rkt.india Posted January 18, 2015 Posted January 18, 2015 All I know is Sandeep averages 22 with the ball and mighty Varun Aaron 37. You slice and dice any which way you want' date=' Aaron doesn't deserve to be in the Indian team. If Sandeep has performed in "bowler friendly" conditions, that's more of a reason for him to be selected for Aus/Eng/SA tours as he knows how to make use of helpful tracks. He already showed during u-19 WC that he can do that, and we all saw what Aaron & Yadav did in the Test series where they couldn't even bowl line & length for a spell, forget troubling the batsmen. You may wait for their "potential" to be fulfilled but it's time they get sent to FC cricket and their spots be given to domestic performers.[/quote'] Problem with you is you are adament and not ready to accept any facts. Now you are talking about stats again how Sandeep has superior stats and when I gave you stats you were shouting PK is that, PK was that while stats didnt show much of a difference. PK also played enough for India. They all had 1-2 good performances in,their career and PK was same.
rkt.india Posted January 18, 2015 Posted January 18, 2015 If Sandeep was an Australian and averaged 22 in domestic cricket he would definitely have gotten a call up. I would take a midget any day over the lumbering bufoons who go at 5 rpo in Tests. Tell me a bowler bowling 120k selected by Australia.
MK55 Posted January 18, 2015 Posted January 18, 2015 Tell me a bowler bowling 120k selected by Australia. In fact even their coach Lehman has said that 140k is the minimum that he expects. Siddle was dropped for the same reason.
Ultimate_Game Posted January 18, 2015 Posted January 18, 2015 Problem with you is you are adament and not ready to accept any facts. Now you are talking about stats again how Sandeep has superior stats and when I gave you stats you were shouting PK is that' date=' PK was that while stats didnt show much of a difference. PK also played enough for India. They all had 1-2 good performances in,their career and PK was same.[/quote'] Problem with you is that you want to see the same trash given the chance without seeing any improvement. Yadav has been around for 4 years and this was his second tour to Aus. Why should he be given more chances? What has he done to deserve it? At least I want to give chance to a youngster who has performed whenever given a chance. Tell me when has Australia persisted with a lost cause like Yadav who has looked worse 4 years down the road on his 2nd tour to Aus. He's 27 and has shown no improvement whatsoever. Yup, Aus selectors would have kept him in the team :haha:
rkt.india Posted January 18, 2015 Posted January 18, 2015 Problem with you is that you want to see the same trash given the chance without seeing any improvement. Yadav has been around for 4 years and this was his second tour to Aus. Why should he be given more chances? What has he done to deserve it? At least I want to give chance to a youngster who has performed whenever given a chance. Tell me when has Australia persisted with a lost cause like Yadav who has looked worse 4 years down the road on his 2nd tour to Aus. He's 27 and has shown no improvement whatsoever. Yup, Aus selectors would have kept him in the team :haha: Yadav played a test match after two years. Doesnt matter how many years if he has not played enough. 12 tests in 4 years and 40 plus wickets. These are as good as any Indian pacer in the past and you think we have produced Mcgraths, Marshals. Yes, he is inconsistent and needs to improve, but you dont discard such bowlers after one series. He was our best fast bowler before he got injured in 2012. He played a test since then now. And if these guys were in Australia, you can see how Australians were excited to see two bowlers bowling over 90 mph for India. These guys would have become real strike bowlers if they were playing for Australia. You know what is the FC average of Pattinson, Cummins, Hazlewood, Starc and how many 5-fers they have in FC. Pattinson didnt have even one 5-get before his debut, Cummins had played just 3 FC matches before his test debut in SA. Hazlewood has 1 5-fer in 30 odd FC matches and they all average 30 or more in FC but still picked because Australians know how to make fast bowlers.
CG Posted January 18, 2015 Posted January 18, 2015 Yadav played a test match after two years. Doesnt matter how many years if he has not played enough. 12 tests in 4 years and 40 plus wickets. These are as good as any Indian pacer in the past and you think we have produced Mcgraths, Marshals. Yes, he is inconsistent and needs to improve, but you dont discard such bowlers after one series. He was our best fast bowler before he got injured in 2012. He played a test since then now. And if these guys were in Australia, you can see how Australians were excited to see two bowlers bowling over 90 mph for India. These guys would have become real strike bowlers if they were playing for Australia. You know what is the FC average of Pattinson, Cummins, Hazlewood, Starc and how many 5-fers they have in FC. Pattinson didnt have even one 5-get before his debut, Cummins had played just 3 FC matches before his test debut in SA. Hazlewood has 1 5-fer in 30 odd FC matches and they all average 30 or more in FC but still picked because Australians know how to make fast bowlers. Forget Ug he will never get it.I remeber he cupported dhoni and could not write a thing about dhonis captaincy,
rkt.india Posted January 18, 2015 Posted January 18, 2015 Dravid recently said this was the best attack India have right now and he doesn't see anyone in Domestic cricket asking to be picked. Stats might show you different story, but that is where stats lie. These great stats give false sense of superiority due the kind of pitches some of these guys play. If one guy, I need to pick would be Anureet Singh though he is nothing special if ball doesnt swing but that is the best we have along with Ishwar Pandey.
div Posted January 18, 2015 Posted January 18, 2015 Forget Ug he will never get it.I remeber he cupported dhoni and could not write a thing about dhonis captaincy' date='[/quote'] His favourite player Dhoni averages only 32-33 in Ranji trophy:winky: ,many wicket keepers have better stats than him.
Shivaji bhonsle Posted January 18, 2015 Author Posted January 18, 2015 Yadav played a test match after two years. Doesnt matter how many years if he has not played enough. 12 tests in 4 years and 40 plus wickets. These are as good as any Indian pacer in the past and you think we have produced Mcgraths, Marshals. Yes, he is inconsistent and needs to improve, but you dont discard such bowlers after one series. He was our best fast bowler before he got injured in 2012. He played a test since then now. And if these guys were in Australia, you can see how Australians were excited to see two bowlers bowling over 90 mph for India. These guys would have become real strike bowlers if they were playing for Australia. You know what is the FC average of Pattinson, Cummins, Hazlewood, Starc and how many 5-fers they have in FC. Pattinson didnt have even one 5-get before his debut, Cummins had played just 3 FC matches before his test debut in SA. Hazlewood has 1 5-fer in 30 odd FC matches and they all average 30 or more in FC but still picked because Australians know how to make fast bowlers. That's spot on. You will not get replies for this.:winky:
Shivaji bhonsle Posted January 18, 2015 Author Posted January 18, 2015 Mitchell starc who got hammered by Indian batsmen in test match has got 8 wickets in 2 matches this series so far. This is what I was talking about. They can be match winners on their day.
BlueBee Posted January 18, 2015 Posted January 18, 2015 Mitchell starc who got hammered by Indian batsmen in test match has got 8 wickets in 2 matches this series so far. This is what I was talking about. They can be match winners on their day. He bowled well in the last test
bharat297 Posted January 18, 2015 Posted January 18, 2015 It's hard to say who Aaron would have replaced. I don't think Binny was the like-for-like replacement because Binny is in the team as a pace-bowling allrounder (apparently). So it's down to Shami, Bhuvi, Ishant and Yadav. Of those, who would you replace. The other option would be to drop Binny and Patel and picked Aaron and Yuvraj in their place. That would have been my preferred option.
TNAmarkFrmIndia Posted January 18, 2015 Posted January 18, 2015 If by "costly mistake" you mean to say that we made a mistake by not allowing him to cost us lots of runs and possibly a few matches then yes, it was a costly mistake.
Marut Posted January 18, 2015 Posted January 18, 2015 The WC is not the testing ground for a spray gun. Let him play less important matches and build some credibility first.
rkt.india Posted January 18, 2015 Posted January 18, 2015 The WC is not the testing ground for a spray gun. Let him play less important matches and build some credibility first. Most of our bowlers are spraygun.
rkt.india Posted January 18, 2015 Posted January 18, 2015 It's hard to say who Aaron would have replaced. I don't think Binny was the like-for-like replacement because Binny is in the team as a pace-bowling allrounder (apparently). So it's down to Shami, Bhuvi, Ishant and Yadav. Of those, who would you replace. The other option would be to drop Binny and Patel and picked Aaron and Yuvraj in their place. That would have been my preferred option. You need 5 seamers at least. Bunny is picked ahead of 5th specialist seamer.
express bowling Posted January 18, 2015 Posted January 18, 2015 Well Kapil Dev succeeded in Aus in 92 when he had lost most of his pace. And so did PK in 2008, Irfan Pa:dance:than and RP Singh in 2003-04 and 2007. It's only our medium pacers who have done well and the reason for the same was they bowled with control and put pressure on batsmen. Wkts come when you put batsmen under pressure and both Aaron & Umesh are incapable of doing so. RP Singh bowled 135 to 142 k when he was bowling well for India. Sometimes touched 145 k. Got good bounce too. Why are you calling him a medium pacer ? Kapil bowled medium pace only during the last few years of his career. He was fast-medium before that. After losing pace , Kapil's success in tests became much lesser. He took 300 wickets from about 75 tests when he had decent pace @ about 4 wickets per test. He took 134 wickets from 56 tests @ 2.4 wickets per test after losing pace.
BlueBee Posted January 18, 2015 Posted January 18, 2015 Tell me when has Australia persisted with a lost cause like Yadav Heard of Mitchell Johnson ?
express bowling Posted January 18, 2015 Posted January 18, 2015 @ UG ---- Since you are a great believer in overall stats, let us look at the test records of some of the most talented medium pacers that have played for India. I have picked up bowlers with atleast 20 tests as that would give us a decent sample size. Manoj Prabhakar -- 96 wickets from 39 tests @ 2.46 wickets per test Average -- 37.3 Strike rate -- 77.9 Venkatesh Prasad -- 96 wickets from 33 tests @ 2.90 wickets per test Average -- 35.0 Strike rate -- 73.3 Irfan Pathan -- 100 wickets from 29 tests @ 3.45 wickets per test Average -- 32.3 Strike rate -- 58.8 Roger Binny -- 47 wickets from 27 tests @ 1.74 wickets per test Average -- 32.6 Strike rate -- 61.1 These have been our best and most skilled medium pacers in our history. They often do decently in ODIs but become bad to average in tests. As a group , they are no better than our bad fast bowlers. Our 3 best test pacers in history ... Kapil, Srinath and Zaheer ...have been either fast medium or fast.
express bowling Posted January 18, 2015 Posted January 18, 2015 We need wicket taking pacers with atleast decent accuracy and atleast decent pace. Erratic fast bowlers or gentle medium pacers won't do.
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