Irfan Pathan's Performance so far

[vvvslaxman]

Even Maling's figures were 4-0-45-0 Other day

[Fontaine]

F Edwards 2-0-37-0 B Lee 4-0-56-0 Umar Gul 3-0-39-1 How many good seamers are there? Most of the top bowlers were taken to cleaners. Let us put things in perspective. All seamers go for runs in the death. I still question India's overall strategy in the death overs not just fast bowlers. FIeld set, line of attack et al. I think Dhoni can do better here.

I think the biggest problem is that our bowlers aren't bowling enough well directed yorkers. We've seen it from Umar Gul, Malinga that if you bowl it full and straight at yorker length then it's impossible to hit the ball for boundaries at the death. I've never seen Sharma bowl a yorker and Zaheer/Pathan do it rarely.

[The Outsider]

Well Sidebottom and Hilfenhaus haven't played enough T20 cricket yet to make any comparison. But Jimmy Anderson has and funnily enough his strike rate and economy is almost identical to Pathans, so Anderson has been dishing out the same tripe as Pathan. No offense, but maybe you should think harder the next time you post.

Maybe you should heed your own advice. The topic of discussion is Pathan's current form and you are throwing about inane career stats. If you know anything about cricket you would have noticed the difference in Anderson's bowling this T20 WC and Pathan's tripe. But perhaps, numbers from 2 years back provide you with more insight.:hysterical:

You only have to see how differently Pathan bowls when the ball is swinging and when it is not. You can see the differences in seam position, the variations and so on that give you an indication as to what the bowling plans are. It's no different than commentators mentioning that such and such bowler is bowling to a field, setting up the batsmen, and bowling to a plan (back of a length, etc etc). You think the team slips it's plans to the commentators?

And he will have to bowl differently when the ball is not swinging. That's common sense, isn't it? He can't keep on floating deliveries outside off stump when the ball is not swinging, can he? But you are making it sound as if the team is forcing Pathan to bowl like that as if Pathan is not aware of the situation. In fact if they are good on them.

[vvvslaxman]

I think the biggest problem is that our bowlers aren't bowling enough well directed yorkers. We've seen it from Umar Gul, Malinga that if you bowl it full and straight at yorker length then it's impossible to hit the ball for boundaries at the death. I've never seen Sharma bowl a yorker and Zaheer/Pathan do it rarely.

Lot of guys attempt yorkers and end up bowling full tosses. There is a danger there. It happened in IPL as well. Only Malinga got it right. But even he is struggling on these pancakes with no swing. Best death bowling approach is bowling wide yorkers. Andrew Hall used to bowl a lot of them.

[Fontaine]

Maybe you should heed your own advice. The topic of discussion is Pathan's current form and you are throwing about inane career stats. If you know anything about cricket you would have noticed the difference in Anderson's bowling this T20 WC and Pathan's tripe. But perhaps, numbers from 2 years back provide you with more insight.:hysterical:

Don't tell me what the topic of discussion is because it's YOU who brought in Anderson and other bowlers and started comparing them to Pathan, which was apparently ok with you. But when I start comparing them using facts/stats all of a sudden those numbers are now inane? :hysterical: But since you don't want to look at the obvious stats how do you think Anderson has bowled for most of his career? The fact is that Anderson did bowl tripe for MOST of his career. He's been dropped so many times that he's probably lost count. It's only in the past 16 months that he's gained better control and become a better bowler, something which I've criticized Pathan about numerous times.

And he will have to bowl differently when the ball is not swinging. That's common sense, isn't it? He can't keep on floating deliveries outside off stump when the ball is not swinging, can he? But you are making it sound as if the team is forcing Pathan to bowl like that as if Pathan is not aware of the situation. In fact if they are good on them.

No, just the opposite. Go back to my first post and read it again, slowly. I just stated that when there isn't swing, Pathan has to rely on variations like slowers deliveries etc which he's not good at which is something that's usually discussed before a match and during the overs. Now, is that too hard to understand without putting your own spin on things? But you're right about one thing, that it is common sense. But somehow when I mentioned it, you said:

Did they slip in this information to you?

