Bublu Bhuyan Posted January 8, 2011 Author Posted January 8, 2011 Taking the example Outsider gave the other day' date=' in the just concluded Ashes series, Ponting averages around 16 but in the 4th innings, he averages 53 in the same series! Big help it was for the team[/quote'] You are giving a one off incident. I'm not speaking about a particular match. I'm speaking of an entire career. Let me break this out in one sentence - Sehwag averages 28 odd while chasing in the 4th innings of Test matches. Does that figure prove or not that he struggles while chasing in 4th innings?
Bublu Bhuyan Posted January 8, 2011 Author Posted January 8, 2011 Sehwag is the real deal. If ball is swinging,he'll whack it out of shape or he'll send it out of the park. With regards to 4th innings average, it will take only a couple of innings to rectify it. No worries :-) I know why Bablu made this thread :sherlock: But until then is it so difficult to admit that he has struggled so far in this overall career while chasing in 4th innings of Test matches? I use the word 'overall' since most of you will bring that one off knock of his played against England in late 2008.
Kumar Posted January 8, 2011 Posted January 8, 2011 So he had a one very bad series, does this mean we should call him a FTB????? Also remember this is the same man who scored a brilliant 190 odd against Australia Also on a return comeback test he got a delightful 150 odd against Australia He also got 180 against the West indies His debut 100 against South Africa right? weren't all of these outside the sub continent? oh and one in England? LOL oh and didnt he also get a 200 which was considered not a flat track in SL? one of the best hundreds youll get!! So he has a better record in the sub continent but to be fair he hasnt played alot of cricket outside oppossed to the likes of SRT, dravid and laxman etc! Still its such the typical indian thing to do, when one batsmen fails a series, we immediately have these hatred threads created for no reason, sehwag did terrible prior to Adelaide, and look how he bounced back, with 2 double centuries, a triple century, icc test player of the year for two years running!!!! I would even go as far as saying either our second best or best player of the past decade! ( him and dravid easily the best for india in past ten years) so stop complaning!
Chandan Posted January 8, 2011 Posted January 8, 2011 Well first of all' date=' I don't have a different opinion from the rest of the [u']masses, rather I have an opinion different from the rest of the fan boys. If you include non-Indian fans, most of them are quite familiar with the fact that Sehwag seems to somewhat struggle outside Asia. And those facts I provided are a testimony to it. If you disagree, counter them. Secondly, Sehwag wouldn't find a place among the top 30 Test batsman ever, let alone him being one of the greatest Test batsman ever. One Christopher Martin Jenkings (noted cricket analyst) recently made a list of his 100 Test cricketers of all time. Guess what? Sehwag couldn't find a spot in that list. That speaks volumes about how highly he is rated by his non fan boys. Simply because he almost always performs whenever he plays in Asia. He failed in a series after a long time, but most importantly this series was the first one in a long time played outside his comfort zone. Yes, even before this series Sehwag's conditions in those alien conditions were almost the same. And I was waiting to see how he performs in a series held outside the subcontinent. Is it a co-incidence that he has been going great guns in almost every series since the last tour to New Zealand (ironically the second last series played outside Asia, where he failed) and now once again he fails the moment he steps outside Asia after a long gap? When exactly did I say that? I made two different paoints - 1.) He struggles outside Asia. Bublu, Although I generally never participate in these kind of threads which only talk in numbers without any context. But this one was getting a bit too much, hence a few questions to you: 1. Is Australia in Asia, according to you? 2. Is WI outside Asia according to you? 3.Why is a batsman looked down upon if his performance is not so high in England? Are we forced to agree whatever garbage Ebglish media and English ex players have to hurl at us? 4.As for his below par performance in NZ in 2009, are you implying that Sehwag struggled again swing or seam bowling. As for the 4th inning, I believe, sertting us a match to win it is much more valuable than mess it us in the beginning and then try to win in the end!
