Harbhajan Singh vs Saqlain Mushtaq

[Karan114]

In a Better system Saqi probably would have ended up with 500 Test wickets whereas Harbhajan wouldn;t have been picked to play test cricket in a better system.

What the hell is this "better system"? One which exists in the minds of deluded Pakistani fans? Look, one of them has almost 400 Test wickets and will end up with a lot more. The other guy took 200. Bhajji was playing when Saqlain was around, is playing when Ajmal is around and will be playing when your next off-spinner comes through...There is nothing to see here, move on already..

[ganeshran]

"Dude It is not even a contest. In a Better system Saqi probably would have ended up with 500 Test wickets whereas Harbhajan wouldn;t have been picked to play test cricket in a better system. Saqlain you get the feeling was stopped by injury more than anything, whereas Harbhajan recently has begun to struggle even in conditions you once saw him dominate in."

Define better system in cricketing terms. Injury is not an excuse for not being able to play matches. Players are expected to keep themselves fit and available for matches.. Bhajji has consistently performed twice as long as Sucklain in tests with very similar stats so Bhajji >>> Sucklain. In ODI's Bhajji fared well behind Sucklain, no contest there.

[Iconoclast]

This poll isn't even valid in the first place because Bhaji chucks his doosra. He was reported to the ICC and banned from bowling it .. but somehow it has made a slow and insidious return to his repertoire.

[Ustad]

Talk to me when Onion Bhaji invents a technique.. I'm not talking about sreenath slapping..

[ganeshran]

This poll isn't even valid in the first place because Bhaji chucks his doosra. He was reported to the ICC and banned from bowling it .. but somehow it has made a slow and insidious return to his repertoire.

Talk to me when Onion Bhaji invents a technique.. I'm not talking about sreenath slapping..

Fascinating how you diverted the argument the minute stats proved you wrong. If I want to talk about chucking, fixing, ball tampering, pitch tampering, ball biting, spectator hitting there is not one Pakistani player who can make the cut in any online discussion. Stick to the discussion.

[Ustad]

lol what stats proved what wrong?

[ganeshran]

lol what stats proved what wrong?

Bhajji has taken twice the number of test wickets with better strike rate and almost equal average. If you have some level of comprehension about cricket and stats, you would understand that maintaining averages and strike rates is more and more difficult over longer periods of time. Bhajji did that twice as long as Sucklain. Saqlain has long faded away while Bhajji is still an effective test bowler. So Bhajji >>>> Sucklain in tests. ODIs I maintained that Mushtaq was better.

[Ustad]

Bhajji aunty cant preform under pressure, saqlain could. Saqlain invented new techniques. That requires mastery. Bhajji chucks and still sucks Bhajji lost his temper and slapped sreenath :hysterical:

[Iconoclast]

Fascinating how you diverted the argument the minute stats proved you wrong. If I want to talk about chucking, fixing, ball tampering, pitch tampering, ball biting, spectator hitting there is not one Pakistani player who can make the cut in any online discussion. Stick to the discussion.

Are you kidding me ? I am sticking to the debate .. we are talking about Bhaji so we should be talking about his chucking problems also .. it is you that are sidetracking things .. see the bold part.

[ganeshran]

Bhajji aunty cant preform under pressure, saqlain could. Saqlain invented new techniques. That requires mastery. Bhajji chucks and still sucks Bhajji lost his temper and slapped sreenath :hysterical:

Very Mature. :giggle:

[Ustad]

Alloo bhajji has more wickets because he played longer. That doesn't make him a better cricketer. A movie is not better because its longer.. Saqlain in his prime was much better then Bhajji boy in his prime

[ganeshran]

Are you kidding me ? I am sticking to the debate .. we are talking about Bhaji so we should be talking about his chucking problems also .. it is you that are sidetracking things .. see the bold part.

Bhajji's action was cleared by ICC. In 2005 there was a new rule which allowed the arm to bend by 15 degrees for spinners. http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/content/story/210120.html

[ganeshran]

Alloo bhajji has more wickets because he played longer. That doesn't make him a better cricketer. A movie is not better because its longer.. Saqlain in his prime was much better then Bhajji boy in his prime

Exactly. So what stopped Sucklain from playing longer? Injuries? If so, whose fault were they? I dont buy the prime argument. Pakistani fans seem to use it everywhere they cant explain why their player was better. e.g Akhtar "in his prime" was better than Lee "in his prime" So what exactly causes a player to lose his prime? Surely there has to be some fault of his own involved.

[The Outsider]

Talk to me when Onion Bhaji invents a technique..

Sarfaraz Nawaz 'invented' reverse swing, so Sarfaraz >>>>> Imran + Waqar + Akram.

[Zelig]

Saqi invented the doosra n Harby perfected it :sialute: Murrali's doosra ain't good as some think. Whenever he goes around the wkts, or whenever he pitches the ball well outside the leg stump, you know that the ball is going in only one direction. OTOH, Harby maintains the off stump or half-middle stump line when he bowls the doosra :nice:

[abhay kuruvilla]

With all due respect to Bhajji, Saqlain was probably the best ODI bowler of the 90s..as far as tests go I would still much rather have Saqlain..

[Clarke]

Alloo bhajji has more wickets because he played longer. That doesn't make him a better cricketer.

Of course it does. It requires dedication, commitment, fitness and constant evolution in skills to survive, let alone perform for more than a decade. Just because some of your players lack that does not mean these factors do not matter. PS : Aloo is Inzibai, the bestest batsman of last twenty yrs, so no insults plz.

A movie is not better because its longer.. Saqlain in his prime was much better then Bhajji boy in his prime

Dumb yardstick. A movie can be compared to a single match/series, not an entire career.

[Asim]

Saqi was the most lethal spin bowler in ODI cricket for sure of his time when Murali and Warne were also there... used to bowl superbly in any stage of game, the best spin bowler of death overs as well... If I am not wrong Saqi played only for 6 years consistently and meantimes number of ODI wickets he took in i.e. 250+ are the number of wickets which Harbhajan managed to take just recently in more than 2ble time i.e. 13 years... so how can we compare them? :) but yeah Saqi vs Murali could be interesting... and Saqi did very very well in tests as well yar... his 5,5,5,5 in 2 Test series vs Ind... its only in last stages of his career when he was in out in out of team, he was not as effective as he used to be... He could not even complete 50 tests and was going 200+ in Tests too... Shaba Saqi Shaba Shaba...!!!

[Karan114]

and Saqi did very very well in tests as well yar... his 5' date='5,5,5 in 2 Test series vs Ind... [b']its only in last stages of his career when he was in out in out of team, he was not as effective as he used to be... He could not even complete 50 tests and was going 200+ in Tests too...

You guys keep making this point as if it is a positive for Saqlain. The fact that he couldn't last even 50 Tests and that his performance was declining for his last few Tests reflects badly on him, as it shows that he couldn't sustain his performances for too long.

[2k11 prod]

This forum is full of idiots :facepalm