Speed gun question ...

[Brainfade]

for those in the know: Do they measure ball-velocity in the air before it hits the deck? Or do they measure ball-velocity when it reaches the other end, which in most cases would be post-bounce? It appears that the Irani trophy wicket is significantly blunting the bowlers' pace.

[kabira]

> Do they measure ball-velocity in the air before it hits the deck? I think this.

[express bowling]

They measure the release speed of the ball at the time of delivery.

[Tiger80]

But jeff thomson was measured at batsman end Pace bowlers, or fast bowlers or pacemen, rely on speed to get a batsman out. This type of bowler can be further classified according to the speed at which they bowl the ball on average. For details see Fast bowling. Most pace bowlers are medium-fast to fast in top level cricket. In general, bowlers of this type are described as right arm or left arm "fast", or right arm or left arm "fast-medium", and so on. The fastest bowler ever in the cricket history was Australian Jeff Thomson. Due to the unavailabilty of ball speed measuring devices his bowling speed couldn't be measured in every match. In 1975 during a Test match, he was timed using high-speed cameras with a release speed of 160.45 km/h; the following year he was timed at 160.58km/h using conventional radar. But these speeds were measured at the batting end. Now a days bowling speed is measured just at the instance when bowler releases the ball. So if this technique was used in old times, Jeff Thomson would have probably been clocked at more than 170km/h. Australian wicket-keeper Rod Marsh kept wicket to Thomson for most of his Test career and claimed that Thomson bowled upwards of 180km/h. The fastest delivery that has ever been officially recorded clocked in at 100.2 mph (162.26kph) and was bowled by Shoaib Akhtar Pakistan during a match against England. Another technique of fast bowling is the sling action. This action generates extra speed but sacrifices control. Some bowlers who apply the sling action are Shaun Tait, Mitchell Johnson, Rubel Hossain, Fidel Edwards and Lasith Malinga. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Types_of_bowlers_in_cricket

[punjabi_khota]

lol @ quoting wikipedia.

[express bowling]

But jeff thomson was measured at batsman end Pace bowlers, or fast bowlers or pacemen, rely on speed to get a batsman out. This type of bowler can be further classified according to the speed at which they bowl the ball on average. For details see Fast bowling. Most pace bowlers are medium-fast to fast in top level cricket. In general, bowlers of this type are described as right arm or left arm "fast", or right arm or left arm "fast-medium", and so on. The fastest bowler ever in the cricket history was Australian Jeff Thomson. Due to the unavailabilty of ball speed measuring devices his bowling speed couldn't be measured in every match. In 1975 during a Test match, he was timed using high-speed cameras with a release speed of 160.45 km/h; the following year he was timed at 160.58km/h using conventional radar. But these speeds were measured at the batting end. Now a days bowling speed is measured just at the instance when bowler releases the ball. So if this technique was used in old times, Jeff Thomson would have probably been clocked at more than 170km/h. Australian wicket-keeper Rod Marsh kept wicket to Thomson for most of his Test career and claimed that Thomson bowled upwards of 180km/h. The fastest delivery that has ever been officially recorded clocked in at 100.2 mph (162.26kph) and was bowled by Shoaib Akhtar Pakistan during a match against England. Another technique of fast bowling is the sling action. This action generates extra speed but sacrifices control. Some bowlers who apply the sling action are Shaun Tait, Mitchell Johnson, Rubel Hossain, Fidel Edwards and Lasith Malinga. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Types_of_bowlers_in_cricket

A delivery with a release speed of 145 kph reaches the batsman around 105 kph to 115 kph ( roughly ) depending on the surface type, the ability of the bowler to skid the ball off the surface, whether the ball lands on the seam etc. This is about 72 % to 80 % of the release speed. The speed at which the ball reaches a batsman is not shown often on TV but from time to time they show the decrease in speed from the point of delivery to a batsman. If Thomson had actually clocked 160 kph at the batsman's end then his release speed would have been in the range of 200 kph to 220 kph ( roughly ). You figure out how accurate this fact can be. :cantstop:

