Lone Wolf Posted August 17 Posted August 17 (edited) 22 hours ago, singhvivek141 said: Lack of self propelled artilley is a key gap which we have to bridge. K9 Vajra is in limited numbers, we need to order ATAGS, Tata MGS & Kalyani MGS. With 155mm being the standard..chances of inclusion of 105mm GARUDA is very less Hope the trials complete soon so that we can start inducting them. Hopefully Army doesnt come up with a last minute surprise like they did with Zorawar. SPH did a lot of damage in Poonch Rajouri sector in Op Sindoor. It's a major gap. Matching Chinese numbers is unrealistic but we can have 600- 700 guns minimum at least BTW P75I has gone to CCS as per NDTV.. we are almost there after more than 2 decades Edited August 17 by Lone Wolf
singhvivek141 Posted August 17 Posted August 17 (edited) 53 minutes ago, Lone Wolf said: SPH did a lot of damage in Poonch Rajouri sector in Op Sindoor. It's a major gap. Matching Chinese numbers is unrealistic but we can have 600- 700 guns minimum at least BTW P75I has gone to CCS as per NDTV.. we are almost there after more than 2 decades Its a good news, but the process has been horribly slow. Understandable coz Navy might have lost its maximum budget procuring P8Is and Rafale Marine fighter jets. Hope they dont procure any more jets and instead ask TASL to build more C295 MRMRs for coastal patrolling and submarine hunting. I doubt P15C will go through now, as the primary focus is on P18 which will get cleared by 2028. So till then the funds will be reserved for that. I also hope that the number for P18 remains at around 12 so that we can not only manage the reduced hull count after retirement of Rajput & Delhi class...but also expand it. Navy has set a target of 200 ships by 2035, currently they are at 150-160. Expansion of hull count need to start now. P77, P75I & P17B are the projects where Navy should focus on with their full energy first. And should execute them by the end of this financial year (I think P77 has already started). P18, P76 (homegrown SSKs) & P28A (Corvettes) are slightly behind....expecting them to commission by 2027-28. IAC-2 & TEDBF, I think it will see the light by 2029-30. As this will be built by Cochin Shipyard which isn't directly under Navy, it will take some bureaucratic process to go through as well. By the time in 2036-2037 this is ready, we can retire Vikramaditya and Mig29k with it and roughly around the same time TEDBF will also start to come in. Edited August 17 by singhvivek141
Lone Wolf Posted August 17 Posted August 17 (edited) 12 minutes ago, singhvivek141 said: Its a good news, but the process has been horribly slow. Understandable coz Navy might have lost its maximum budget procuring P8Is and Rafale Marine fighter jets. Hope they dont procure any more jets and instead ask TASL to build more C295 MRMRs for coastal patrolling and submarine hunting. I doubt P15C will go through now, as the primary focus is on P18 which will get cleared by 2028. So till then the funds will be reserved for that. I also hope that the number for P18 remains at around 12 so that we can not only manage the reduced hull count after retirement of Rajput & Delhi class...but also expand it. Navy has set a target of 200 ships by 2035, currently they are at 150-160. Expansion of hull count need to start now. P77, P75I & P17B are the projects where Navy should focus on with their full energy first. And should execute them by the end of this financial year (I think P77 has already started). P18, P76 (homegrown SSKs) & P28A (Corvettes) are slightly behind....expecting them to commission by 2027-28. IAC-2 & TEDBF, I think it will see the light by 2029-30. As this will be built by Cochin Shipyard which isn't directly under Navy, it will take some bureaucratic process to go through as well. By the time in 2036-2037 this is ready, we can retire Vikramaditya and Mig29k with it and roughly around the same time TEDBF will also start to come in. P18 won't get cleared by 2028, RFP will be issued in 2029, construction to begin after 6-7 years minimum P15C has been more or less confirmed by MDL itself. Budget constraints have pushed all these projects back by a few years. Edited August 17 by Lone Wolf singhvivek141 1
singhvivek141 Posted August 18 Posted August 18 11 hours ago, Lone Wolf said: P18 won't get cleared by 2028, RFP will be issued in 2029, construction to begin after 6-7 years minimum P15C has been more or less confirmed by MDL itself. Budget constraints have pushed all these projects back by a few years. MDL & GRSE will work on P15C GRSE is also working on P17B & ASW MDL will also work on P75I & P17B HSL is working LPD & FSS, potentially on P77 as well Goa Shipyard is on Patrol Vessels & NGC P18 banega kidhar ? All Shipyards are packed. Cochin Shipyard is building ships for Ministry of Shipping and later will take up IAC. We need more Shipyards. Lone Wolf 1
singhvivek141 Posted August 18 Posted August 18 @Lone Wolf Sab confuse hai...15C hai ya 18. Defence Matrix created a whole video stating P18 will start coming in from 2034 onwards.
Lone Wolf Posted August 18 Posted August 18 (edited) 2 hours ago, singhvivek141 said: @Lone Wolf Sab confuse hai...15C hai ya 18. Defence Matrix created a whole video stating P18 will start coming in from 2034 onwards. This is P15C most likely as P18 were supposed to be 13k tonnes. Timing matches with NDTV report. From 2034 onwards only P15C ones can start coming realistically. They will replace Rajput class destroyers Edited August 18 by Lone Wolf singhvivek141 1
singhvivek141 Posted August 18 Posted August 18 (edited) 23 minutes ago, Lone Wolf said: This is P15C most likely as P18 were supposed to be 13k tonnes. Timing matches with NDTV report. From 2034 onwards only P15C ones can start coming realistically. They will replace Rajput class destroyers Hope P15C come up with atleast 64 VLS. It should be able to carry 24 Brahmos / Nirbhay combo and 40 odd Air Defence missiles like Kusha M1/M2 or Barak. P15B & P15A both has 48 VLS (in 16/32) configuration. Btw...idrw is still calling it as P18. Edited August 18 by singhvivek141 Lone Wolf 1
Lone Wolf Posted August 19 Posted August 19 10 hours ago, singhvivek141 said: Hope P15C come up with atleast 64 VLS. It should be able to carry 24 Brahmos / Nirbhay combo and 40 odd Air Defence missiles like Kusha M1/M2 or Barak. P15B & P15A both has 48 VLS (in 16/32) configuration. Btw...idrw is still calling it as P18. Idrw wale khud confuse rehte... They were convinced that additional Scorpenes were also coming before P75I singhvivek141 1
singhvivek141 Posted August 19 Posted August 19 Open Nuclear missiles to private sector ia bit risky. Chances of leaks are high, specially when Agni, Shaurya & K series missiles are our best kept secret so far.
singhvivek141 Posted August 20 Posted August 20 I hope Indian Army wakes up and order Pralay missiles in bulk as well. If we want to build a rocket force...we need to build in the stockpile of thousands of Brahmos, Pralay, Nirbhay, Nag and other missiles (Nag maybe even in large numbers).
bsriharsha Posted August 20 Posted August 20 https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.news18.com/amp/world/unusual-airlift-china-turkiyes-60-hour-military-surge-in-pakistan-puts-india-on-alert-exclusive-ws-l-10283581.html Looks like the beggars got money from Saudi to buy more arms. singhvivek141 1
bsriharsha Posted August 20 Posted August 20 The irony that they are getting USD in forex by selling onions to the global market while they let their domestic population buy them at 150-160 a kg in PKR
singhvivek141 Posted August 21 Posted August 21 14 hours ago, bsriharsha said: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.news18.com/amp/world/unusual-airlift-china-turkiyes-60-hour-military-surge-in-pakistan-puts-india-on-alert-exclusive-ws-l-10283581.html Looks like the beggars got money from Saudi to buy more arms. I was honestly expecting this to happen. The way India was announcing new deals and military modernization. Pakistan needed funds to show up to their public that they're not behind. They have also suffered casualties to their military arms stockpile due to attacks on their military cantonments by drones and armed freedom fighters of BLA & TTP
singhvivek141 Posted August 22 Posted August 22 While I dont disagree with this statement of Ex. Vice Chief...there is some % of ignorance as well here. Yes, we dont have a 5th gen fighter jet right now. But we have seen in the latest wars of Russia Ukraine or US-Iran that even 4th/4.5 gen fighter jets have a role to play. US is still using F15 and F16 which aren't stealthy and they are still ordering those in large numbers. Yes, AMCA and 5th gen fighter jet must be a priority but that doesnt mean 4.5 gen dont have a role at all. https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/india-air-force-hal-operationally-definitely-no-just-weeks-out-of-uniform-ex-vice-chief-slams-tejas-mk-2-programme-11943758
bsriharsha Posted August 25 Posted August 25 On 8/22/2026 at 5:23 PM, singhvivek141 said: US is still using F15 and F16 which aren't stealthy and they are still ordering those in large numbers. It's because they provide them in huge numbers. Tejas Mk1/Mk2 are just a pipedream at this moment thanks to HAL and their lethargy. If we had Tejas MK1 and MK2 operational and running in large squadrons, then it would have been very good. But all these Babus at HAL do nothing singhvivek141 1
singhvivek141 Posted August 25 Posted August 25 12 minutes ago, bsriharsha said: It's because they provide them in huge numbers. Tejas Mk1/Mk2 are just a pipedream at this moment thanks to HAL and their lethargy. If we had Tejas MK1 and MK2 operational and running in large squadrons, then it would have been very good. But all these Babus at HAL do nothing Agree, no denying that HAL is lethargic in providing us the airframes on time. But the key is we still need it, and instead of buying foreign jets which costs a lot, a local jet with even a 70% of capability brings to us the skilled workforce on which we can improve. China too did the same, they kept on working over their indigenous products and kept on improving them. Our missile tech and artillery capabilities are world class, and we export them. Tejas mk1a/mk2 success will motivate the local players and we can also explore the options to export them to ASEAN, SL, Armenia, Greece, Cyprus etc. Tejas mk2 specially comes with its own EW suite like Rafale comes in with spectra, our Sukhois, Mirages, Migs dont have EW suite and they need to carry it externally which impacts their weapon carrying capability. G_B_ 1
bsriharsha Posted August 25 Posted August 25 1 hour ago, singhvivek141 said: Agree, no denying that HAL is lethargic in providing us the airframes on time. But the key is we still need it, and instead of buying foreign jets which costs a lot, a local jet with even a 70% of capability brings to us the skilled workforce on which we can improve. There's lethargic and there's HAL levels of lethargic. It would be good to get Tejas on if only to show that we can make 95-100% indigenous. That has to be parallel with whatever supplies we are doing. Indian govts the last 20 years left it to rot.
G_B_ Posted August 25 Posted August 25 On 8/17/2026 at 3:44 PM, Lone Wolf said: SPH did a lot of damage in Poonch Rajouri sector in Op Sindoor. It's a major gap. Matching Chinese numbers is unrealistic but we can have 600- 700 guns minimum at least BTW P75I has gone to CCS as per NDTV.. we are almost there after more than 2 decades India needs 1000 k9... will happen by 2040. Have 200 with another 300 on order (or close to being ordered). Need another 2000, 155 guns. m777 we have 145. So the rest (dhanush and ATAGS) will make up for it. Artillery (rocket and conventional) is a cheap way for India to be competitive. Given the geography of Pakistan, artillery is the way forward. Chinese artillery sucked badly for Thailand in their recent skirmish with Cambodia btw. The actual range of the shell was half of what was quoted. singhvivek141 1
bsriharsha Posted August 25 Posted August 25 When countries are going on manufacturing 5th gen and 6th gen fighters. We are still stuck with trying to manufacture a 4th or a 4.5 gen one. It doesn't matter if it's better than the f16. By the time it will come , it will be near obseletion.
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