Dude even you don't know what you're talking about.

[JayStarz]

Before the series started I assumed that Irfan would be able to get the most out of the England conditions in terms of swing, but he doesn't seem to be able to extract much/anything. I still think we need him, rather than weakening our batting lineup, at the end of the day...we generally win matches due to our batting performances.

[vvvslaxman]

Before the series started I assumed that Irfan would be able to get the most out of the England conditions in terms of swing, but he doesn't seem to be able to extract much/anything. I still think we need him, rather than weakening our batting lineup, at the end of the day...we generally win matches due to our batting performances.

Reason why bowlers don't get swing according to English commentators Weather is too cold to produce the kind of swing you get in English conditions typicall Pitches are completely shaven. Absolutely dead tracks. First time i saw some swing was when Zak and Irfan bowled against Ireland. Atleast for 2 overs outswing was going for both of them. If there is one team that is going to exploit swing more than anyone else that is going to be India. So far not available for the above stated reasons.

[Sachinism]

Dhoni needs to stand up to Pathan, I believe that will help him direct the ball better, the stumps should already do that, but he seems to be bowling a bit off

[JayStarz]

I don't think Dhoni would be able to keep it entirely tidy to stand up to all 4 overs of Pathan, maybe his last over or where the scorecard is getting out of hand.

[Sachinism]

I don't think Dhoni would be able to keep it entirely tidy to stand up to all 4 overs of Pathan' date=' maybe his last over or where the scorecard is getting out of hand.[/quote'] He did it in the last WC, don't see why he can't do it again, its not like Pathan has increased his pace

[Guest gaurav_indian]

He did it in the last WC' date=' don't see why he can't do it again, its not like Pathan has increased his pace[/quote'] And he bowled Symonds in that game.

[Max_Cady]

irfan is really useful for his batting like that 11 off 3 against bangladesh, those were really valuable runs and in this game of small margins every small contribution counts big time he also won that match against lanka with yusuf, i feel comfortable with irfan at 7 cos it makes the batting really strong his bowling is just there as another option, no diffrent from yusuf's or yuvraj's offbreaks. best thing he can do is get a breakthru here and there but we cant expect him to do wat zaheer, ishant or the 2 spinners do

[ViruRulez]

irfan is really useful for his batting like that 11 off 3 against bangladesh, those were really valuable runs and in this game of small margins every small contribution counts big time he also won that match against lanka with yusuf, i feel comfortable with irfan at 7 cos it makes the batting really strong his bowling is just there as another option, no diffrent from yusuf's or yuvraj's offbreaks. best thing he can do is get a breakthru here and there but we cant expect him to do wat zaheer, ishant or the 2 spinners do

Irfan's batting has improved consistently through the years and nobody is doubting that .. many even say that he is a better t20 batsman then a couple of the proper batsman in the Indian t20 team But the problem is that his bowling has deteriorating in the last few years.. he will get an wicket or so but that will be at the cost of at least 30 runs if not more .. his decline as a bowler has been terrible .. a few years back he was our main bowling spearhead with at least 2-3 wickets with a decent economy every match but his speed has decreased significantly while his economy has increased .. so that is the problem BTW can somebody tell how did he lose all his speed in the past few years.. I can understand Munna's decrease in speed because he does not give any effort but how has IKP decreased such a lot of speed

[bharat297]

Pathan just has to stop bowling length balls. He needs to realise that he is never going to be express and stop trying to bang it into the pitch (even on seaming wickets). He needs to work on perfecting a yorker and changing his pace, trying cutters and trying to extract as much swing as possible, pitch the ball up and get the batsman driving. I think with Pathan you need to push Fine Leg, Third Man and Deep Square Leg out as well as have Long on and Long off back. This way the main gaps are through mid-wicket and over cover (meaning the batsman has to try cross-bat shots to hit boundaries (assuming no misfields). Given this field, Pathan then needs to try to perfect yorkers (I'm sure if he focussed on it, he could do it). I still think Pathan could be a very effective bowler in this format, especially in the latter stages but he needs to get it out of his head to try to bang in a length ball now and then, and in this format any bad ball generally gets put away. Its a freebie for the batsman.

