FreakazoiD Posted August 17, 2014 Author Posted August 17, 2014 What could've have Dhoni done when Tendulkar, Sehwag, Gambhir etc were playing as if with broomsticks instead of bats? Ask them to do additional nets? Teach them batting? Face it, he got the worst a captain can hope to get in consecutive overseas series, first time it was an ageing squad where legends were spending more time in the dressing room than they should've at the crease. Second instance, he got totally inexperienced bunch of kids who are so schooled in the T20 format that save for a fluke win, they all just gave up the pain at the earliest possible. Again, what could he have done? Go and bat for the youngsters? Give me the batting averages of the greats in 2011 series and the youngters in 2014 and that'll tell you a story. The batting was ok in South Africa and NZ this year, yet we lost games that we should have won. The 3rd test at Southampton, our batting wilted in the second innings under the pressure of the mountain of runs England had created. Who let Cook and the English batsmen off the hook on the first day with defensive fields? Yes, the batting hasn't been good in this series or 2011, but nobody said captaincy is all of the problems with Indian test cricket, it is just one of many and a good place to start.
Precambrian Posted August 17, 2014 Posted August 17, 2014 So when Yuvraj plays and team wins world cup and T20 cup, Dhoni is the best captain ever. When youngsters fail, his entire team has to be blamed BTW, each and every expert has questioned and laughed at his tactics and captaincy in tests. What do you say to that?[/b] Not that you would know anything about that, you might not have even watched the matches, only IPL Who are these so called experts? Bet they were singing "RIP Cook" after the Lords test, weren't they? What are they doing now? Singing paens for him? Don't evade my qn, why should Dhoni be blamed for our batsmen performing poorly?
Precambrian Posted August 17, 2014 Posted August 17, 2014 The batting was ok in South Africa and NZ this year' date=' yet we lost games that we should have won. [b']The 3rd test at Southampton, our batting wilted in the second innings under the pressure of the mountain of runs England had created. Who let Cook and the English batsmen off the hook on the first day with defensive fields? Yes, the batting hasn't been good in this series or 2011, but nobody said captaincy is all of the problems with Indian test cricket, it is just one of many and a good place to start. Did we not bat first in this test? Why wilt? Did we not bat first in last test? Again they wilted under scoreboard pressure?? Making conclusions for one innings and applying across a series. Super fund.
Precambrian Posted August 17, 2014 Posted August 17, 2014 Give me one reason why Dhoni should not be sacked' date=' one![/quote'] "rebuilding side" - show me it is not.
asterix Posted August 17, 2014 Posted August 17, 2014 I'll wait till it happens. It could well be the Congress type ' offer of resignation' which will not be accepted... Precambrian, if you don't care about Tesr cricket then why are you concerned if Dhoni resigns as test captain or not? He'll be there as captain of the formats you like...
Precambrian Posted August 17, 2014 Posted August 17, 2014 So why are you getting so worked up when someone wants him to go from tests? It is win-win both ways We have only made one T20 finals, we were pathetic in every WT20 tournament after that, you are confusing IPL with World T20 and CSK with India :cantstop: And seeing your views I can see why you want Dhoni to stay. And most Dhoni fans (Sidhoni, Velu, Yodasque) will always take IPL over test cricket, so no surprise there either Whoa, so how many previous captains won us a World Cup, World T20, the test no.1 ranking, a Champions Trophy, a CB series win in Australia? Which captain other than Dhoni? How many did Ganguly win? Unbelivable people undermining a captain for winning just "1 world t20" cup :cantstop:
maniac Posted August 17, 2014 Posted August 17, 2014 "rebuilding side" - show me it is not. What is the criteria of a timeline for rebuilding ? By that logic seniors have been out of the ODI scheme of the things for a while now T20 was never a game the seniors took seriously. So are we worldbeaters in those formats? Apart from C.T nothing significant has been acheieved in ODIs since 2011 either. T20I the less said the better
Precambrian Posted August 17, 2014 Posted August 17, 2014 I'll wait till it happens. It could well be the Congress type ' offer of resignation' which will not be accepted... Precambrian, if you don't care about Tesr cricket then why are you concerned if Dhoni resigns as test captain or not? He'll be there as captain of the formats you like... I think test cricket is a format that has no future - but that doesn't mean I can't follow test cricket is it? I believe Congress party in presentform has no real future, and think it ought to gofor good, but would that mean I think everyone in Congress is a **** guy? Not really. The current president of Kerala Congress is undoubtedly the most cleanest man in Indian politics at the moment. Would I be not defending when he's getting criticised for poor showing by Congress?
FreakazoiD Posted August 17, 2014 Author Posted August 17, 2014 Did we not bat first in this test? Why wilt? Did we not bat first in last test? Again they wilted under scoreboard pressure?? Making conclusions for one innings and applying across a series. Super fund. At OT, conditions were completely and utterly in favour of the bowling side on day 1. All commentators said win the toss and bowl first. Yet Dhoni batted only because he had Jadeja in the side and wanted to bowl last, as Jadeja does jack on days 1, 2 and 3. Tell me why did Jadeja play in the 4th test at all after a dismal performance at the Ageas Bowl with ball and bat? And I'm pinning it on that one innings because that is where the momentum shifted. As it is, this Indian team had never played 5 tests and keeping the intensity for that long was going to be a challenge for them. And when Dhoni gave England a chance to come back at Ageas Bowl, they took it and it was game over for India after that. So yes, I will pin it on that first innings at Southampton and hold Dhoni responsible for letting England off the hook.
Precambrian Posted August 17, 2014 Posted August 17, 2014 What is the criteria of a timeline for rebuilding ? By that logic seniors have been out of the ODI scheme of the things for a while now T20 was never a game the seniors took seriously. So are we worldbeaters in those formats? Apart from C.T nothing significant has been acheieved in ODIs since 2011 either. T20I the less said the better What has been "significant" in ODIs since 2011? Asia cups? :haha: In ODIs wonly won thing matters - World Cup, everything is a buildup towards it, okay count the CT if u want merely because of the number of teams playing it and the quality. Timeline for rebuilding is till we are confident that our youngsters can hold themeselves fine both home and away. At the moment, they badly lack experience to do anything overseas.
zep1706 Posted August 17, 2014 Posted August 17, 2014 "rebuilding side" - show me it is not. That can't be used as an everlasting excuse. It's hard to explain to someone like you who does not follow or rate test cricket how Dhoni has been poor as captain. Most of us who have watched these matches closely know that. I would suggest you to stick to limited overs cricket when test cricket doesn't interest you. PS: my first comment was before you expressed your low opinion of test cricket.
Precambrian Posted August 17, 2014 Posted August 17, 2014 At OT' date= conditions were completely and utterly in favour of the bowling side on day 1. All commentators said win the toss and bowl first. Yet Dhoni batted only because he had Jadeja in the side and wanted to bowl last, as Jadeja does jack on days 1, 2 and 3. Tell me why did Jadeja play in the 4th test at all after a dismal performance at the Ageas Bowl with ball and bat? And I'm pinning it on that one innings because that is where the momentum shifted. As it is, this Indian team had never played 5 tests and keeping the intensity for that long was going to be a challenge for them. And when Dhoni gave England a chance to come back at Ageas Bowl, they took it and it was game over for India after that. So yes, I will pin it on that first innings at Southampton and hold Dhoni responsible for letting England off the hook. Yet another excuse. Dude, we failed as a batting unit every single time barring the first two tests, understand that, that's 6 innings in a row where we failed and if you want to find excuses for each of those six, no point arguing with you. Keep on believing Dhoni is responsible for everything. Happy? Momentum shift, my ass. This is test cricket, momentum shifts are BS, after Lords, everyone were arguing momentum was with India - where did it disappear?
express bowling Posted August 17, 2014 Posted August 17, 2014 Let him go, . And then see the void. You mean the new test captain will do worse than losing every test series abroad. :cantstop:
maniac Posted August 17, 2014 Posted August 17, 2014 What has been "significant" in ODIs since 2011? Asia cups? :haha: In ODIs wonly won thing matters - World Cup, everything is a buildup towards it, okay count the CT if u want merely because of the number of teams playing it and the quality. Timeline for rebuilding is till we are confident that our youngsters can hold themeselves fine both home and away. At the moment, they badly lack experience to do anything overseas. We lost in the league stages of 3 T20 Wc's with the same captain and more or less the same team what does that tell us. The 4th one in more or less familiar conditions we reached the final in a tournament where Dhoni's contribution was next to nothing as both a player and a captain. So are you telling me all the away series in ODI's-SA,NZ,Eng 2011 and CB series 2012 were insignificant? :hmmmm: And on basis of that we are supposed to beleive that Dhoni's rebuilt team will magically win the Worldcup in Foregin conditions :haha: PS-Also lost to pak at home which no matter how much we ignore is kind of significant
King Tendulkar Posted August 17, 2014 Posted August 17, 2014 Let me predict the drama. Dhoni would offer to resign but the selectors won't accept it. In public's eyes Dhoni would come out clean. Classic congress politician move. May happen
Precambrian Posted August 17, 2014 Posted August 17, 2014 That can't be used as an everlasting excuse. It's hard to explain to someone like you who does not follow or rate test cricket how Dhoni has been poor as captain. Most of us who have watched these matches closely know that. I would suggest you to stick to limited overs cricket when test cricket doesn't interest you. PS: my first comment was before you expressed your low opinion of test cricket. I follow test cricket dude. I just don't rate it. That doesn't mean my judgement about it is ill informed. I am still waiting a good reason why Dhoni is held responsible for the following batting averages: Pujara - 22 Rahana - 33 Dhawan - 20 Rohit Sharma - 17 V Kohli - 13 Gambhir - 6 These are chaps considered to form fulcrum of our batting and they collectively failed - and failed miserably. Why??? Is Dhoni to blame for that as well? Just one batsman in the whole series managed to average over 40, 40.22 by Murali Vijay. Our series batting average is a whopping 23.
Precambrian Posted August 17, 2014 Posted August 17, 2014 You mean the new test captain will do worse than losing every test series abroad. :cantstop: Yep, we play home tests as well.
zep1706 Posted August 17, 2014 Posted August 17, 2014 I follow test cricket dude. I just don't rate it. That doesn't mean my judgement about it is ill informed. I am still waiting a good reason why Dhoni is held responsible for the following batting averages: Pujara - 22 Rahana - 33 Dhawan - 20 Rohit Sharma - 17 V Kohli - 13 Gambhir - 6 These are chaps considered to form fulcrum of our batting and they collectively failed - and failed miserably. Why??? Is Dhoni to blame for that as well? Just one batsman in the whole series managed to average over 40, 40.22 by Murali Vijay. Our series batting average is a whopping 23. Top order failure is one of the two main reasons why we failed. Dhoni's captaincy is the other. Both are not mutually exclusive.
Precambrian Posted August 17, 2014 Posted August 17, 2014 And please chuck the excuses that each andevery time our batsmen got the worst of conditions. If then, how come Dhoni - who is often made fun of as useless in overseas conditions, average 35 with four fifties and nearly 350 runs in the series? No bad achievement where the team batting average was 23? So Dhoni then did supermanly batting? How come Ashwin, Bhuvi, Dhoni and heck even Binny averaging more than our "young suffering guns"?
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