Lets not forget who started all this…

[Holysmoke]

for this gen, sehwag started it.

Openers have always been dashing. Surya, Kalu, Gilly, etc Even Tendulkar and Ganguly when needed... Sriram is talking about the middle order. Thats the big difference here... once the openers start going, the middle order doesnt stop, even after the powerplay is over.

[Ram]

Its amazing to find people mentioning Sehwag in the same vein as Yuvi in the ODI game. Sehwag may be the world most explosive batsman now, but his fortunes have fluctuated like the Real estate prices in the U.S. From his debut in 2002 onwards, he was always an inconsistent ODI performer. In 2006, he couldnt buy a run in ODIs. It is only now that he is knocking the stuffing out of every bowler, but as with Viru, things could change pretty dramatically. Yuvi, on the other hand, has been our most reliable peformer in ODIs since he made his comeback into the ODI team under Chappell. He's rock around which our entire Indian batting rests on.

[veer]

I still dont get it.. what did he start?? hitting sixes? attacking bolwers? transforming team? ... again, I am not taking anything away from yuvi.. but saying he started 'this', you are not giving credit to others like Dhoni, Veeru... Yuvi has been there for 8 years now, and if he had started it.. we could have won lot many games during gangs and dravid era.. If anything Dhoni started this by winning those games in partnering with yuvi.. remember domolishing pakis in 2006 by those copter shots.. and coming to pavillion in this style.. Yuvi is the best wing man.. but if something gotta start, it gotta be that leader Dhoni..

[Anakin]

UV started what again?

[The Outsider]

Good OP - though a bit on the side of hyperbole. Yuvraj does get a lot of recognition and has a strong fan following. He got crores for his T20 exploits and any criticism of him will brand you as an anti-Punjabi. There is no doubting his value to the limited over side, but it's taking a lot away from others if he is said to be the single biggest reason for our success. Fact of the matter is that during the last 12-15 months when our ODI side has made these strides, Yuvraj's form has been patchy. Except for the series against England and the last one against Sri Lanka, his contributions have been average or below, but we have still managed to win. The team is a lot more than Yuvraj.

[Sachinism]

Good OP - though a bit on the side of hyperbole. Yuvraj does get a lot of recognition and has a strong fan following. He got crores for his T20 exploits and any criticism of him will brand you as an anti-Punjabi. There is no doubting his value to the limited over side, but it's taking a lot away from others if he is said to be the single biggest reason for our success. Fact of the matter is that during the last 12-15 months when our ODI side has made these strides, Yuvraj's form has been patchy. Except for the series against England and the last one against Sri Lanka, his contributions have been average or below, but we have still managed to win. The team is a lot more than Yuvraj.

I hate it when people do that I and i'm sure most people on here do too, support India as a whole, not certain parts

[flamy]

Very well put, morris. The fact that our openers go berserk like that is because they have the confidence that Yuvi is still waiting in the pavillion. The thing about Yuvi is, once he settles down, he will get big scores and will always be there at the end for you. He is one of the best finishers for us along with Dhoni. And, we have won 90% of the matches he has got a 50 in. And what seperates Yuvi from Sehwag is that Sehwag looks like getting out anytime, but once Yuvi is settled, it is true nightmare for the bowlers. And if you remove him from the MO, there is a gaping hole there in our batting and puts more pressure on Dhoni. Nice writeup, morris. Yuvi is class. Anyone who disputes his six hitting ability is basically an a-hoar.

[Ram]

Yuvraj is the difference that make a good batting line-up great. Think of the times we've been dominant in ODI cricket in the past too. The run of 16 consecutive chases in the ODIs that we had in 2004... Who was the chief architect of that? It was UV UV and probably to an extent Dhoni, are the only two players in our batting line-up who cannot be replaced.

[Donny]

MM - master of exaggeration. "International players, both past and present, have competed with each other to marvel at this Indian ODI outfit using superlatives generally used to describe a Tiger Woods or a Michael Schumacher. ‘Freak of a team’ is what Martin Crowe chose to call us. KP, on the other hand, said that the ‘Indians are playing the ODI game at a totally different level’." KP is in a team their Women's team could beat and Crowe is a New Zealander - what else could he say to save any face at all ? It's like Warne calling Sach the best batsman he's bowled to. Did anyone really think he'd say. "Oh, I don't rate Sachin very highly but he was able to hit me all over the park" :regular_smile: International players ? Who else has noted that India must've discovered videos of Sri Lanka's power hitting approach which led to the '96 WC success ?

