When will we have an express fast bowler?

[King Tendulkar]

Still some way off from the fitness needed for international cricket especially test matches. But he has been impressive. Had a fairly decent domestic season, bowled reasonably well. Now, if only he could lose some of the fat, work in the gym for the next 30 days to build the muscles and stamina, he would be a shoo in for the touring party for England.

Yesterday did not look fat at all. Looked trim and fit. Bowled with good pace of 135 to 140 which is pace he bowls when at his best. Also swinging it like in england tour. With RP and aaron bowling like they did, makes vinny kumar selction look stupid

[express bowling]

Thats Ishwar Chaudhary. Was very impressive in a Vijay hazare Trophy match earlier this season shown live on Neo. Very tall guy with a smooth action' date=' hits around 134-135 kmph consistently. Needs bulkinh up though. With some muscle and fine tuning, can definitely hit 140+[/quote'] Indian domestic pace checks often show bowlers to be 7 to 10k slower than they are in international cricket. Maybe the speed guns are set differently or are not consistent enough or whatever. In the same match Ishant was bowling 135/137 but visually looking as quick as he is looking now. Ishwar Chaudhury may have potentiial. Why is he not playing the IPL ?

[rkt.india]

Chaudhary was with KKR in first IPL then with RR but never got the chance to play. He has not gotten any team this year. Rahul SHukla too was with MI last year, but this year he is not with any team. He looks to be injured as he as not even played Vijay Hazaare trophy and also he didn't play Jharkhand Premier league in March.

[express bowling]

Ishwar Chaudhury looked impressive. It is strange that he did not get any IPL team where so many mediocre players are actually in the playing 11s. Is Rahul Shukla pacy ?

[rkt.india]

Ishwar Chaudhury looked impressive. It is strange that he did not get any IPL team where so many mediocre players are actually in the playing 11s. Is Rahul Shukla pacy ?

I have heard he is pacy. Rahul Shukla and Varun Aaron both play for Jharkhand and bowl together. He too is a an MRF product like Aaron.

[cowboysfan]

I am going to defend BCCI on the vinay kumar slection.they have clearly ignored IPL performances and picked players on the merit of their play in regular domestic cricket.We have learned a hard lesson of picking players based on IPL.Imo Aaron (and rahul sharma too)has a long way to go,let him put up consistent performances in the upcoming season(without getting injured)and he will surey get picked.

[rkt.india]

I am going to defend BCCI on the vinay kumar slection.they have clearly ignored IPL performances and picked players on the merit of their play in regular domestic cricket.We have learned a hard lesson of picking players based on IPL.Imo Aaron (and rahul sharma too)has a long way to go' date='let him put up consistent performances in the upcoming season(without getting injured)and he will surey get picked.[/quote'] can you tell me how many players are selected on the basis of IPL, only MS Gony and he too was not given enough chances. There is no other player who has been selected on sole basis of IPL. Problem with selectors is, they pick bowlers but do not give them enough time to grow with team and improve. While our tailunted batsmen like Rohit got a long rope. Raina got long rope before he was dropped. 50-60 matches and they performed once a while in all those matches too. Bowlers take time to grow especially now a days when you find patta wickets mostly. Selectors are not treating bowlers well. They think, they will play ranji and will improve but not, if they play ranji, they will stay at the same level that they are because they are not bowling to Sachin Tendulkar there or Dravid or Sehwag or Kallis or Ponting. They will not improve if they continue playing at that low level. To grow, they need to be challenged and at an extended time and this is the right time we chose those potential bowlers who can serve us in the future. Everyone improves with the level he is at or he faces or when he has done well that low level.

[asterix]

I think all the current India team hopefuls need more and more 'India A' matches with various Test playing nation's "A" teams. That's the best way to test them out and to check their mettle..

[rkt.india]

I think all the current India team hopefuls need more and more 'India A' matches with various Test playing nation's "A" teams. That's the best way to test them out and to check their mettle..

yeah that is a good idea, but BCCI does not get time from IPL to think about all these things. We do not even have a single U-19 team tour since the last U-19 WC and world cup is due next year itself...

[ganeshran]

I think all the current India team hopefuls need more and more 'India A' matches with various Test playing nation's "A" teams. That's the best way to test them out and to check their mettle..

+1

[saneindian]

can you tell me how many players are selected on the basis of IPL, only MS Gony and he too was not given enough chances. There is no other player who has been selected on sole basis of IPL. Problem with selectors is, they pick bowlers but do not give them enough time to grow with team and improve. While our tailunted batsmen like Rohit got a long rope. Raina got long rope before he was dropped. 50-60 matches and they performed once a while in all those matches too. Bowlers take time to grow especially now a days when you find patta wickets mostly. Selectors are not treating bowlers well. They think, they will play ranji and will improve but not, if they play ranji, they will stay at the same level that they are because they are not bowling to Sachin Tendulkar there or Dravid or Sehwag or Kallis or Ponting. They will not improve if they continue playing at that low level. To grow, they need to be challenged and at an extended time and this is the right time we chose those potential bowlers who can serve us in the future. Everyone improves with the level he is at or he faces or when he has done well that low level.

Did Zaheer not get a long rope? Did RP Singh not get a long rope? Wasn't Munaf persisted with despite poor performances? Ditto with Ishant. For that matter even Irfan kept his spot in the team despite poor form for so long. Even the likes of Gony got picked for the national side, played a few games, then were in the loop by getting picked for rest of India squads and for practice match vs the Aussies, did not do much. Then got picked for Challenger Trophy, again did not do much, played the domestic season , no good performances again. How do you expect him or others like him to get picked again for an international series if he cannot repeat some of the previous performances in the domestic season.

[rkt.india]

Did Zaheer not get a long rope? Did RP Singh not get a long rope? Wasn't Munaf persisted with despite poor performances? Ditto with Ishant. For that matter even Irfan kept his spot in the team despite poor form for so long. Even the likes of Gony got picked for the national side, played a few games, then were in the loop by getting picked for rest of India squads and for practice match vs the Aussies, did not do much. Then got picked for Challenger Trophy, again did not do much, played the domestic season , no good performances again. How do you expect him or others like him to get picked again for an international series if he cannot repeat some of the previous performances in the domestic season.

i am talking about this selection committee, not 5-10 years ago. how many chances Gony got for India, 2 ODIs only and he too did well in ranji after that. gony was plagued by injuries this year. but before that season in 2009, he had done well in ranjis. Dinda was doing fairly well...wasnt picked for unknown reasons after 4-5 matches, he specially did better than Vinay. I am in favor of giving fast bowler who they think has potential at least 20 ODIs as they gave 40-50 ODIs to batsmen, instead they go back to oldies like Nehra who has not done anything special too for the sake of experience. Sudeep Tyagi was not picked after 3-4 ODis. Selectors expect too much from them to take 4-5 wickets from the first match itself. The musical chairs they have done is a big problem. They need to let the young bowlers settle. By this way, we will never get a set of bowlers because we do not give them time to assess them and settle in the team. They keep chopping changing. They brought Unadkat instead of Mithun in SA.

[Sir_Afridi]

Ohhoho...Brett Lee has taken 700 wickets in word cricket...He is not a good bowler. What are you talking about. How many fast bowlers have taken 700 wickets? not more than 5-10. This says he has been a good bowler.

Lee is a good LOI bowler which many ordinary bowlers are like Sami & Agarkar. Lee averages in 30s in tests despite playing most matches in bowler friendly conditions. Except one or two seasons after Mcgrath retirement, Lee has always been ordinary. I dont rate test bowlers who average in 30s.

[saneindian]

i am talking about this selection committee, not 5-10 years ago. how many chances Gony got for India, 2 ODIs only and he too did well in ranji after that. gony was plagued by injuries this year. but before that season in 2009, he had done well in ranjis. Dinda was doing fairly well...wasnt picked for unknown reasons after 4-5 matches, he specially did better than Vinay. I am in favor of giving fast bowler who they think has potential at least 20 ODIs as they gave 40-50 ODIs to batsmen, instead they go back to oldies like Nehra who has not done anything special too for the sake of experience. Sudeep Tyagi was not picked after 3-4 ODis. Selectors expect too much from them to take 4-5 wickets from the first match itself. The musical chairs they have done is a big problem. They need to let the young bowlers settle. By this way, we will never get a set of bowlers because we do not give them time to assess them and settle in the team. They keep chopping changing. They brought Unadkat instead of Mithun in SA.

