Can Yuvraj overtake Tendulkar and others as India's all time best ODI batsman?

[Ram]

Like suggesting Yuvraj could surpass Tendulkar in ODIs?

I stand by that statement. I did not claim it WILL happen, I said it may happen. Btw, saying Yuvraj could one day pass Sachin’s legacy in ODIs is in no way being disrespectful to Sachin’s feats in ODIs. Its more a recognition of the impact Yuvraj has had on our ODI success in the last 7 years. Irrespective, maybe we should have a separate thread for this debate.

[Captain of Bhangra]

I stand by that statement. I did not claim it WILL happen, I said it may happen. Btw, saying Yuvraj could one day pass Sachin’s legacy in ODIs is in no way being disrespectful to Sachin’s feats in ODIs. Its more a recognition of the impact Yuvraj has had on our ODI success in the last 7 years. Irrespective, maybe we should have a separate thread for this debate.

You may be unaware, but Yuvraj is in his late-ish twenties. In terms of achievements or numbers, he would find it impossible to come close to Sachin. Not to mention, Sachin has been phenomenal in both Test and ODI cricket, whereas Yuvraj has the unwanted luxury of being able to concentrate solely on his ODI performances. After exploding onto the scene with brilliant innings against various teams, he faded off for a long period. Many would argue that he was a passenger for too long, and got more chances than anyone should deserve. It was only a kick up the backside from Greg Chappell that caused a sudden overnight change, and got him going again, but he had wasted a few years by then. If Yuvraj finishes his career level with Ganguly, he will have done well... (ps, I'm a huge fan of Yuvraj, and believe he's currently more vital to the Indian ODI side than Sachin)...

[Ram]

You may be unaware' date=' but Yuvraj is in his late-ish twenties. In terms of achievements or numbers, he would find it impossible to come close to Sachin. [/quote'] My claim wasn’t that Yuvraj would pass Sachin in terms of total runs scored or number of 100s. That is just a statistical impossibility, I am aware of that.

Not to mention' date=' Sachin has been phenomenal in both Test and ODI cricket, whereas Yuvraj has the unwanted luxury of being able to concentrate solely on his ODI performances. After exploding onto the scene with brilliant innings against various teams, he faded off for a long period. Many would argue that he was a passenger for too long, and got more chances than anyone should deserve. It was only a kick up the backside from Greg Chappell that caused a sudden overnight change, and got him going again, but he had wasted a few years by then. If Yuvraj finishes his career level with Ganguly, he will have done well... [/quote'] I am taking 2002 as the reference year as far as ODIs is concerned, which was a full 3 years after Yuvraj made his ODI debut. My belief is that since then, Yuvraj has either matched or edged out (by a fraction of a distance) in the race for India’s best ODI bat. Again, I am not going by total runs or the number of 100s alone, I am looking at percentage of match-winning contributions and the overall impact it has had our ODI performance. I think its no surprise that we have had our BEST run on ODIs in our cricketing history in the last 7 years, a period that coincides with Yuvraj’s resurgence in the team (much like the impact Sehwag has had on our test record abroad). Does that mean he was solely responsible for it? Obviously not. There have significant contributions from other players, notably from guys like Sachin and Dhoni. But I believe Yuvraj’s fearless middle order performances have had a transformation effect on our ODI record. And let me just say, I base my theory on one massive assumption, which is that Sachin would be playing ODIs after WC ’11 and Yuvraj has another 6-7 years of ODI cricket left in him, which is essentially the same period as the one since his comeback into the ODI team. It may very well be that Sachin may come up with some mind-boggling performances in the remaining time-line. It may also very well be that Yuvraj may lose form/fitness and fizzle away. If any of the above two happens, then my claim will be totally wrong. But if, IF, Sachin plays the remaining 18 months in ODI career like his previous 7 years and IF Yuvraj continues to play for the 6-7 years in manner resembling his previous 6, I truly think he may just pip Sachin’s legacy as our BEST ODI batsmen, even including Sachin’s exploits in the 1989-2002 time-line that we have not talked about, so far.

[Guest Hiten.]

To make the topic more interesting, I have added a poll. You're welcome guys :dontmentionit:

[Sooda]

MM Yuvrajs best years has been over the period when Sachin as a batting force has been in decline. Theres no comparision for me. Tendulkar played in a team that was a lot worse in the 90's and was better against better bowling attacks. Its not his fault results didnt go Indias way often enough I agree with CoB- theres a more realistic debate in the statement 'Can Yuvraj overtake Ganguly as Indias all time second best ODI bat'

[Sooda]

btw I thanked you BB :P

[jf1gp_1]

not till Dhoni is around

[ViruRulez]

UV has got 10 years and 10000 runs to make to achieve that and that is impossible at the no. 4 or no. 5 spot.. even if starts opening but still he cannot achieve that though he can make 14000+ if he plays well

[vvvslaxman]

Nobody can do. But in terms of match winning capabilities he is as good as anyone. Especially while chasing.

[Sachin_Rulez]

MM Yuvrajs best years has been over the period when Sachin as a batting force has been in decline. Theres no comparision for me. Tendulkar played in a team that was a lot worse in the 90's and was better against better bowling attacks. Its not his fault results didnt go Indias way often enough I agree with CoB- theres a more realistic debate in the statement 'Can Yuvraj overtake Ganguly as Indias all time second best ODI bat'

I believe yuvi already overtook Gangu as the India's second best ODI bat. If your opinion is based on number of runs they scored in ODIs then yuvi will eventually overtake ganguly. There's absolutely 0% chance of yuvi getting past sachin in terms of runs or no. of centuries (as MM already pointed out rightly) but I give 10% chance of yuvi getting past sachin in terms of match winning performances and the impact. By looking at Dhoni's average and his consistency, he might end up India's best bat :dontknow:

[Ram]

In principle, I object to having such a poll in the first place, especially with my name on the first post (Obviously, the Mod is fully within his rights to do so, after all what he did was perfectly reasonable and common MB practice) I have not yet had the chance to quantify what 'best' means. Without that, its meaningless exercise to ask people to vote on it. Moreever, I would have preferred an approach where people from both sides of the fence can have a informed debate (complete with stats, context and other anecdote), allow the readers go through the respective points and then let them vote on this topic (though I understand that it is not usual MB etiquette to do so..) If i thought this topic was ready for a poll question, I would have opened it myself a long time ago.

[Guest Hiten.]

Jeez, MM I thought you were a better sport than this. I don't know how to delete the poll, so I'm locking it. @ VVS: Where did you get the India of Yuvi being "extra ordinary" while chasing? He sure has the fire power to put us under the shade of comfortableness but his average proves otherwise. http://stats.cricinfo.com/ci/engine/player/36084.html?class=2;innings_number=2;template=results;type=batting;view=innings

[davidcooper]

u cannot compare tendulkar to yuvraj they played in 2 different generations until 2000 since 2000 in an apples to apples comparsion tendulkar has been so far ahead; having said that if i was to chose a batsman to play under pressure and in a big game i would prefer yuvraj in my team..

[vvvslaxman]

I am not going to indulge in stats. But Yuvraj's job is very very tough. Coming in at tight situations and orchestrate chases. His average is not great thanks to his inconsistent phase at the start of his career. Over the last 2 years he has done a fanatstic job.

[Ram]

Jeez, MM I thought you were a better sport than this. I don't know how to delete the poll, so I'm locking it.

Hmm, I think that’s unfairly below the belt. I’ve already said you were well within your rights to do what you did. And I also clearly laid out my reasons as to why I would do NOT prefer a poll on this topic at the moment. No point trying to mend the dam after the flood. Please reopen the poll. I suppose it will be quite interesting to know what people think on this issue.

[Guest Hiten.]

I am not going to indulge in stats. But Yuvraj's job is very very tough. Coming in at tight situations and orchestrate chases. His average is not great thanks to his inconsistent phase at the start of his career. Over the last 2 years he has done a fanatstic job.

Same can be said about the openers, no ? I mean it is their job to give India a flying start to ensure the chase is on track. If they eff up in the beginning all the blame would be poured on them asking questions over their approach towards the target. For instance, today's game SRT's approach was questioned despite being the highest scorer in this game. Bevan was a genius in middle order for a reason. Seldom he got a chance to finish the game off without worrying too much about the asking rate.

[Online]

you have officially lost it

[Jersey #10]

NO! simple as that...

[vvvslaxman]

Same can be said about the openers' date=' no ? I mean it is their job to give India a flying start to ensure the chase is on track. If they eff up in the beginning all the blame would be poured on them asking questions over their approach towards the target. For instance, today's game SRT's approach was questioned despite being the highest scorer in this game. Bevan was a genius in middle order for a reason. Seldom he got a chance to finish the game off without worrying too much about the asking rate.[/quote'] They did eff up in the last match. Yuvi had to bail out along with Dhoni. Dhoni and Yuvi finished many matches in Pakistan. Not without a reason Yuvi won 3 man of the series in a row. I don't think any Indian batsman won 3 man of the series in a row batting at 5 or 6.

[nikred]

thank you bb :icflove: