China's growing economy and military. What's the point of having an offensive weapon when Indian can't secure it's own coastlines. An Aircraft Carrier won't stop Paki terrorists coming in dingys. Aircraft Carriers won't stop all the smuggling that happens via India's shores. Aircraft Carriers won't be able secure shipping routes. Your point of having an Aircraft Carrier is moot considering India is hopelessly exposed when coming to defend itself. And as you pointed out:hehe: what's the point of having more Aircraft Carriers when Indian Navy doesn't even have enough subs, frigates and destroyers to escort the Carriers. :hehe: Forget subs, even the number of Indian Frigates (10) is pathetic compared to US (30) and China (50!!). Here is a famous thought: "Hence that general is skilful in attack whose opponent does not know what to defend; and he is skilful in defense whose opponent does not know what to attack." -Sun Tzu. India needs to play smart, it doesn't have the money available to China or the appetite of the US to be the world police/imperialistic stomper, India needs to do an Isreal, pursue top-of-the-line weapons/training/kit to fully secure it's borders and citizens in an event of an attack, no Arab country would effing dream to invade Isreal, and those who have, well we all know what happens to them. This Aircraft Carrier fleet proposition is a Admiral's wet dream and central government's chest thumping attempt to gain a seat at Security Council. The government will be building another white elephant at the expense of taxpayers and probably peoples' lives. Another Israeli fanboy I see , that explains all the content :cantstop: Responding to what I see as the only relevant bit - the number of escort vessels we have for our ACs. Be reminded that we only have 1 AC right now, and we only expect Vikramaditya and the 2 indigenous ACs to be ready by 2020, thats 3 ACs. We're planning for 2 aircraft carrier groups to be deployed at any given time - assuming one of them is kept in the docks at any given time. The concept of "Blue water" "Brown water" and Auxilliary force is explained quite well below, And submarines can't interecept terrorists in dingy boats :haha: , lets hope our Akulas are not going to be used for that ! http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/story_generic.jsp?topicName=india&id=news/awx/2010/05/17/awx_05_17_2010_p0-227444.xml&headline=Indian%20Navy%20Looks%20At%20Increasing%20Capabilities The Indian navy is changing its planning strategy to an emphasis on capabilities rather than focusing on the number of platforms, according to naval chief Adm. Nirmal Verma, and will be a lean, fully networked force by 2022. ŵhere is a change from the old ÃÃean-counting philosophy to one that concentrates upon ÃÄapabilities? Verma says. Keeping pace with the navyÃÔ current Maritime Capability Perspective Plan (MCPP), there are currently 34 ships and submarines on order from Indian shipyards. It has been said the Indian navy lacks a power projection capability. However, the Indian navy of 2022, Verma says, would be appropriately balanced between ÅÃlue-water forces, ÅÃrown-water offensive and defensive forces, and ÅÂuxiliary forces that would enhance sustainability and reach, apart from providing hydrographic, training and rescue capability. Coastal security measures are also being augmented in conjunction with the coast guard. The blue-water forces would be centered upon two carrier strike groups with a suitable mix of multimission-capable destroyers, frigates and corvettes. Ÿe are looking at a submarine force not much larger than our present one in terms of numbers, but certainly one that is adequately equipped to meet the operational requirements of the future, Verma says. Å°ur primary area of maritime interest is the Indian Ocean, which is an area of roughly 74 million square kilometers, and to maintain even minimal surveillance over this area requires significant capabilities. Ÿe are also seeking to modernize our mine countermeasures and mine-hunting capabilities. Similarly, shallow-water anti-submarine warfare capability, which is predominantly defensive in nature, will be given a thrust and we expect to induct specialized ASW [anti-submarine warfare] corvettes and ASW shallow water craft to enhance this capability, Verma says.
achilles Posted March 13, 2012 Posted March 13, 2012 And we still have half a dozen terrorist attacks year after year? I feel your patriotism' date=' but we need to be realistic as well.[/quote'] We have attacks because our government doesn't have the will to retort. I'm sure if we adopt a more proactive policy, the scenario would be different. Agreed, there are a few shortcomings here and there. But we have to be optimistic. Our fundamentals are strong. What hurts is we seldom go beyond Step 1. Peace and diplomacy is our best and worst attribute.
anotherhawkeye Posted March 13, 2012 Posted March 13, 2012 The army' date=' the navy, the airforce. The best in the business.[/quote'] Last time around, I wanted to give the benefit of doubt..now there's no question...you are delusional... :hysterical:. Best in business. :hysterical:
jairamesh Posted March 14, 2012 Posted March 14, 2012 We have attacks because our government doesn't have the will to retort. I'm sure if we adopt a more proactive policy, the scenario would be different. Agreed, there are a few shortcomings here and there. But we have to be optimistic. Our fundamentals are strong. What hurts is we seldom go beyond Step 1. Peace and diplomacy is our best and worst attribute. But the delicate make-up of India's demographic population and still a very fragile economy (though growing one at that) doesn't give India much flexibility on the World Stage. The other emerging giants Brazil and Russia have more leverage due to their resource based economies boosting their foreign reserves year after year. And we all know about China. As long as India imports over 70% of its energy needs means it's always hostage to foreign argy bargy. If India never secure their energy needs then I really doubt India can be anywhere close to a superpower. Even taking a quick strawpoll of Energy companies. India has no Energy companies in the top 50 in terms of proven reserves or revenues!!! The top 50 even includes companies from Malaysia, Spain, Holland, Colombia, Ecuador and along with usual suspects from Middle East, US, UK, China, Brazil and Russia, but no Indian company!! The Indian state oil companies are so pathetically run that they have no tenable strategy in place to secure future energy needs. Here is a good recent example... It took a foreign (British company) to strike oil in Rajasthan, this company has made millions of dollars selling oil and few months back sold out to an Indian company for US$6.5billion. It's an absolute scandal! and shows how incompetent Indian state companies are. There is proven oil reserves off the coast of Gujurat, yet the government has no proper national champion to take on the deep sea drilling challenges.
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