Bublu Bhuyan Posted January 8, 2011 Author Posted January 8, 2011 Bublu, Although I generally never participate in these kind of threads which only talk in numbers without any context. But this one was getting a bit too much, hence a few questions to you: 1. Is Australia in Asia, according to you? Was Australia not included while analyzing his average outside Asia which turned out to be 38 odd? 2. Is WI outside Asia according to you? Was WI not included while analyzing his average outside Asia which turned out to be 38 odd? 3.Why is a batsman looked down upon if his performance is not so high in England? Are we forced to agree whatever garbage Ebglish media and English ex players have to hurl at us? Why exactly do Indian fans love to mention Ponting's poor average in India? That's because he is an Australian and his skills are tested when he plays on slow and turning tracks in the subcontinent. Likewise, England is one of the hardest places to score runs for a batsman from the subcontinent. And we are not speaking of his below par performance in England, we are speaking of his not so good performances as a whole outside Asia. 4.As for his below par performance in NZ in 2009' date=' are you implying that Sehwag struggled again swing or seam bowling.[/quote'] Stuff off whatever reason he struggled for, that's not what I'm speaking of. I ain't even speaking of that particular tour or the recent tour to South Africa. We are speaking of his overall performance outside Asia, which isn't formidable compared to his overall career average. As for the 4th inning' date=' I believe, sertting us a match to win it is much more valuable than mess it us in the beginning and then try to win in the end![/quote'] Setting up a match for a win - Sehwag's strength. Choking unprecedentedly while chasing in the 4th innings - Sehwag's weakness.
The Outsider Posted January 8, 2011 Posted January 8, 2011 Bublu, why was Sehwag the second highest scorer in the match at Durban from either sides - arguably the greenest, fastest, and bounciest pitch seen in international cricket for years?
Guest Gunner Posted January 8, 2011 Posted January 8, 2011 Bublu' date=' why was Sehwag the second highest scorer in the match at Durban from either sides - arguably the greenest, fastest, and bounciest pitch seen in international cricket for years?[/quote'] He got lucky.
The Outsider Posted January 8, 2011 Posted January 8, 2011 He got lucky. How so? I don''t remember any umpiring decision that went in his favor or any dropped catch? Neither did he play or miss any more than any other player. Did Laxman get lucky as well?
Bublu Bhuyan Posted January 8, 2011 Author Posted January 8, 2011 Bublu' date=' why was Sehwag the second highest scorer in the match at Durban from either sides - arguably the greenest, fastest, and bounciest pitch seen in international cricket for years?[/quote'] Sir, my observation is based on his entire career, not a couple of matches. There'll always be a one off instance. If you want to take one off instances, both Tendulkar and Dravid failed at Durban recently. Going by that can we assume that both of them are suspect outside Asia irrespective of that fact that they average over 50 there? And you are speaking as if he did wonders in Durban. His scores in that match reads 25 and 32.
The Outsider Posted January 8, 2011 Posted January 8, 2011 Sir, my observation is based on his entire career, not a couple of matches. There'll always be a one off instance. If you want to take one off instances, both Tendulkar and Dravid failed at Durban recently. Going by that can we assume that both of them are suspect outside Asia irrespective of that fact that they average over 50 there? And you are speaking as if he did wonders in Durban. His scores in that match reads 25 and 32. So, an average of 40 with a strike rate of 80 for an opener in conditions where the most difficult time for batting is against the new ball are poor returns? Was it or not the second highest total in the match? How can someone who sucks so much manage to score more than the likes of Tendulkar, Dravid, Kallis, Smith on the most difficult track seen in international cricket for years?
Bublu Bhuyan Posted January 8, 2011 Author Posted January 8, 2011 BTW Bublu are you willing to accept that Kapil ' date=' AK, Zak , Srinath, MuMu Vaas etc are the premier bowlers in the history of cricket as they have bucket loads of wkts in Asian conditions which are tailor made for batting. [/quote'] Where exactly did I ever mention that Asian conditions are tailor made for batting? However, players from the subcontinent are used to them. That's my point. And also are you willing to accept that Denniss Lillee is the bowling equivalent of a FTB ? I once created a thread where I raised my doubts on his greatness.
Bublu Bhuyan Posted January 8, 2011 Author Posted January 8, 2011 So' date=' an average of 40 with a strike rate of 80 for an opener in conditions where the most difficult time for batting is against the new ball are poor returns?[/quote'] That average isn't 40, but rather 38 odd. Of course it isn't pathetic by any means, but it ain't that good either.
