ganeshran Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 It is not a black and white thing' date=' it is always mix of various things happening during a time period. [b']Her coming from quota might be related, as quite a few people coming through that channel are low on self-esteem and under pressure to perform. Which can only compound the other failures in life. Imagine had she been class topper or something, how likely is that she would have reacted so extremely to someone dumping her. Most likely nothing was going her way, she was under pressure on various fronts, and being dumped by bf was final nail in the coffin. BF could have handled breakup in a better way, but one can not blame him any more than a momentary jerk. May be he was also constantly under stress due to her psycho girlfriend, and felt relieved once got rid of her. The keyword here is might since there is absolutely nothing to suggest that this had something to do with her being a quota student, unless someone is privy to information in addition to what has been presented in the article. People's emotional strength is not a function of their intellectual or academic capabilities. Many toppers are just as vulnerable to making stupid decisions in the heat of the moment. Introducing a quota angle to the debate looks like an attempt to stereotype quota students which is irrelevant to the current issue of a student committing suicide unable to take the emotional pressure of a breakup.
akshayxyz Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 The keyword here is might since there is absolutely nothing to suggest that this had something to do with her being a quota student, unless someone is privy to information in addition to what has been presented in the article. . At one point you are agreeing - it might have been related, at other point you are arguing as if someone made a definite claim? First sort out what you want to talk about.
akshayxyz Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 People's emotional strength is not a function of their intellectual or academic capabilities. Many toppers are just as vulnerable to making stupid decisions in the heat of the moment. Introducing a quota angle to the debate looks like an attempt to stereotype quota students which is irrelevant to the current issue of a student committing suicide unable to take the emotional pressure of a breakup. You did not get the point. If you are succeeding in other fronts in your life, it helps to overcome failures at other fronts. that is all I said. You are trying to create argument out of nowhere. Like you did when someone just posted general demographic info about the student w/o making any claims/correlation.
ganeshran Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 At one point you are agreeing - it might have been related' date= at other point you are arguing as if someone made a definite claim? First sort out what you want to talk about. Where did I agree :dontknow: I said that there is no information which suggests that these two are related and hence her being a quota student is irrelevant. the highlighting of the word might was from your post which suggested the absence of definitive information.
gaurav92 Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 This "Ex-Gf/Bf" and "dumping partners" and other western trends are catching on fast in India..It'll (if it's not already) become a trendy thing to dump partners' date=' to brag about (been there, done it). It'll be a long process before the Indian society and youngsters start coping with this trend...[/quote'] Absolutely.
ganeshran Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 You did not get the point. If you are succeeding in other fronts in your life, it helps to overcome failures at other fronts. that is all I said. You are trying to create argument out of nowhere. Like you did when someone just posted demographic info about the student w/o making any claims. I am not at all creating an argument. I am just stating that her being a quota student is irrelevant and looks like an attempt to stereotype quota students.
akshayxyz Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 Where did I agree :dontknow: I said that there is no information which suggests that these two are related and hence her being a quota student is irrelevant. the highlighting of the word might was from your post which suggested the absence of definitive information. So can you definitely claim - that two facts are not related absolutely at all? If you can - then you seem to be living in some rosey dreamland.
akshayxyz Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 I am not at all creating an argument. I am just stating that her being a quota student is irrelevant and looks like an attempt to stereotype quota students. I said - her excelling in studies might have helped manage stress/pressure on various fronts. Also, nowhere did I claim that as an ST student she could not have excelled. Mentioning ST-factoid is as (ir)relevant as mentioning her being from IIM, her being girl, her being of some age, her being dumped....so on.
