Gandhiji keeps amazing me: Bhai mahan the aap janaab

[Guest dada_rocks]

Arre guru main apna post edit karta hoon tum mujhe quote kar dete ho. Now edit your post just as I did mine. Much thanks :two_thumbs_up:

I will, but remember I kept calling for the same editing in that breeding like $%^& lapse but u kept showing it like some badge of honour post after post:haha: chalo Bihari bhai ke liye concession, positive discrimination :hysterical:

[kumble_rocks]

You must have noticed he doesn't need ur proddingu to act ' date=' usee. Over ur hounding like hyena he migh have conceded but bottomline your [b']overbearoing judgement didnt get acted upon so u sud take the hint. This method of screwing thread after thread with same barb of " close this lock this I think it's bigotry I think it;s this or that" is annoying. Due to you people I have to do summary every once in a while, u see it's redundant work ,:cantstop: Main message of OP gets lost somewhere.

Did I ask him to close this thread. And he is one of the MODS not the only one . Surely , a senior poster like yourself who has more than 5000 posts to boot will be given the due respect and he will resist from taking unilateral decision.And as for me, I just need clarification , that's all . If you are allowed to start threads like this , so should everybody else. That's the gist of my argument. And before you start accusing me, I have already commented about the OP.

[coffee_rules]

Two questions: 1) Who are these everybody? xxx

Congress and most of the other (p)secular parties. They are not voted by ants. They are voted by same minded p(secular) people who still have their heads dumped deep into sand-dunes.

2) Where is the KPS Gill article even talked about in this thread?? The originator of this thread has used it very cowardly to take pot shot at Gandhi. Agree/disagree? xxx

I Agree that OP diverted the Gill article to the unknown/unadvertised aspects of the FOTN.

[Guest dada_rocks]

U have no idea how they treat me , no respect whatsoever :haha: I am not kidding. KR rest assured I am not getting any preferential treatment. They are not going to remove evn your similar thread or for that matter anyone's under existing regulations. I feel some of your thread got removed which u thought was not religious hence you are acting like this. As I said it;s their judgement. See all along all people are talking is politics in this thread and GAndhiji's response ..If anything I think I have 36 ka aankra with each and every MOD, even BB's opinion in cricket forum hardly gell with mine..Seniority kuchh nahin hoti hai yaar.. kya hoga mujhe ban kar denge to 100 post kam ho jayega week mein kya farak parta hai.... They aren't going to tolerate my infractions just because I have 5000 posts, trust me I do get infraction reports in my PM.

[Guest dada_rocks]

2) Where is the KPS Gill article even talked about in this thread?? The originator of this thread has used it very cowardly to take pot shot at Gandhi. Agree/disagree? Sahi mein u evoke laughter at times

(a) Ali brother said sthg whihc basically called for India's integrity to be compromised from within in wake of attack from afghnistan. Very serious issue by all accounts. (b)Mahtama gandhi ,Ali brothers khilafat movement partner, didn't say a word Where does bravery/cowardice of mine or KPS gill came into question here. I have deliberately ignored the opinion part becasue I knew which u have later on clarified how averse u guys are to the words coming from KPS Gill. Stop routing debate in direction which has nothing to do with OP please

[kumble_rocks]

(a) Ali brother said sthg whihc basically called for India's integrity to be compromised from within in wake of attack from afghnistan. Very serious issue by all accounts. (b)Mahtama gandhi ,Ali brothers khilafat movement partner, didn't say a word Where does bravery/cowardice of mine or KPS gill came into question here. I have deliberately ignored the opinion part becasue I knew which u have later on clarified how averse u guys are to the words coming from KPS Gill. Stop routing debate in direction which has nothing to do with OP please

Would you agree with post No 44 ?

[talksport]

I have just read the opening post......and the whole article. and found it Flawed/Twisted Logic not looking the bigger picture... Here goes my argument a simple one. Goal : India fighting a war against British .......for Independence..... Timeline: 1924 British Strategy : Divide and Rule Gandhi did not allow it by choosing not make a comment on his allies and allow infighting ********* Between KPS Gill comparing the Congress fighting for India and the Congress that ruled India is insane..... There are no Gandhians in the congress party.

