IP doesn't deserve to be in the playing XI

[bunny]

Especially when we are playing 4 bowlers. Now that PK and IS are bowling well, he can't hope to open the bowling and hence he is not effective at all. He is at best a 5th bowler. (His record in the last year) M I O M R W Best Avg. Econ SR 24 23 179.3 6 989 23 4/41 43.00 5.50 46.8 Career summary GroupingAscending Mat Inns Overs Mdns Runs Wkts BBI Ave Econ SR 4 5 v Australia 13 13 98.4 1 562 16 4/41 35.12 5.69 37.0 1 0 view innings v Bangladesh 1 1 3.0 0 22 0 - - 7.33 - 0 0 view innings v Pakistan 6 6 53.5 3 308 5 1/45 61.60 5.72 64.6 0 0 view innings v Sri Lanka 4 3 24.0 2 97 2 1/23 48.50 4.04 72.0 0 0 view innings

[bunny]

Let's pick Gony, Dinda, Nehra or Munaf instead. They are much more deserving.

[zubinpepsi]

I agree.. he shud be kicked out....

[satishg]

i think dhoni has given a specific role to Irfan..to be the 1st change bowler..as u said PK and Ishant are sharing the new ball and if Sree comes back then he mite get the new ball ahead of Irfan..i think this has caused a change in the attitude of Irfans bowling..he is looking to contain nowadays more than picking wickets..his prime weapon is his swing and he is not the "hit the deck" kinda bowler so the one change mite not be working as effectively as dhoni thinks..although to Irfans credit he has tried his best but i still feel that he is at his best wen he gets the ball to swing away frm the left handers..

[Temujin Khaghan]

He gives some us boost with the lower batting order. Sometimes the last recognized batsman (mostly Dhoni or sometimes yuvraj) needs someone to rotate the strike and can hit the ball to a fair distance or give him a helping hand in building a partnership. If either Chawla can blossom into a better-than-irfan-batsman or Praveen can use some brain and prefer the Klusener way instead of afridi way... then definitely we will have more choices. As of now, Irfan is not a liability yet, he is just scratching around playing supporting roles in some of our wins.

[bunny]

i think dhoni has given a specific role to Irfan..to be the 1st change bowler..as u said PK and Ishant are sharing the new ball and if Sree comes back then he mite get the new ball ahead of Irfan..i think this has caused a change in the attitude of Irfans bowling..he is looking to contain nowadays more than picking wickets..his prime weapon is his swing and he is not the "hit the deck" kinda bowler so the one change mite not be working as effectively as dhoni thinks..although to Irfans credit he has tried his best but i still feel that he is at his best wen he gets the ball to swing away frm the left handers..

Exactly...And that's why either he should be opening the bowling or hit the deck bowlers like Nehra, Gony, Munaf should be playing ahead of him.

[zubinpepsi]

i expect dsr here.. :D

[bunny]

he gives some spine with the batting order. Sometimes the last recognized batsman (mostly Dhoni or sometimes yuvraj) needs someone to rotate the strike and can hit the ball to a fair distance or give him a helping hand in building a partnership. If either Chawla can blossom into a better-than-irfan-batsman or Praveen can use some brain and prefer the Klusener way instead of afridi way... then definitely we will have more choices. As of now, Irfan is not a liability yet, he is just scratching around playing supporting roles in some of our wins.

Surely if are playing 7 batsmen, then we don't need IP's batting. Otherwise there is some problem anyway. My point is IP cannot be the 1st change bowler. No way is he suited for that role.

[msb1991]

Irfan has been in some bad form, but lets not write him off just yet. He needs to bowl a generally fuller length in ODIs and give the ball a chance to swing in. He currently pitches the ball too short in ODIs and his only full balls are too far outside off stump. I believe that his current bowling style is more suitable for Test matches whereas he needs a more inswing based approach in ODIs which may require him to close off his action somewhat more.

[Temujin Khaghan]

Surely if are playing 7 batsmen, then we don't need IP's batting. Otherwise there is some problem anyway. My point is IP cannot be the 1st change bowler. No way is he suited for that role.

Zaheer is recovering Sreesanth is injured they are going to try out RP today anyway (For ishanth i think) Munaf... not so soon maybe gony can come in for irfan but remember what happened in the last match against pak... we were some 6 down with 8 overs to go... i think. its only because irfan was there with raina that we managed 330. otherwise we would have been skitted out for >300... let irfan play atleast until the batting order is settled. dhoni still has to decide the correct spots for the middle order. thats the bigger issue at the moment, as I see it.

[Rohip]

He should definitely go, one Pathan in the team is more than enough

[Pro !!]

IP is a bit off color. AM sure he will be back soon. In the mean time India has a strong bench strength. Players like Goni should be given a chance !!

[Fontaine]

Pathan won't be dropped because he's an important all rounder who's a genuine talent. A few average ODI's and naive opinions aren't going to change that. Give him the new ball (like he had against Australia) and he'll look great but right now he's playing a specific role of first change bowler.

[The Outsider]

Pathan obviously is being used as a containing option by Dhoni in the middle and death overs. He has a very goo economy rate of 5.5 as posted in the above stats and offers a good batting option either lower down the order or as a successful pinch hitter, and is a very good fielder. Pretty good limited overs package I must say.

[bunny]

Pathan obviously is being used as a containing option by Dhoni in the middle and death overs. He has a very goo economy rate of 5.5 as posted in the above stats and offers a good batting option either lower down the order or as a successful pinch hitter' date=' and is a very good fielder. Pretty good limited overs package I must say.[/quote'] Compare his performance with that of Nehra's when he was bowling 1st-2nd change. (Econ: 4.35 Ave: 25.5) An economy rate of 5.5 with an average of 43 is just not acceptable

[bunny]

Munaf as 1st change: Ave: 33 Econ: 4.9

[The Outsider]

Compare his performance with that of Nehra's when he was bowling 1st-2nd change. (Econ: 4.35 Ave: 25.5) An economy rate of 5.5 with an average of 43 is just not acceptable

Can Nehra hold a bat? Can Nehra pinch hit at crucial junctures? Can Nehra field? All the above apply to Munaf only with greater conviction.

[bunny]

Can Nehra hold a bat? Can Nehra pinch hit at crucial junctures? Can Nehra field? All the above apply to Munaf only with greater conviction.

Fielding is overrated especially when you compare IP with Nehra/Patel. Regarding batting, we are already playing 7 batsmen. Then there's PK and Chawla to pinch-hit. If we are playing 6 batsmen then I'd agree, but in that case we would anyway be playing 3 fast bowlers ahead of IP. IP can be your fourth bowler or someone who opens the attack (if in form). Otherwise, he just won't capitalize on the advantage gained by the new ball bowlers, like what happened today. A Nehra or a Munaf today would have ensured that the score wouldn't have gone past 180.

[The Outsider]

Fielding is overrated especially when you compare IP with Nehra/Patel.

Fielding can never be overrated one one party in the comparison is Munaf. His mere presence on the field results in a drop in intensity.

Regarding batting, we are already playing 7 batsmen. Then there's PK and Chawla to pinch-hit. If we are playing 6 batsmen then I'd agree, but in that case we would anyway be playing 3 fast bowlers ahead of IP. IP can be your fourth bowler or someone who opens the attack (if in form).

When have P Kumar and Chawla come in as pinch hitters and never mind done a good job at it? Kumar on the evidence so far has a brain no better than Afridi's when it comes to batting and Chawla's ODI average is 6.5. 90% of the ODIs are won by batsmen and Pathan's batting utility cannot be underestimated even if he gives away an extra 10 runs to opposition.

[bunny]

Have a look at those situations in which IP came at #8 and scored 20+. There are about 10-15 such occassions and barring 3-4, almost all came when we had already lost. And also in those 3-4, you will see that guys coming at #9 and below also contributed almost as much as IP did which makes me believe that such situations are pretty rare, and in such situations you can count on Chawla or PK to also come good. In short, you don't need the batting prowess from a #8 player. Any slogger will work in those rare occassions. Regarding fielding, surely Munaf (and maybe Nehra) will concede the odd boundary but even such occassions are rare (maybe once a match on average) which makes almost no difference unless all of your fielders are Munaf-clones, which they aren't. Anyway it's hard to quantify the role of a fielder and a #8 batsman, but clearly Pathan sucks as a #3 bowler.