[rkt.india]

A delivery with a release speed of 145 kph reaches the batsman around 105 kph to 115 kph ( roughly ) depending on the surface type, the ability of the bowler to skid the ball off the surface, whether the ball lands on the seam etc. This is about 72 % to 80 % of the release speed. The speed at which the ball reaches a batsman is not shown often on TV but from time to time they show the decrease in speed from the point of delivery to a batsman. If Thomson had actually clocked 160 kph at the batsman's end then his release speed would have been in the range of 200 kph to 220 kph ( roughly ). You figure out how accurate this fact can be. :cantstop:

hit the nail:giggle:

[Tiger80]

A delivery with a release speed of 145 kph reaches the batsman around 105 kph to 115 kph ( roughly ) depending on the surface type, the ability of the bowler to skid the ball off the surface, whether the ball lands on the seam etc. This is about 72 % to 80 % of the release speed. The speed at which the ball reaches a batsman is not shown often on TV but from time to time they show the decrease in speed from the point of delivery to a batsman. If Thomson had actually clocked 160 kph at the batsman's end then his release speed would have been in the range of 200 kph to 220 kph ( roughly ). You figure out how accurate this fact can be. :cantstop:

Nol94jVqCXk&feature=player_embedded#! Anchor saying that thomsom was timed at batsmen end

[rkt.india]

Anchor saying that thomsom was timed at batsmen end

Technology was wrong then.

[express bowling]

Anchor saying that thomsom was timed at batsmen end

We all know that anchors are not always right ... to put it mildly. Also, often a lot is said for promotional purposes these days, knowing that wrong facts are being stated. You look at any Thomson's bowling video and you will understand that he was quick but not more than Brett Lee, maybe a bit slower.

[Tiger80]

OK may technology was wrong ,but what about Imran that holding's bowl went to keeper with one bounce when he was standing at boundry.Were thommo or holding really quicker than Lee and Akhtar or these greats just prefer to brag about their time? As far old video's are concerned its difficult to judge speed from them as they are of poor quality I am sure if there is technology of measuring speed from old video's then so many people would have already spending hours to know at what speed these greats bowled

[express bowling]

OK may technology was wrong ,but what about Imran that holding's bowl went to keeper with one bounce when he was standing at boundry.Were thommo or holding really quicker than Lee and Akhtar or these greats just prefer to brag about their time? As far old video's are concerned its difficult to judge speed from them as they are of poor quality I am sure if there is technology of measuring speed from old video's then so many people would have already spending hours to know at what speed these greats bowled

In almost every sport, in matters of speed, power, fitness etc. things have improved over time. Players are running faster, swimming faster, jumping higher or longer etc. This is mainly due to better physical training techniques and equipments, better food supplements, energy drinks and permitted drugs, better sporting equipments and shoes, increased usage of biomechanics etc. I find it difficult to believe that in bowling ( in cricket ) that is different. It is possible that there was one freak talent like Thomson who was as quick as Lee today ( in absolute terms ) but bowlers on an average were quicker or even as quick, in absolute terms, in those days is a bit difficult to believe scientifically. However it is almost sure that Holding, if he trained and played today, would be quicker than he was in his playing days.

[Tiger80]

In almost every sport, in matters of speed, power, fitness etc. things have improved over time. Players are running faster, swimming faster, jumping higher or longer etc. This is mainly due to better physical training techniques and equipments, better food supplements, energy drinks and permitted drugs, better sporting equipments and shoes, increased usage of biomechanics etc. I find it difficult to believe that in bowling ( in cricket ) that is different. It is possible that there was one freak talent like Thomson who was as quick as Lee today ( in absolute terms ) but bowlers on an average were quicker or even as quick, in absolute terms, in those days is a bit difficult to believe scientifically. However it is almost sure that Holding, if he trained and played today, would be quicker than he was in his playing days.

Things have improved in other sports ,but we all know that test cricket and Fast bowling has declined sharply ,the greatest era of fast bowling was 70s 80s to upto mid 90s..Glenn mcgrath became highest wicket taking pacer despite not bowling fast.Also even in west indies you will see lot of spin and medium pace working much better than Fast bowling .So in this time I don't think bowlers will work as hard as they use to bowl faster and faster

[rkt.india]

Things have improved in other sports ' date='but we all know that test cricket and Fast bowling has declined sharply ,the greatest era of fast bowling was 70s 80s to upto mid 90s..Glenn mcgrath became highest wicket taking pacer despite not bowling fast.Also even in west indies you will see lot of spin and medium pace working much better than Fast bowling .So in this time I don't think bowlers will work as hard as they use to bowl faster and faster[/quote'] Fast bowling has not declined. Fast bowlers are still here. It is pitches that have become more batting friendly. And use of protecting gears like helmets and advent of bowling machine has made batsman fearless to face fast bowling. Bowling machine has eased it for everyone to face fast bowling. You still see so many 90 mph bowlers, more than ever right now, but batting has improved, even tailenders can bat now and then conditions for batting are better. There are very few seaming and bouncy pitches nowadays.

[vamos_rafa]

Fast bowling has not declined. Fast bowlers are still here. It is pitches that have become more batting friendly. And use of protecting gears like helmets and advent of bowling machine has made batsman fearless to face fast bowling. Bowling machine has eased it for everyone to face fast bowling. You still see so many 90 mph bowlers, more than ever right now, but batting has improved, even tailenders can bat now and then conditions for batting are better. There are very few seaming and bouncy pitches nowadays.

The same arguement applies to the spinners and spinning tracks as well. There are not too many pitches around the world which are highly conducive for spinners as well. Pitches in India, Pakistan and SL are murderously flat these days.

[rkt.india]

The same arguement applies to the spinners and spinning tracks as well. There are not too many pitches around the world which are highly conducive for spinners as well. Pitches in India' date=' Pakistan and SL are murderously flat these days.[/quote'] Yes, but you can spinners can still find turn on 4th and 5th days on most pitches in India and Srilanka as pitches wear out.

[akshayxyz]

In almost every sport, in matters of speed, power, fitness etc. things have improved over time. Players are running faster, swimming faster, jumping higher or longer etc. This is mainly due to better physical training techniques and equipments, better food supplements, energy drinks and permitted drugs, better sporting equipments and shoes, increased usage of biomechanics etc. I find it difficult to believe that in bowling ( in cricket ) that is different. It is possible that there was one freak talent like Thomson who was as quick as Lee today ( in absolute terms ) but bowlers on an average were quicker or even as quick, in absolute terms, in those days is a bit difficult to believe scientifically. However it is almost sure that Holding, if he trained and played today, would be quicker than he was in his playing days.

++ The average levels of skills and speeds must have increased. Overall fast bowling is different thing. Change in bouncer rules, not as much friendly pitches etc. might have made it a bit easier for batsmen. But, it is hard to see how a trained Holding would be significantly better than Steyn at his best - in today's conditions.

[thongale]

OK may technology was wrong ' date='but what about Imran that holding's bowl went to keeper with one bounce when he was standing at boundry.[b']Were thommo or holding really quicker than Lee and Akhtar or these greats just prefer to brag about their time? As far old video's are concerned its difficult to judge speed from them as they are of poor quality I am sure if there is technology of measuring speed from old video's then so many people would have already spending hours to know at what speed these greats bowled

Probabky the latter. But still Mohammaed Zahid was the quikest thing I have seen for a long time. His legendary over to Brian Lara in full cry was a classic. Looked lot quicker than Shoaib.

[rkt.india]

Probabky the latter. But still Mohammaed Zahid was the quikest thing I have seen for a long time. His legendary over to Brian Lara in full cry was a classic. Looked lot quicker than Shoaib.

any video?

[Crookbond]

Just because technology wasn't advanced back then it's no reason to choose current crop of bowlers over the yesteryear greats. Thommo, Holding, Marshall were as bit as great if not for more than McGrath, Akram, etc. Lets wait for Steyn to finish his career before we hand out the "great" verdict. He may achieve greatness but it isn't a given.