Chandan Posted January 8, 2011 Posted January 8, 2011 Was Australia not included while analyzing his average outside Asia which turned out to be 38 odd? Wrong. Sehwag averages 59.5 in Australia. link Was WI not included while analyzing his average outside Asia which turned out to be 38 odd? Again wrong. He averages 51.00 in WI. Check the same link given above. Why exactly do Indian fans love to mention Ponting's poor average in India? That's because he is an Australian and his skills are tested when he plays on slow and turning tracks in the subcontinent. Likewise, England is one of the hardest places to score runs for a batsman from the subcontinent. And we are not speaking of his below par performance in England, we are speaking of his not so good performances as a whole outside Asia. Don't think poor performance in India stopped any of the English or Australian or such experts from calling Ponting the best batsman in the world till last year. Obviously they didn't care about his poor performance in India and even England. Was the whole world of experts under the 'fan-boy' categort for 6-7 years? As for Sehwag, he has "not so good performance " only at: England (played just 1 tour in 2002) SA (played 3 tours) NZ (played 2 tours) and Bangladesh. Last time I checked, Bangladesh was still in Asia, where Sehwag has not a very good record. Stuff off whatever reason he struggled for, that's not what I'm speaking of. I ain't even speaking of that particular tour or the recent tour to South Africa. We are speaking of his overall performance outside Asia, which isn't formidable compared to his overall career average. Why would one speak of performances at different places? Why is entire Asia kept under one blanket as if conditions are the same in India, SL, Pak or BD? Why should we even talk of in Asia or out of Asia thing? Can you give me any reason? Setting up a match for a win - Sehwag's strength. Choking unprecedentedly while chasing in the 4th innings - Sehwag's weakness. So? You can't tell him a choker? Maybe his role in the team is to set the match up rather than go for the rescue act? Are you aware of each and every role that the platers are assigned of?
The Outsider Posted January 8, 2011 Posted January 8, 2011 That average isn't 40' date=' but rather 38 odd. Of course it isn't pathetic by any means, but it ain't that good either.[/quote'] It's 39 actually, now that you are being so pedantic : http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/player/35263.html?class=1;filter=advanced;host=1;host=2;host=3;host=4;host=5;orderby=default;template=results;type=batting If you look at that link the only places where he has done poorly are South Africa and New Zealand. To say, he failed in New Zealand because of difficult conditions is a joke because last time round the conditions were tailor made for batting and he still failed. So, he hasn't scored in one country, South Africa, due to conditions. Dravid has a similar average in South Africa. Please open a thread calling Dravid a FTB as well.
Guest Gunner Posted January 8, 2011 Posted January 8, 2011 How so? I don''t remember any umpiring decision that went in his favor or any dropped catch? Neither did he play or miss any more than any other player. He just lasted a few more deliveries than usual that is why I said lucky. I don't have anything against him I just think that he plays the moving deliveries rather poorly. Initially it was compensated by his hand eye coordination when he was younger now that is not the case. He simply lacks the footwork. He will not succeed in England, simple as that. Did Laxman get lucky as well? No, he just happens to be a technically superior player than Sehwag.
Guest Gunner Posted January 8, 2011 Posted January 8, 2011 It's 39 actually, now that you are being so pedantic : http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/player/35263.html?class=1;filter=advanced;host=1;host=2;host=3;host=4;host=5;orderby=default;template=results;type=batting If you look at that link the only places where he has done poorly are South Africa and New Zealand. To say, he failed in New Zealand because of difficult conditions is a joke because last time round the conditions were tailor made for batting and he still failed. So, he hasn't scored in one country, South Africa, due to conditions. Dravid has a similar average in South Africa. Please open a thread calling Dravid a FTB as well. He hasn't succeeded in England either except for that one century and he will do no better in England this time around. He has done poorly in SA, NZ and Eng, the three countries where there is movement and this is not going to improve as he gets older. Essentially justifying my rationale that he has a weakness against the moving ball. I am not calling him FTB etc.
The Outsider Posted January 8, 2011 Posted January 8, 2011 He hasn't succeeded in England either except for that one century and he will do no better in England this time around. He has done poorly in SA' date=' NZ and Eng, the three countries where there is movement and this is not going to improve as he gets older. Essentially justifying my rationale that he has a weakness against the moving ball. I am not calling him FTB etc.[/quote'] Don't know how you can label an Indian opener averaging 40 in England a failure. Gavaskar did not do much better either. Lumping in NZ is just a stretch to prove your point. In '02-'03 the pitches were more or less a lottery and in '09 the pitches were pretty flat. His failure in '09 has nothing to do with his inability to play in NZ conditions. The guy threw his wicket away at Napier twice, which was amongst the flattest pitches I've ever seen. But yeah, let's wait and see. I think he'll do well in England. Steyn was just in a league of his own this time round and even so a lot of his dismissals can be attributed to poor shot selection rather than a glaring fault against the new ball. Don't think 31-32 is an age when reflexes start to go down. I avoided what could have been a serious car crash a month back purely on reflexes. :D
Deleted_User_1 Posted January 8, 2011 Posted January 8, 2011 OK Sehwag is not a FTB/STB/HTB.......case closed!!
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now