How good are the current swing bowlers compared to Kapil?

[Ankit_sharma03]

20 minutes ago, sandeep said:

That's harsh and IMHO inaccurate.  Injuries != poor fitness.  Irfan was guilty of choosing to follow the wrong advice, and decided to try and get quicker.  Went about it the wrong way, and lost his swing, which made him a total trundler.  

In last few years it has been extreme poor fitness. If ur not training properly u will get injured a lot and im talking about irfan who was a fit guy when he came in not ashish nehra who had injury issues 

 

Their is a lot more to irfan downfall then just loosing swing 

 

Look yusuf in fielding for KKR in last many years 

20 minutes ago, sandeep said:

And yes, in the 2nd half of his career, there was a distinct lower priority in his mind for Ranji and FC cricket, he was clearly attempting to extend his IPL career and earnings - not exactly a crime.  

Not a crime ofcourse, but m against those who blame chappell....it was irfan who himself has to be blamed

20 minutes ago, sandeep said:

 

Irfan didn't live up to the initial hype and expectations created by his excellent early int'l start.  But you simply can't accuse Yusuf of being lazy.  The guy is an extremely limited player who made the most of his abilities to have the career he did.  

Every has certain limitation its how u grow , if ur not growing that is a players fault himself 

Disagree yusuf cud have been a far better player for india 

 

A guy who has a 100 in Sa will have some talent and he didnt take it to next level. Yusuf was a murderer of spin bowling and in all these years he cudnt even extend his arc of hitting 

Yuvraj singh was damn bad against spin when he came but he improved and over a period of time at his peek he use to kill spinners

Dhoni wasnt to gr8 against pacer when he came in but again improved

Bhuvi was limited .....look at his skill level now 

 

Everyone will have limitation with talent its what u make out of it

20 minutes ago, sandeep said:

Arm-chair experts are entitled to their opinions and even biases.  But let's try and be at least a little grounded in reality. 

m in reality , i didnt expect him to be kapil dev but when we talk about limitation a certain ravindre jadeja had to a lot limitation.....but atleast grew a lot as bowler . In case of yusuf neither did his batting nor did his bowling

 

 

Also i have clearly mentioned m not blaming irfan alone ,Indian team at that time didnt have good fast bowling culture which many suffered 

4 hours ago, Ankit_sharma03 said:

at that time we also didnt have a proper fats bowling culture, if many fell it had to do something with our culture n awareness

it wasnt their , post ipl(i mean ipl also took few yrs to develop it) a lot more awareness came about fitness, diet, techniques till then these careers - irfan, rp, sreesanth , munaf were finished. 

I use to hear crap from ex-crickter forget pace bowl line n length , so m sure this was also the advice floating around in our culture. And at the end blame comes on to individual as well they all got lazy n had poor attitude ............look at nehra g till the end bowled 140k ....whereas irfan was seen bowling 115k in SMA last time .

 

Fast bowling is also about attitude and none of them had it 

 

[vvvslaxman]

8 hours ago, Tattieboy said:

Dean Jones the next best what after Richards ?

Best ODI batsman in the 80s after Viv Richards.

[rtmohanlal]

not even 60% good, i would say..... every  at the least successful seam bowler whether it be Srinath,Zaheer Khan or Ishant Sharma at least had qualilty support   at home in the form of quality spinners like Kumble,Harbhajan,Ashwin,Jadeja etc etc. But for Kapil  it was very moderate  in home conditions , the least said about abroad the better.

It is in this context of  very less  support, longevity, work density(Kapil played first 62 tests in a period of just  5 years & 5 months) that 

Kapil's 29.64 end average  need to be evaluated, hence for me  he is  a 'very good ' category bowler,  just 1 level or at the most 2 levels

below ' ATG'  category level.