[Fontaine]

Irfan's batting has improved consistently through the years and nobody is doubting that .. many even say that he is a better t20 batsman then a couple of the proper batsman in the Indian t20 team But the problem is that his bowling has deteriorating in the last few years.. he will get an wicket or so but that will be at the cost of at least 30 runs if not more .. his decline as a bowler has been terrible .. a few years back he was our main bowling spearhead with at least 2-3 wickets with a decent economy every match but his speed has decreased significantly while his economy has increased .. so that is the problem BTW can somebody tell how did he lose all his speed in the past few years.. I can understand Munna's decrease in speed because he does not give any effort but how has IKP decreased such a lot of speed

He hasn't lost any of his speed. When he got that hat trick against Pak he was bowling at 79/80mph. As recently as the New Zealand series he was bowling around 85. It depends more on control and trying to swing the ball. If he goes out trying to find swing he'll usually bowl around the 80mph mark.

[The Outsider]

Don't tell me what the topic of discussion is because it's YOU who brought in Anderson and other bowlers and started comparing them to Pathan, which was apparently ok with you. But when I start comparing them using facts/stats all of a sudden those numbers are now inane? :hysterical:

Genius, if you are going to use age old "facts/stats" to discuss players' current form they will be called inane by most.

But since you don't want to look at the obvious stats how do you think Anderson has bowled for most of his career? The fact is that Anderson did bowl tripe for MOST of his career. He's been dropped so many times that he's probably lost count. It's only in the past 16 months that he's gained better control and become a better bowler, something which I've criticized Pathan about numerous times.

What have age old numbers and career performance got to do with current form? Let me repeat this - we are not discussing who has been a better bowler over his career. And if you accept as above that Pathan does not have control and has been bowling tripe lately and Anderson is not, then that is all I was saying in the first place.

No, just the opposite. Go back to my first post and read it again, slowly. I just stated that when there isn't swing, Pathan has to rely on variations like slowers deliveries etc which he's not good at which is something that's usually discussed before a match and during the overs. Now, is that too hard to understand without putting your own spin on things? But you're right about one thing, that it is common sense. But somehow when I mentioned it, you said: Dude even you don't know what you're talking about.

You said the team and captain are asking him to bowl in that particular way as if Pathan does not have any say of his own - poor soul is being asked to do things he doesn't want by the team and captain. It could very well be his decision to bowl like that, it could very well be a joint decision taken by the captain and Pathan.

[Fontaine]

What have age old numbers and career performance got to do with current form? Let me repeat this - we are not discussing who has been a better bowler over his career. And if you accept as above that Pathan does not have control and has been bowling tripe lately and Anderson is not, then that is all I was saying in the first place. You said the team and captain are asking him to bowl in that particular way as if Pathan does not have any say of his own - poor soul is being asked to do things he doesn't want by the team and captain. It could very well be his decision to bowl like that, it could very well be a joint decision taken by the captain and Pathan.

So it could be a lot of things. Yeah ok, sure, thanks for clearing that up.

[spectre]

Here comes your favourite allrounder who is there for his batting compensating his match winning (opposition) bowling performances :hysterical::hysterical::hysterical: 2 from 3b Dont go away, Wait for the 2nd half show...40-50 runs gutter flowing Crapthan is a legend. Adds balance to the team...my ****

[punjabi_khota]

Here comes your favourite allrounder who is there for his batting compensating his match winning (opposition) bowling performances :hysterical::hysterical::hysterical: 2 from 3b Dont go away, Wait for the 2nd half show...40-50 runs gutter flowing Crapthan is a legend. Adds balance to the team...my ****

And he takes out Fletch in first over. spake too soon ? :hahaha:

[h4te]

And he takes out Fletch in first over. spake too soon ? :hahaha:

was a rubbish ball :hahaha: