Rajiv Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 Its been quiet since 26/11 due to International Pressure towards Pakistan they have seen mayhem in past 8-9 months They feel this is done by India, even if not; easy to pick Our rise and their fall Lot of anti-india sentiment and IPL was the icing on the cake gilanis latest comments Thought of Collateral Damage The only thing which might work is that "$$ used against India Clause" Major events coming to India and perfect chance for attack
EnterTheVoid Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 What have we been reduced to, twiddling our thumbs waiting for an attack :((
Ram Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 Pakistanis have started their antics in Kashmir after a lull. It may very well be that they intend to spread the chaos across India too. Lets make one thing VERY clear to ourselves - As a nation, we're just sitting ducks. Its a miracle that an attack does not happen once every week. If something does not happen, it is not because the enemy is not capable of penetrating our security (if such a thing even exists), its because he is being forced to lie low due to certain other factors.
triam Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 MM I am surprised this is coming frm you, we as a nation have withstood much more, over our history. Agreed, that our government and intelligence have to improve a lot, but I dont think things are so bleak as you state.
Ram Posted January 23, 2010 Posted January 23, 2010 MM I am surprised this is coming frm you, we as a nation have withstood much more, over our history. Agreed, that our government and intelligence have to improve a lot, but I dont think things are so bleak as you state. Triam, trust me dude, I take MASSIVE pride in my Indian identity. My post was more a damning reflection of the reality of the world in which we find ourselves in. As far as terrorist targets so, we're softer than even the softest of targets. Unlike the US or Europe, we share a land border with the most fiercest of our adversaries. To make matters worse, our skin colors are more or less the same as our neighbors. Keeping this mind and the pathetic state of our homeland security (ridiculously porous borders, shocking under-equipped, under-staffed, under-trained security and intelligence forces), it will not take much to orchestrate a terror attack on any of our cities. We have no robust security infrastructure to speak of, corruption is endemic and we have enough number of greedy specimens in our own country willing to sell themselves to foreign elements for money. To make matters worse, our adversary is no Afghanistan type puny, powerless nation. They're nuclear-equipped, with a full-fledged army. So, we cannot even think about having a full-scale war. To compound matters, we do not have a proper counter-terrorist strategy (next time a group of terrorists orchestrate another 26/11 operation in another city, the exact same chaos will ensue..). Keeping all this in mind, I am surprised that you find room to be even slightly optimistic. I repeat, given all these factors, and the number of people in this world who wants to cause harm to us, its a miracle if a day goes without something untoward happening. That a group of dastardly terrorists can simply steal a boat, casually sail their way from Pakistan all the way to Mumbai of all cities, land on our shores, get into the city and creat havoc while lathi wielding policeman tried to confront them clearly paints a picture of what I am trying to say.
Clarke Posted January 24, 2010 Posted January 24, 2010 Terrorism is a part of our lives, that we know for sure. An attack is imminent whether on Indian or American soil. What matters is the fact that we do not give a knee jerk response (which the majority of India wants i.e. WAR) and more importantly change our lives top to bottom because we are scared of this menace. We shall defend ourselves and prosper at the same time, and that in itself shall be a victory over the enemy.
EnterTheVoid Posted January 24, 2010 Posted January 24, 2010 Lets make one thing VERY clear to ourselves - As a nation' date= we're just sitting ducks Every terrorist attack is the result of either Failed Intelligence OR The Failure to act on Good Intelligence, we agree on that ? "Sitting Ducks", as you term it, implies living in complete state of denial, oblivious to the dangers that threaten us, hardly a fair assessment. If we are "sitting ducks", it implies we do nothing to protect ourselves and wait for the enemy to attack us. Perhaps you'd like to think so but I beg to differ.
Ram Posted January 24, 2010 Posted January 24, 2010 Every terrorist attack is the result of either Failed Intelligence OR The Failure to act on Good Intelligence, we agree on that ? "Sitting Ducks", as you term it, implies living in complete state of denial, oblivious to the dangers that threaten us, hardly a fair assessment. If we are "sitting ducks", it implies we do nothing to protect ourselves and wait for the enemy to attack us. Perhaps you'd like to think so but I beg to differ. Before you get too excited, spend some time reading the other (larger) post that I have in this thread.
Lurker Posted January 24, 2010 Posted January 24, 2010 MM I am surprised this is coming frm you, we as a nation have withstood much more, over our history. Agreed, that our government and intelligence have to improve a lot, but I dont think things are so bleak as you state. Bollocks. It is NOT out Government and Intelligence that has to improve, it is the Indian citizen that has to. We are a country of Internet warriors who show our manliness on Message boards. How many Indians do you know who have been a part of Security forces at any time? Every single client site in US that I have worked with had people(Americans) who had spent a few years in Armed forces. It is futile to think an Indian Govt will behave like an Israeli or an American when an Indian citizen does not behave like an Israeli or an American citizen. Those who are the sharpest tongue criticizing India should do to back them by joining, or atleast trying to join Armed forces. Put up or shut up(not you Triam of course :winky: ). xx
patriot Posted January 24, 2010 Posted January 24, 2010 ^ Could'nt be more wrong. Israeli has compulsory armed forces service for term for each citizen, USA does not, but still the value of life of a formed US armed forces member and the quality of life ...is way way better than even middle class civilians in India, let alone teh average jawan, who lives in abject poverty . In 2002 for 10 months the forces were placed on the border in unbearable weather , in war like positions, hundreds became victim to the weather and the babus later asked them to withdraw from the border. With such apathy towards our brave heroes, who should be blamed for not joing the services ? The ones who do , are our biggest heroes and we have 1.5 million of them. Our pathetic ruling class with all their apathy towards an avg soldiers life makes most families not want to send its brave son in the armed forces.
Lurker Posted January 24, 2010 Posted January 24, 2010 Our pathetic ruling class with all their apathy towards an avg soldiers life makes most families not want to send its brave son in the armed forces. Lets start with you. What effort did you make in getting into the armed forces?? Not getting personal but surely charity begins at home and all that. So in the interest of the discussion kindly do a full disclosure. xx
patriot Posted January 24, 2010 Posted January 24, 2010 Lets start with you. What effort did you make in getting into the armed forces?? Not getting personal but surely charity begins at home and all that. So in the interest of the discussion kindly do a full disclosure. xx Tried extremely hard to convince family and relatives after 12th Standard about joining the Air force as an intermediate. Was brainwashed against it by all and sundry. Was reminded about the frequently crashing MIGS during training sorties, each time I begged my uncle to convince my parents. Was reminded being the only chilld, my duties to my parents. Kargil war was at it's peak during those days. All that junoon and all about joining the Air force , was unduly crushed by near ones. The only way out of pursuing my dream was running away from home, something was not prepared to do at any cost. Things then ended there, joined Engineering, everything was forgotten. I am sure I am not alone. There are many many like me who face immense pressure from family against pursuing this path.
Lurker Posted January 24, 2010 Posted January 24, 2010 ^^ Thats good to know. Props to you for atleast making an effort. Since you have experienced it first hand, can we agree that it is ridiculous to criticize politicians and armed forces when the ordinary Indians do not want to get into the scheme of affairs to fix it?
Clarke Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 :hatsoff: yeppers ... totally spot on. unless and untill Padosees use the nookes we should do nothing. And even after the first one we should resist any temptation ... afterall India is big and should act like a responsible big brother .... lol thanks for the sarcasm. I didnt say nothing, all i said was knee-jerk response as in full on WAR and all those fancy surgical strikes the press keeps yapping about. Things can be done covertly u know, infact they must be already happening.