[Lurker]

Congress and most of the other (p)secular parties. They are not voted by ants. They are voted by same minded p(secular) people who still have their heads dumped deep into sand-dunes.

It would have been great had you mentioned the (p)secular parties. And yes Congress does have this record of bending over backwards to suit interests(read vote banks). The problem, in my opinion, is that the opposition(read BJP/RSS) are on complete opposite side of spectrum. They are anti-secular. I am pretty convinced most Indians get caught in the balancing acts deciding who to pick as the lesser evil and it is wrong to think Indians in general are psecs, just as it is wrong to think Indians are anti-secs when BJP was voted to power.

I Agree that OP diverted the Gill article to the unknown/unadvertised aspects of the FOTN.

Thanks. xxx

[Guest dada_rocks]

I disagree !. The concept is the same . I don't want this discussion to go in circles .So, allow me to lay out my points in concise manner . 1. Was Khilafat movement under the stewardship of Maulana Ali Jouhar aimed at British resistance - Yes 2. More importantly was Khilafat movement also a religious and poltical movement aimed to build political unity amongst Muslims and use their influence to protect the caliphate - Yes 4. Was Khilafat movement a bigoted movement akin to Wahabism- Yes 3. Did Gandhiji support Khilafat movement - Yes 4. Did Gandhi support Khilafat movement for it's resistance against British - Yes 5. Did Gandhi support Khilafat movement to protect the Caliphate and Sharia rule - No 6. Was Gandhi wrong in supporting Khilafat movement because he was giving a free pass to religious bigotry - Yes. 7. Was USA wrong in supporting Mujhadeen movement against Soviet which was under the same Caliphate protection principle - Yes. I rest my case !

Agreed, except on 5.. Gandhiji being an adult knew what he was doing and he can't shy away, which he never did, from sharing the responsibility of the primary goal of Khilafat. I give him the benefit of secondary goals but to say primary goal was not his intention is giving little too much elbow room to Mahatma. Or may be he was shrewd and knew that movement was going to fail anyway so why not lend support. and earn muslims support for independence movement. . Nobody knows what was in his mind.Point is what if that movement had succeeded Gandhiji wud have been directly responsible for creating that state KR Overall that's my point nobody doubts the good intention of Gandhiji what is being questioned is how his deeds fared. Besides the point raised in OP where Gandhiji chooses to be deaf and dumb, even there he is pining to endear himself to muslims. He was hell bent on showing hindus tolerance are limitless hoping some day other party will see the light just like british but we now know he was wrong. My point is what's wrong in saying that Gandhiji was wrong why every fair cricism be drowned by Mahatma the great. Had this been some lesser known leader who doesn't get his due for his deeds; for a second I might have entertained the thought that why show them in poor light for what they did on few things as opposed to what they did on the rest but here we are talking about Mahtaam gandhi, most talked about leader whose statue lies in every nook and corner of India. In number of statues he is second to only Ambedkar. I guess little objective criticism is not going to do any harm to his name but most certainly will give us perspective so that same mistake doesn't get repeated in future. Message is appeasement doesn't work, you can be Mahatama himself but if u expect ur tolerance someday will be registered on ROPers cerebral map then you are kidding yourself. Be firm and forthright without any undue concession over indefensible acts in hope of change of heart in future.

[Lurker]

I have just read the opening post......and the whole article. and found it Flawed/Twisted Logic not looking the bigger picture... Here goes my argument a simple one. Goal : India fighting a war against British .......for Independence..... Timeline: 1924 British Strategy : Divide and Rule Gandhi did not allow it by choosing not make a comment on his allies and allow infighting ********* Between KPS Gill comparing the Congress fighting for India and the Congress that ruled India is insane..... There are no Gandhians in the congress party.

