Trundlers R US

[msb1991]

So we are a happy winning in sc conditions and forget next wc is in australia and get our ass raped abroad.

So we should play our best team for Australian conditions, in SC, in preparation of a World Cup that is 3 years away?! That is absurd. Surely we should play our best team depending on the conditions at the time!

[Dravid_TheWall]

Seem like even gutter bowlers are doing better than Santh eh D_TW D_TW? Where are you hiding now?

Not hiding. Laughing at you guys. Read my earlier post in this thread, I said I think we will win, that was at beginning of chase. Does this change my opinion on these bowlers? They are still gutter level seamers.

[msb1991]

Course not. People shouldn't be so shallow.

If the team wins the series after the Asia Cup, will you accept being wrong? Medium pacers won the World Cup, Sreesanth was poor and you still do not accept that medium pacers can bring success in ODI cricket.

[CG]

So we should play our best team for Australian conditions' date=' in SC, in preparation of a World Cup that is 3 years away?! That is absurd. Surely we should play our best team depending on the conditions at the time![/quote'] There is nothing more absurd than calling guys who averages 35 in odis as your best bowlers.

[Dravid_TheWall]

These guys cannot improve' date='they do not have the skills.v.k is as good as he can be at 28 and p.k is as good .[/quote'] Yeah agree. We won the ODI wc because we identified the bowlers for the conditions. Munaf was tight in the middle, ZK and Nehra took early wickets and could bowl well at the death. I cannot see that in any of these seamers..Irfan/PK/VK maybe one in the squad max. Lack of quality death bowling and lack of ability to take wickets up front. All they can do is bowl honest line and pray. They will get slaughtered in a pressure situation.

[CG]

If the team wins the series after the Asia Cup' date=' will you accept being wrong? Medium pacers won the World Cup, Sreesanth was poor and you still do not accept that medium pacers can bring success in ODI cricket.[/quote'] Medium pacers won us the world cup,But they had skils ,zaheer has control and swing + brain,munaf-good line ,these guys are not medium pacers they are trundlers.i can see pak batsman hammering them.

[CG]

Yeah agree. We won the ODI wc because we identified the bowlers for the conditions. Munaf was tight in the middle, ZK and Nehra took early wickets and could bowl well at the death. I cannot see that in any of these seamers..Irfan/PK/VK maybe one in the squad max. Lack of quality death bowling and lack of ability to take wickets up front. All they can do is bowl honest line and pray. They will get slaughtered in a pressure situation.

nehra had one good match.zak and munaf did well.

[Dravid_TheWall]

If the team wins the series after the Asia Cup' date=' will you accept being wrong? Medium pacers won the World Cup, Sreesanth was poor and you still do not accept that medium pacers can bring success in ODI cricket.[/quote'] Then why do I support Nehra, ZK and Munaf? Both were generally medium pacers in wc. I have been calling for their inclusion. Stop making it a pace contest and so black and white. I am anti crap bowlers, not anti pace... Also we won today due to our batting. You saw how these gutter seamers did in Aus I hope? SL could defend their scores of 250 odd our bowlers couldn't.

[msb1991]

There is nothing more absurd than calling guys who averages 35 in odis as your best bowlers.

Well, that rules out Yadav then. I guess you will now proceed to boast about Varun's record after 4 ODIs.

[Dravid_TheWall]

Egg.On.The.Face.

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[CG]

Well' date=' that rules out Yadav then. I guess you will now proceed to boast about Varun's record after 4 ODIs.[/quote'] Yadav has played 15 odis not 66 like P.k who averages a great 36.68.Its moronic he is in the team.

[msb1991]

Yadav has played 15 odis not 66 like P.k and averages a great 36.68.Its moronic he is in the team.

Wait, who averages 36.68?

[CG]

Wait' date=' who averages 36.68?[/quote'] The great Praveen kumar.

[msb1991]

Fair enough, Praveen has been poor for a while. But Yadav does average more and its not like he has played just 5 ODIs or something.

[CG]

Fair enough' date=' Praveen has been poor for a while. But Yadav does average more and its not like he has played just 5 ODIs or something.[/quote'] I would give more chances to yadav,than a proven failure like P.k.

[Ultimate_Game]

I would give more chances to yadav' date='than a proven failure like P.k.[/quote'] I would agree. There was a time couple of years back when PK could swing the ball and make it difficult for batsmen with the new ball. he can't do that anymore and struggled even in Aus. He has suddenly lost the only asset he ever had - his swing with the new ball. Umesh hasn't really done much so far but he's at least a wkt taker and did manage to get well set batsmen out in Aus recently. Given a choice between Kumars and yadav, Yadav should be given a chance. The main problem with Yadav is his lack of control and hopefully he will get better as he plays more games.

[express bowling]

Have to say this stuff can't be termed as a bowling "attack". It's as if a collection of part-timers is let loose on the field for the 1st time.

:two_thumbs_up:

[rkt.india]

I would agree. There was a time couple of years back when PK could swing the ball and make it difficult for batsmen with the new ball. he can't do that anymore and struggled even in Aus. He has suddenly lost the only asset he ever had - his swing with the new ball. Umesh hasn't really done much so far but he's at least a wkt taker and did manage to get well set batsmen out in Aus recently. Given a choice between Kumars and yadav, Yadav should be given a chance. The main problem with Yadav is his lack of control and hopefully he will get better as he plays more games.

We can easily compare how Yadav bowled in 3 ODIs against WI. He was unplayable on many occasions. The kind of out swing PK gets at 125, he was getting at 140k. Yes, he is raw, but that is why he is in the team so that coaches can refine him. Yadav and Aaron both can be genuine strike bowler in both formats. They just need to handle them well. Yadav did not bowl badly or wayward. He is taken for runs when he bowls short for no reason and ball does not get up over waist height. Whenever he has bowled fuller length or short of a length he has looked good. He just need to stay away from the short ball and he will do good, especially in SC where he can get reverse as well. Aaron is more accurate than Yadav and will certainly do better. Aaron needs to remain fit as he is having too many back problems. His body has not been able to take the toll of the kind of effort he puts in his bowling. He will get better fitness wise though as his body matures.

[express bowling]

^ The Indian team needs to develop a pace bowling culture where bowlers who have the potential to be good strike bowlers, like Umesh and Aaron, improve and are groomed and encouraged while playing for the team. Currently that aspect is completely absent and anybody who comes to play for India goes down the drain as a bowler.

[rkt.india]

Well' date=' that's exactly it isn't it! People would have said Aaron and Yadav's pace earned the exact same wickets because they are too quick to slog or some sort of bizarre nonsense. Heck, if they were playing and did awful, it would have been suggested they added 'pressure' to give wickets to the medium pacers. The quick bowlers can do no wrong and the medium pacers can do no right![/quote'] Did you watch England vs India ODI, Aaron's debut match that is called death bowling to tailenders when he cleaned Tim Bresnan, Borthwick, and Meaker with straight fast swinging yorkers. He may not repeat it in every match, but he has shown that he can do which other bowlers cannot. The clean bowled of Alistair Cook when he was looking to win the match for his team is still fresh in my mind and he has barely played 4-5 ODIs till now and I seriously feel he will improve even more and will be a damn good fast bowler for us at least in ODIs fitness permitting.