Mariyam Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 I am not at all creating an argument. I am just stating that her being a quota student is irrelevant and looks like an attempt to stereotype quota students. Her being a quota student was not part of the news article posted by the OP. It was posted later by the poster in the post where he mentioned her email id.
ganeshran Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 So can you definitely claim - that two facts are not related absolutely at all? If you can - then you seem to be living in some rosey dreamland. I cannot definitely claim they are not related, just as someone cannot claim they are definitely related. Like I said, without specific information - its just conjecture and trying to equate her being a quota student as a reason for her suicide and an automatic assumption that she struggled academically - all conjectures which seem to be pulled out of thin air.
ganeshran Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 Her being a quota student was not part of the news article posted by the OP. It was posted later by the poster in the post where he mentioned her email id. Yup. this is what I said. :agree:
akshayxyz Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 I cannot definitely claim they are not related' date='[b'] just as someone cannot claim they are definitely related. Like I said, without specific information - its just conjecture and trying to equate her being a quota student as a reason for her suicide and an automatic assumption that she struggled academically - all conjectures which seem to be pulled out of thin air. No one put forward a definite claim - you mis-interpreted. Someone just posted various facts about her w/o attempting to establish any connection.
akshayxyz Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 On the other hand, you can not even establish a definite causality correlation between her being dumped and her suicide - even if the suicide note says so in her own hand writing.
asterix Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 Speculations are part and parcel of online communities and discussion forums. You cannot prevent it and you shouldn't try to control it (unless the discussion creates legal issues). If everything to be discussed had to be backed by facts and research, then you can't discuss. You've to then wait for the facts to come out and then discuss.
Sidhoni Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 On the other hand' date=' you can not even establish a definite claim between her being dumped as the sole reason of her suicide - even if the suicide note says so in her own hand writing.[/quote'] :hmmm:
ganeshran Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 No one put forward a definite claim - you mis-interpreted. Someone just posted various facts about her w/o attempting to establish any connection. Yup. Thats why I posted that it is irrelevant in the debate. Not when it is used as a factoid for informational purpose, but when it is used as an argument while discussing the reason for her suicide.
akshayxyz Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 :hmmm: It should very easy to defend, esp. if the note is just one liner. What say Mariyam?
akshayxyz Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 Yup. Thats why I posted that it is irrelevant in the debate. Not when it is used as a factoid for informational purpose' date= but when it is used as an argument while discussing the reason for her suicide. zabardasti behas karni hai bas??? Whoever posted the factoid, did he claim he is giving for informational purpose or establishing a connection? - who was the first one to suggest there can be a connection, or it is an attempt to connect to suicide - I guess it was you.
ganeshran Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 zabardasti behas karni hai bas??? Whoever posted the factoid, did he claim he is giving for informational purpose or establishing a connection? - who was the first one to suggest there can be a connection, or it is an attempt to connect to suicide - I guess it was you. Not really. I just posted asking "how is it relavent?" and stopped at that. Didnt really move in that direction after that message. It was yoda who posted the following post and continued the discussion based on the assumption that her being a quota student was related to her suicide. After that it was you who carried it forward. My replies were only in response to those posts and never really to force a debate on the issue. Actually it is. People who get into these institutes based on quota have extra pressure on them' date=' academically, which [b']could have contributed to her fateful decision. Speculation. There is nothing in the article which suggests that the reason was the suicide was academic. Hence the ST part in the post was irrelevant. Well is it relevant that it is a girl? There is nothing that suggests that she died only because it was a she who was dumped by a he. Not all the details of a person are directly related to the event. They are included for informational purposes and it is up to each reader to use it or dismiss it. I agree that her gender is mentioned for information purposes' date=' but if someone mentioned her gender as one of the reasons for her suicide, [i']then it would be irrelevant. Her coming from quota might be related' date=' as quite a few people coming through that channel are low on self-esteem and under pressure to perform. Which can only compound the other failures in life.[/quote']
Mariyam Posted September 21, 2011 Posted September 21, 2011 It should very easy to defend, esp. if the note is just one liner. What say Mariyam? Sorry, I lost you there. Defend what exactly? If the suicide note says " I'm killing myself because my boyfriend Mr.abc not only broke up with me, but also proudly declared it on FB" , Prima facie, the police are going to take that note seriously. Of course, they will ( or should) do their due diligence: check for other reasons- monetary or academic or personal, but this note, coupled with the testimony of her room mates who said she went to see her ex BF in Delhi doesn't leave much doubt that the primary reason for her suicide was the harsh break up. But this can in no way be construed as abetting suicide.
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