asterix Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 This won't change in one night. India is a young country with a lot of poor and uneducated people. Reforms will happen over time. I am not saying they shouldn't protest. Look, if you have a reasonable agenda do protest. DO you think that Ramdev had any reasonable demands? He is an idiot and will undermine the voice of the people by pretending to represent them. Read my post carefully and I stated clearly what my oppositions is. To reiterate: A) Don't pretend to be my representative since I did not elect you and B) Don't try to write laws this is the job of the GoI. Arre administer your existing alws properly, there is no need for new ones. Who is allowing them to "write their own laws"? :giggle: GOI. Why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asterix Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Why should I care? Are they elected to represent me' date=' No. End of story.[/quote'] Then there no point in debating with you.. :(( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WC2011INDIA Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Govt. lost it completely. How can you first allow him to gather there and then after full day you are saying, he was given permission to conduct yoga camp....LOL, so what changed in a day. I am afraid this is getting uglier by the day. Ramdev Baba is furious and actually crying in front of media..LOL It was a yoga camp permitted for only 5000 people. According to Sibal, there were around 50,000 people, which they felt would soon escalate into an unpeaceful demonstration. The way this entire thing was handled is definitely wrong though. They should have waited until morning to take police action. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gunner Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Who is allowing them to "write their own laws"? :giggle: GOI. Why? But that is the whole effect of this kind of nonsense isn't it? People have allowed one man to present himself as their representative which has forced the hand of the GOI. You have essentially turned an elected government into a lame duck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gunner Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Then there no point in debating with you.. :(( Debate me on the merits of the process, why bother about these individuals? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gunner Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 It was a yoga camp permitted for only 5000 people. According to Sibal, there were around 50,000 people, which they felt would soon escalate into an unpeaceful demonstration. The way this entire thing was handled is definitely wrong though. They should have waited until morning to take police action. By morning it would have turned into a media circus and violence would have erupted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WC2011INDIA Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 By morning it would have turned into a media circus and violence would have erupted. True. However, I still feel they should have not used police force when most of the devotees and Baba were alsleep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kabira Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Gunner you make no sense. Even if individuals contesting as independent candidates win the election, they won't be able to do anything as they are independent and do not have support of any party as such. They will be debating in Loksabha/Rajyasabha LOL, so they will graduate from NDTV debate to Loksabha Civil Movements happen when something is not right, how many civil movements have been started in India over the years?? Nobody is holding Government on ransom, its government who does not care. It took them long long time to file a chargesheet against Balwa brothers. I ask why? Even our courts were surprised for the delay. When our government had ministers like Raja, Pawar, I have every right to support civil movement if I feel its right. Ramdev baba definately had political agenda for next election, But he has raised several points. Remember BJP tried to do the same year ago but their movement did not get public support, but if Baba's movements gets support and wakes common man, I am all for it. You are also wrong when you say government can't do anything about black money. You might have read in the News papers as well have heard that after the 2008 global economic crisis which started in US and engulfed whole of the world, the US have pressurised the Swiss government to disclose the identity of the US bank accounts held in Swiss Banks. And Swiss Bank Association was forced to do so because of huge diplomatic pressure. Also read this http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/article2074736.ece Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViruRulez Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 I don't know about you but I would not like it if police start coming barging into my home in the middle night and shoving me out of my home. Yes they are not Bapu, but at least show the picture from both sides. Were they attacking people and public property ? Were they calling for bandh ? Were they destabilising public life ? Fill me in on these details since I wasn't awake at 2 am I am not sure if you watched it live or you are commenting only after seeing the Peepli Live reporting the media is making today. :giggle: I was watching it live on TV and so can say for sure that it was not as harsh and one sided as media is making out today for the sake of their Peepli Live TRPs. At first it was not his home but it was supposedly a permit taken for a yoga camp which turned into a so called people movement and then into a political gain movement. I have always been one of strongest critics of Delhi Police but from what I saw yesterday live on TV, Delhi Police simply went politely to Baba Ramdev and told him about the update about the yoga camp permission cancellation. Then he acted like a real thug and escapist and fled and jumped on somebody's soldiers and got his security guards around him. Then he kept on fleeing on the person's shoulders surrounded by his illiterate followers and guards. But Police did not do anything to him. After that his followers started throwing bricks on the police who were just doing their duty and following orders. Cut the crap. That is hooliganism for sure. I hate these so called security forces but throwing bricks on them when they were just doing their duty is more than ridiculous and when those guys were not using any violence at all. It was only after this violence that police used tear gas to the mob which was turning violent. After that some of his so called supporters started pushing and fighting with the police and it was only then that police lathi charged and that too very restrictively. And women police were used to remove the women and children and not male police. No offense but media is projecting the whole act as so called "Barbaric" whereas police took utmost control and used as less force as possible. I heard on camera "Aap humare maa jaise hain, please chale jaye" etc. It was hardly by force. Media's reporting today is not actual reflection of the way in which it was dealt. It was with a lot of caution and very less force for sure. And they did not use any force at all till the so called Ramdev supporters started throwing stones. Ramdev is lying today and it was not the case yesterday and nor are media channels telling the truth. My family especially mom and dad were one of the biggest fans of Ramdev when he was a yoga guru but he is now turning out into a thug. His movement is NOT apolitical and many of his demands do not make an iota of sense except to his illiterate gullible followers. At least Anna makes sense in most of his demands and he does not bring political or controversial people in his protests. I am not a huge fan of Anna too but he is a thousand times better than this dhongi thug and another player of dirty politics viz. Baba Ramdev. The issue of corruption is very important and such movement should be headed by the progressive unbiased youth of this nation who are shaping up the nation instead of these babas and mullahs who are screwing up the nation more than building it. Media is taking some TRPs from this issue but the nation hardly cares. I guess cracking down on sleeping people is violation of fundamental rights..! Baba Ramdev may be asking for ridiculous demands but he has every right to protest peacefully. Govt has no right to use tear gases on peaceful protest. I think Govt has to pay the price for it in the future. ViruRules, Do you ever sleep? LOL .. I normally do not have a fixed sleeping time being a webmaster. But I was about to sleep yesterday night as my internet was not working properly since evening. And when I switched the TV the fun started and I caught the fun live on TV for the next 3-4 hours. :giggle: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saneindian Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Congress slipping further. They have absolutely no idea how to handle this. A midnight swoop by 5000 policemen armed with guns and the support of rapid action force on women and kids sleeping? Are we even a democracy? Police firing tear gas shells at 2 in the morning when nothing was going on? Thank god there were no casualties, a stampeded there could have killed hundreds. Was the home ministr (who controls Delhi Police) even considering such risks or they know politically this won;t do much damage hence let the innocents be dealt with mercilessly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
punjabi_khota Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 MC viru have you heard of concept of paragraphs ? :wall: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kabira Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 >At first it was not his home but it was supposedly a permit taken for a yoga camp which turned into a so called people movement Goverment already knew there wil be peaceful protest. So for entire day they allowed them to protest. But at midnight when everyone is sleeping they suddenly thought its illegal? How does that work Virubhai? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saneindian Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 I am not sure if you watched it live or you are commenting only after seeing the Peepli Live reporting the media is making today. :giggle: I was watching it live on TV and so can say for sure that it was not as harsh and one sided as media is making out today for the sake of their Peepli Live TRPs. At first it was not his home but it was supposedly a permit taken for a yoga camp which turned into a so called people movement and then into a political gain movement. I have always been one of strongest critics of Delhi Police but from what I saw yesterday live on TV, Delhi Police simply went politely to Baba Ramdev and told him about the update about the yoga camp permission cancellation. Then he acted like a real thug and escapist and fled and jumped on somebody's soldiers and got his security guards around him. Then he kept on fleeing on the person's shoulders surrounded by his illiterate followers and guards. But Police did not do anything to him. After that his followers started throwing bricks on the police who were just doing their duty and following orders. Cut the crap. That is hooliganism for sure. I hate these so called security forces but throwing bricks on them when they were just doing their duty is more than ridiculous and when those guys were not using any violence at all. It was only after this violence that police used tear gas to the mob which was turning violent. After that some of his so called supporters started pushing and fighting with the police and it was only then that police lathi charged and that too very restrictively. And women police were used to remove the women and children and not male police. No offense but media is projecting the whole act as so called "Barbaric" whereas police took utmost control and used as less force as possible. I heard on camera "Aap humare maa jaise hain, please chale jaye" etc. It was hardly by force. Media's reporting today is not actual reflection of the way in which it was dealt. It was with a lot of caution and very less force for sure. And they did not use any force at all till the so called Ramdev supporters started throwing stones. Ramdev is lying today and it was not the case yesterday and nor are media channels telling the truth. My family especially mom and dad were one of the biggest fans of Ramdev when he was a yoga guru but he is now turning out into a thug. His movement is NOT apolitical and many of his demands do not make an iota of sense except to his illiterate gullible followers. At least Anna makes sense in most of his demands and he does not bring political or controversial people in his protests. I am not a huge fan of Anna too but he is a thousand times better than this dhongi thug and another player of dirty politics viz. Baba Ramdev. The issue of corruption is very important and such movement should be headed by the progressive unbiased youth of this nation who are shaping up the nation instead of these babas and mullahs who are screwing up the nation more than building it. Media is taking some TRPs from this issue but the nation hardly cares. LOL .. I normally do not have a fixed sleeping time being a webmaster. But I was about to sleep yesterday night as my internet was not working properly since evening. And when I switched the TV the fun started and I caught the fun live on TV for the next 3-4 hours. :giggle: All I can tell you is you have got absolutely no idea what went on there. Media was forced out of the tents and then the gathering was dispered by the police. 100s are injured, some of them seriously with head injuries and broken bones lying in hospitals in Delhi. Just go to Ram manohar Lohia Hospital or Safdarjang Hospital and you will meet many of those who were there last night and who have got relatives in the hospital admitted for injuries. The administration is not even allowing the media to go near Ramlila Ground today to report from there and show how the gathering dispersed and the commotion it caused.. You don't like the man, it's fine. But what happened last evening was disastrous for a democracy. is this the way all elected govts are going to deal with processions and protests? Sorry that just not on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ViruRulez Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Gunner you make no sense. Even if individuals contesting as independent candidates win the election' date= they won't be able to do anything as they are independent and do not have support of any party as such. They will be debating in Loksabha/Rajyasabha LOL, so they will graduate from NDTV debate to Loksabha Civil Movements happen when something is not right, how many civil movements have been started in India over the years?? Nobody is holding Government on ransom, its government who does not care. It took them long long time to file a chargesheet against Balwa brothers. I ask why? Even our courts were surprised for the delay. When our government had ministers like Raja, Pawar, I have every right to support civil movement if I feel its right. Ramdev baba definately had political agenda for next election, But he has raised several points. Remember BJP tried to do the same year ago but their movement did not get public support, but if Baba's movements gets support and wakes common man, I am all for it. You are also wrong when you say government can't do anything about black money. You might have read in the News papers as well have heard that after the 2008 global economic crisis which started in US and engulfed whole of the world, the US have pressurised the Swiss government to disclose the identity of the US bank accounts held in Swiss Banks. And Swiss Bank Association was forced to do so because of huge diplomatic pressure. Also read this http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/article2074736.ece Individuals cannot do anything but a political party can. At present all political parties are corrupt to the core, plays dirty votebank politics and does not give a damn about the nation. That is why a youth oriented progressive political party with a modern outlook and completely non-corrupt and non-votebank based party should emerge very soon for this nation to make proper headway in the future. And the govt. should also be strong. There needs to be such a party who can implement necessary things such as "two child policy", elimination of "religious extremism" of all religions, strict actions against corruption, developmental projects without harming the public and eliminating crime as a whole. You cannot make a Kangress, BJP, Mayawati, DMK or a Laloo or for that matter anybody else to become non-votebank based. One of my favorite politicians in India is Nitish but even Nitish is votebank based and that is evident. So, no party in the present setup fulfills the needs of the idealism that needs to be followed in Indian politics. That is why a new party needs to emerge in the nation soon. And thugs like Baba Ramdev with devious political intentions are not the answer for sure. It should be made by the progressive youth who knows to maintain the balance and be strong enough to take tough decisions at times too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulbul Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Gunner you make no sense. Even if individuals contesting as independent candidates win the election, they won't be able to do anything as they are independent and do not have support of any party as such. They will be debating in Loksabha/Rajyasabha LOL, so they will graduate from NDTV debate to Loksabha Civil Movements happen when something is not right, how many civil movements have been started in India over the years?? Nobody is holding Government on ransom, its government who does not care. It took them long long time to file a chargesheet against Balwa brothers. I ask why? Even our courts