[DomainK]

:haha::haha::haha::haha::haha::haha::haha:

[graphic23]

MM - master of exaggeration. "International players, both past and present, have competed with each other to marvel at this Indian ODI outfit using superlatives generally used to describe a Tiger Woods or a Michael Schumacher. ‘Freak of a team’ is what Martin Crowe chose to call us. KP, on the other hand, said that the ‘Indians are playing the ODI game at a totally different level’." KP is in a team their Women's team could beat and Crowe is a New Zealander - what else could he say to save any face at all ? It's like Warne calling Sach the best batsman he's bowled to. Did anyone really think he'd say. "Oh, I don't rate Sachin very highly but he was able to hit me all over the park" :regular_smile: International players ? Who else has noted that India must've discovered videos of Sri Lanka's power hitting approach which led to the '99 WC success ?

Do you mean '96? And yes, Jayasuriya and Kaluwitharana were amazing at the top of the order. In fact, I think both Sanath and Sachin played similar innings when they were first pushed up the order. With the '96 WC, the teams in general discovered what an explosive opener meant. Jayasuriya (won the Man of the Series) and Sachin had the highest runs in the WC - it was a terrific thing to watch back then. But I think what MM is getting at is that the 20-40 overs is the time when usually the middle order bats and generally, it tends to be an area of consolidation and with the advent of Yuvraj Singh in the Indian team, we've reduced the huge gape in the runrate that would be there otherwise, and I agree with him.

[Anakin]

SRT played that sort of innings in NZ the first time he opened batting. But unfortunately SRT never had the license to go broke at the bowling like Sanath had.

[DomainK]

Do you mean '96? And yes' date=' Jayasuriya and Kaluwitharana were amazing at the top of the order. In fact, I think both Sanath and Sachin played similar innings when they were first pushed up the order. With the '96 WC, the teams in general discovered what an explosive opener meant. Jayasuriya (won the Man of the Series) and Sachin had the highest runs in the WC - it was a terrific thing to watch back then. But I think what MM is getting at is that the 20-40 overs is the time when usually the middle order bats and generally, it tends to be an area of consolidation and with the advent of Yuvraj Singh in the [i']Indian team, we've reduced the huge gape in the runrate that would be there otherwise, and I agree with him.

If I remember right, Sanath started off with some wild slogging in the first 3/4 innings and then settled down to normal stroke play. Sachin never slogged.

[The Outsider]

Yuvraj is the difference that make a good batting line-up great. Think of the times we've been dominant in ODI cricket in the past too. The run of 16 consecutive chases in the ODIs that we had in 2004... Who was the chief architect of that? It was UV UV and probably to an extent Dhoni, are the only two players in our batting line-up who cannot be replaced.

Hyperbole - Australia, SL, and NZ - the toughest and unprecedented tours we won were all without a significant backbone like contribution from Yuvraj.

[Ram]

Does anyone see anything funny in these two statements?

MM - master of exaggeration.

KP is in a team their Women's team could beat

:haha:

what else could he say to save any face at all ? It's like Warne calling Sach the best batsman he's bowled to. Did anyone really think he'd say. "Oh, I don't rate Sachin very highly but he was able to hit me all over the park" :regular_smile:

Question to you then; Why are people like Crowe and Pietersen not use the same lingo to describe teams like say Pakistan or West Indies?

International players ? Who else has noted that India must've discovered videos of Sri Lanka's power hitting approach which led to the '96 WC success ?

I spoke purely in an Indian context. Yuvraj has pioneered the art of powerplay in the middle overs for India and that has been the difference.

[Mr. Wicket]

Why are people like Crowe and Pietersen not use the same lingo to describe teams like say Pakistan or West Indies?

Because they have nothing to gain by complimenting the Windies. And who the **** has anything nice to say about Pakistan, except for Haroon Lorgat?

[Ram]

Hyperbole - Australia' date=' SL, and NZ - the toughest and unprecedented tours we won were all without a significant backbone like contribution from Yuvraj.[/quote'] In both Aus and SL, we won despite UV being out of form, but look at the scoreline. Sure, we won the CB series finals, but we lost quite a few matches against Aus in the league phase. In contrast, look at the series scorelines where UV has contributed - We've just dominated those series, which I said UV makes a good batting line-up great. And NZ?

[graphic23]

In both Aus and SL, we won despite UV being out of form, but look at the scoreline. Sure, we won the CB series finals, but we lost quite a few matches against Aus in the league phase. In contrast, look at the series scorelines where UV has contributed - We've just dominated those series, which I said UV makes a good batting line-up great. And NZ?

Won 1 and lost 2 I think in the league phases.

[Ram]

Won 1 and lost 2 I think in the league phases.

We also lost a match against Lanka in the league phase. My point being is, if UV delivers, we just annihilate the opposition. If he does not (which happens rarely), we still manage to win, but but lesser margins.

[graphic23]

He didn't have more than 2 noteworthy innings during the series, MM, and it was because of the man with the highest average at the end of the tour, that we ended up winning - hamara kaptain. We had, Dhoni, Gambhir, Sachin leading at the top of the runmaking/average lists while Australia only had Hussey, Clarke, and some other noobs. Yuvraj had only one matchwinning performance, which came against SL.