Good post there TS. To compare the effort of Gandhi whose main aim was to unite Indians, with modern Congress whose aim is largely to seperate Indians into vote banks is ridiculous. xx

[The Outsider]

Goal : India fighting a war against British .......for Independence..... Timeline: 1924 British Strategy : Divide and Rule Gandhi did not allow it by choosing not make a comment on his allies and allow infighting

The best 5 lines in the thread. :thumbs_up:

[Guest dada_rocks]

so actually gandhiji silence was meant to appease their viciperous tendencie right... he was trying to save unity which we all know despite all the concessions he could not. achieve .. now none can accuse him for not trying enough fact is he never quit on his appeasement.. so if this line of thinking didn't work then it has to do with in the inherent flaw of thiking ... meanis appeasement does not work. per se, and same mistake must not be repeated .. yahin baat aap bandhu log agar shuru mein accept karte fir ye lamba detour ki zaroorat hi nahin hoti..

[yoda]

so actually gandhiji silence was meant to appease their viciperous tendencie right... he was trying to save unity which we all know despite all the concessions he could not. achieve .. now none can accuse him for not trying enough fact is he never quit on his appeasement.. so if this line of thinking didn't work then it has to do with in the inherent flaw of thiking ... meanis appeasement does not work. per se' date=' and same mistake must not be repeated .. yahin baat aap bandhu log agar shuru mein accept karte fir ye lamba detour ki zaroorat hi nahin hoti..[/quote'] ok, let's have a civil war.

[Guest dada_rocks]

Things won't get to to war if we stop appeasing rest assured otherwise it will get. to that...

[coffee_rules]

What was he thinking, anyway? Khilafat movement was for protecting the rights of the caliphate, the ottomon emperor, a truly religious cause. Why did the Indian muslims fight for the rights of a person/political figure who doesn't care or doesn't know about their existence? This shows how much of nationalistic feeling is expected out of them. How can somebody believe that they can be included in the "Independence" movement of a nation which is not even being thought of primarlily by the community. The ottomon emperor himself was fighting with his own people (Turkish revolution) and not just the Brits. It made absolutely no sense for FOTN to expect the majority of the nation will be behind a religious cause which might even be the cause of breakage of unity of the nation's people. It had disaster written all over it. .

[kumble_rocks]

Bheembhai , you never answered post no 44 , especially point No 7 . Care to comment ?

[sandtest]

Bheembhai ' date=' you never answered post no 44 , especially point No 7 . Care to comment ?[/quote'] KR Mujahideen moment in Afghanistan was a "political" compulsion of US and NOT driven by any religious ideology or radical ummah ideology. During Cold War time, US wanted to neutralize the growing influence of Russia in South Asia. Russia was already having very close link with India and having realized that US became increasingly worried if Russia ocupies Afghanistan, it will harm it's long term interest in Gulf and South Asia as afghanistn is strategically located bordering Iran. Politics is always dirty and you have no permanent enemy or freinds in politics. If tomorrow god bless India becomes a suprepower as USA is today, she should also do the same thing as USA is doing i.e. look at your influence and interest FIRST.

[Guest dada_rocks]

KR simple: We endorsed russian occupation of Afghanistan USA screwed russians in afghnistan through Mujahidden, there was no Khalifat being restored by USA unlike our khilafat whihc has its primary goal for restoration fo khilafat as offshoot gandhij expected muslim community support for their own independence movement. As Coffee pointed it's twisted to start with that support for some movement in turkey will convince a section of indians to fight for their own independence. How the great man could not see this obvious lacunae in his theory is bewildering to say the least. Same crapola immortalized by Gandhiji plays even today. we must not say a pip to palestinian terrorist lest section of indian will get offended ( wonder why). We keep putting isral down even at the cost of our own natioanl interst lest soome seciton might get offended. we must not say a pip against iran's nuclear ambition lest again a section of indian might get offended... we totally black out what's going on in sudan again lest a section of indian get offended... This will continue till somone musters enough balls and says India's interest is paramoount we can't pander to the religious bond across the globe; it's secular country as simple as that and see how tantrum throwing disappears from the scene. Instead we keep doing same thing again and again and that section keeps getting emboldend with its demand. I just pray it doesn't end up with its natural conclusion ending in yet another partition.