For deserving 20 ODIs, a bowler has to show some potential in the chances he gets. Unfortunately none of Dinda, Gony or Yadav have shown that. They got picked for the best domestic games like Irani Trophy, practice games vs visitng sides, challenger series etc and did nothing of note. On what basis should the selectors give them further chances? Just because they can hurl a few balls at 140+? Tyagi is good but is prone to injuries and needs to sort out his fitness first. As for your argument about batsmen getting more chances, well Dhawan scored a 0 , he is out, Tiwary played 2 games, he's out, Badri got 3 games in 2008 went out, Nayar got a few games , got out. Only those showed enough promise in their first 2-3 one dayers were persisted with, Rohit played few crucial knocks in t20 WC and in the CB series, Raina helped us win the SL ODI series on his comeback. What did any of these pacers 'who should be given 20 ODIs' did in the chances they got?

[rkt.india]

For deserving 20 ODIs, a bowler has to show some potential in the chances he gets. Unfortunately none of Dinda, Gony or Yadav have shown that. They got picked for the best domestic games like Irani Trophy, practice games vs visitng sides, challenger series etc and did nothing of note. On what basis should the selectors give them further chances? Just because they can hurl a few balls at 140+? Tyagi is good but is prone to injuries and needs to sort out his fitness first. As for your argument about batsmen getting more chances, well Dhawan scored a 0 , he is out, Tiwary played 2 games, he's out, Badri got 3 games in 2008 went out, Nayar got a few games , got out. Only those showed enough promise in their first 2-3 one dayers were persisted with, Rohit played few crucial knocks in t20 WC and in the CB series, Raina helped us win the SL ODI series on his comeback. What did any of these pacers 'who should be given 20 ODIs' did in the chances they got?

Dinda did well in the limited opportunities he got in ODIs on patta wickets. You cant expect him to pic 3-4 wicket in every game he played and he only played 3-4 ODIs. He did fairly well in Zim and SL series. Vinay kumar too has not done anything special why he is persisted according to your criteria and dont talk about ranji trophy performance. Ranji trophy stats are misleading. If they wanted to select a futuristic team then they needed to select some players who can be the part of Indian team in future. There are many played who h have superlative domestic stats but has not done well at international cricket. Talking about Badri. Tiwary, and Nayar ouster. It happened because there are not many batting places in Indian team right now and they all are in contention all the time.

[rkt.india]

Lee is a good LOI bowler which many ordinary bowlers are like Sami & Agarkar. Lee averages in 30s in tests despite playing most matches in bowler friendly conditions. Except one or two seasons after Mcgrath retirement' date=' Lee has always been ordinary. I dont rate test bowlers who average in 30s.[/quote'] Brett Lee has 350 plus test wickets over 4 wickets per test and you are saying he is an ordinary bowler. He at the age of 35 still can play for any country in the world. He is an attacking bowler so he is prone for leaking runs and pitches have become batsman friendly all over the world now a days except some pitches in SA and sometime in England when it swings a lot because of conditions. He has also played 70 odd test matches. Except Gabba or to some extent Perth, Australia have produced flattest pitches for test matches in recent years.

[express bowling]

Number of wickets per test is the biggest practical parameter to judge a bowler if he has played reasonably long and is not an allrounder ( he can play some tests just for his batting and thereby negate this parameter ). High average indicates that the bowler is not miserly but can still have the ability to pick up wickets at a high rate. 3.5 wickets per test ---- good bowler 4 wickets per test ---- great bowler

[express bowling]

Domestic cricket performance, just by itself, has never been a good parameter in unravelling good international players. There have been many instances of Ranji trophy superstars falling flat and failing abjectly in the international arena. If domestic performance is to be considered then Zonal match performances are much better indicators as the quality of opposition is much better. As somebody had written earlier, A-team tours are good indicators as up and coming cricketers from other countries are competing. I think that all the parameters should be considered in totality, and not just Ranji performance, while selecting a relatively NEW cricketer. The TYPE of batsman or bowler is also very important.

[Rana]

Having an express fast bowler suggests a lot about your countrys people..... we are hot and strong baby!!B->

[Ultimate_Game]

Having an express fast bowler suggests a lot about your countrys people..... we are hot and strong baby!!B->

Asking cabbies in London about their sexual preference doesn't count