were surprised for the delay. When our government had ministers like Raja, Pawar, I have every right to support civil movement if I feel its right. Ramdev baba definately had political agenda for next election, But he has raised several points. Remember BJP tried to do the same year ago but their movement did not get public support, but if Baba's movements gets support and wakes common man, I am all for it. You are also wrong when you say government can't do anything about black money. You might have read in the News papers as well have heard that after the 2008 global economic crisis which started in US and engulfed whole of the world, the US have pressurised the Swiss government to disclose the identity of the US bank accounts held in Swiss Banks. And Swiss Bank Association was forced to do so because of huge diplomatic pressure. Also read this http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/article2074736.ece German govt paid bribe to bank officials and got the names of people who kept black money.. They are who offered Indian names to our govt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulbul Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Individuals cannot do anything but a political party can. At present all political parties are corrupt to the core, plays dirty votebank politics and does not give a damn about the nation. That is why a youth oriented progressive political party with a modern outlook and completely non-corrupt and non-votebank based party should emerge very soon for this nation to make proper headway in the future. And the govt. should also be strong. There needs to be such a party who can implement necessary things such as "two child policy", elimination of "religious extremism" of all religions, strict actions against corruption, developmental projects without harming the public and eliminating crime as a whole. You cannot make a Kangress, BJP, Mayawati, DMK or a Laloo or for that matter anybody else to become non-votebank based. One of my favorite politicians in India is Nitish but even Nitish is votebank based and that is evident. So, no party in the present setup fulfills the needs of the idealism that needs to be followed in Indian politics. That is why a new party needs to emerge in the nation soon. And thugs like Baba Ramdev with devious political intentions are not the answer for sure. It should be made by the progressive youth who knows to maintain the balance and be strong enough to take tough decisions at times too. a new party will emerge only if some movements started..otherwise u have to wait till thousands of yesrs.. If Baba is a thug congress should have already had put him in jail.. Only solution is tom Middle class to wake up..so far we only concntrated on our works and try to come up in life without bothering about corruption..may be the time is coming now to put up fight atleast.. We dont need more SRK type people...who dont do any good themselves but ready to take cheap publicity by uttering some nonsense.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kabira Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 ^thats ideal isnt it in ideal world. The problem is our voters do not vote for national issues, its always petty local issues and they get suckered by politicians and their promises. The people like Kejriwala can't even win, even Hedge's party did not do well. I still think politicians are just half the problem, they are still accountable, but our bureacrates, these guys are not even accountable, corruption and babudom is in hteir core. Lot of ppl join IPS, IAS to gather wealth, thats their main motive. We need to clean that up, once that is cleaned politicians won't be able to scam that easily Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gunner Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 Gunner you make no sense. Even if individuals contesting as independent candidates win the election' date=' they won't be able to do anything as they are independent and do not have support of any party as such. They will be debating in Loksabha/Rajyasabha LOL, so they will graduate from NDTV debate to Loksabha [/quote'] So we should allow spome random guy to say he is our representative? Perfect solution, this is how the weimar republic gave rise to hitler, cuba to castro etc etc etc. I am making sense you don't understand what I am saying there lies the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gunner Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 ^thats ideal isnt it in ideal world. The problem is our voters do not vote for national issues, its always petty local issues and they get suckered by politicians and their promises. The people like Kejriwala can't even win, even Hedge's party did not do well. I still think politicians are just half the problem, they are still accountable, but our bureacrates, these guys are not even accountable, corruption and babudom is in hteir core. Lot of ppl join IPS, IAS to gather wealth, thats their main motive. We need to clean that up, once that is cleaned politicians won't be able to scam that easily LOL, and you presume that this issue will be solved by some civil moment led by a few middle class maharathis and a baburao? :giggle::giggle: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urbestfriend Posted June 5, 2011 Share Posted June 5, 2011 ^thats ideal isnt it in ideal world. The problem is our voters do not vote for national issues, its always petty local issues and they get suckered by politicians and their promises. The people like Kejriwala can't even win, even Hedge's party did not do well. I still think politicians are just half the problem, they are still accountable, but our bureacrates, these guys are not even accountable, corruption and babudom is in hteir core. Lot of ppl join IPS, IAS to gather wealth, thats their main motive. We need to clean that up, once that is cleaned politicians won't be able to scam that easily Which Hegde? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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