Clarke Posted January 25, 2010 Posted January 25, 2010 Tried extremely hard to convince family and relatives after 12th Standard about joining the Air force as an intermediate. Was brainwashed against it by all and sundry. Was reminded about the frequently crashing MIGS during training sorties, each time I begged my uncle to convince my parents. Was reminded being the only chilld, my duties to my parents. Kargil war was at it's peak during those days. All that junoon and all about joining the Air force , was unduly crushed by near ones. The only way out of pursuing my dream was running away from home, something was not prepared to do at any cost. Things then ended there, joined Engineering, everything was forgotten. I am sure I am not alone. There are many many like me who face immense pressure from family against pursuing this path. ^^ Thats good to know. Props to you for atleast making an effort. Since you have experienced it first hand, can we agree that it is ridiculous to criticize politicians and armed forces when the ordinary Indians do not want to get into the scheme of affairs to fix it? Tell u what, i tried joining the Army during Engineering. They conduct on-campus interviews, the one i attended was some holiday and hence only a dozen of about hundreds of students appeared for the interview. The recruiters rejected all of us. I attended one of the best colleges in my state which makes it to top hundred list of India Today. The next year the Army comes for recruitment again. This time, hordes of students appear for the interview & two of them are selected. During the presentation itself, they indicated that their officer recruitment percent was less than 1% over the past few years. Hell, i know a DRDO design engineer who was rejected during this recruitment drive. Ofcourse, almost all others are well off working 4 MNCs. In other words, the Indian Army is much more choosy in selecting its officers. Maybe they have stringent requirements beyond all private sector companies, but suggesting that most Indians are not patriotic with respect to the armed forces does not make sense as per my experiences.
triam Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 I agree with patriot, with respect to Israel and US Israel is compulsory, and the benefits that US military gets is frickin amazing, wrt to education, skills training and other stuff (including lower interest rate for mortage etc). I wrote NDA way back in 96 and qualified, convinced my parents too, but an objective analysis of what you give and what you get back is abysmal, finally listend to some uncles and dropped the idea of NDA. So, it again goes back to the govt make it an attractive and feasible career choice for youngsters so they will seriously consider military as a career option. Even in the US, they face shortage wrt to skilled individuals periodically, thats why they have programs like MAVNI (for non-citizens to gain citizenship by serving in the military etc).
Lurker Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 oye babua ... pehle phorum mey to dikhawo yaar apney bahaduri .... I have left forum-pe-bahaduri for pehelwaans like you. Unlike you I have no interest in being a keyboard warrior but yes do continue in being an online bravado :giggle: Bharatiya sena ki baad mey dekhi jayegi .... I mean Idhar mai ROP bolta hoon tau 2 minute mein tumhary aur tumari biradri waalon ki julaab shuru hoti hai ... :hysterical: Biradari waale ki baat biraadari se karo biradar, hum to apni baat karte hain. Hamein to aaj tak julaab nahin hua kabhi. Haan aksar taras jaroor aata hai aap par ke kya kutte ki dum ki taraf wahi ek fata raag. Arre bhai thora to umar ke saath saath IQ bhi barhao :--D
Clarke Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 I agree with patriot, with respect to Israel and US Israel is compulsory, and the benefits that US military gets is frickin amazing, wrt to education, skills training and other stuff (including lower interest rate for mortage etc). I wrote NDA way back in 96 and qualified, convinced my parents too, but an objective analysis of what you give and what you get back is abysmal, finally listend to some uncles and dropped the idea of NDA. So, it again goes back to the govt make it an attractive and feasible career choice for youngsters so they will seriously consider military as a career option. Even in the US, they face shortage wrt to skilled individuals periodically, thats why they have programs like MAVNI (for non-citizens to gain citizenship by serving in the military etc). The govt is stuck with the Purchasing Power Parity (PPP) mentality according to which Rs. 20k per month is good money to take care of your wife and kids even though a private sector employee of similar position makes multiple times that amount. HRD Minister Kapil Sibal, one of the smartest politicians in the country, offers this explanation for the low salaries of senior IIT professors; i reckon they use the same yardstick for the Armed forces as well. Something needs to be done to check tax evasion and corruption so that the important fields of defense, R&D and science & technology can be given their fair share in the budget.
Lurker Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 Lekin miyan prashna yeh hai .. ki aap Bharatiya sena mey kya bahaduri dikhayenge ? considering how you get all bent out of shape everytime the usual topic comes up online .... Masla to yeh Maulana Saheb ke aap jo har 2 minute mein apna parakram pradharshit karte hain, aapko nahin lagta ke aap galat line mein aa gaye?? Abhi bhi mauka hai bandhu goli maariye vilayat ko aur ek talwaar aur do RSS waali chaddi lekar pahoonch jaaiye J&K border. Sochiye mat jyaada bas ab green card, gc ka chakkar chodiye aur ek aakraman kar hi dijiye Pakistan par. Really ? :--D umar ke saath aapki yaadgash taneek kam hoti lagti hai ... chyavanprash try kiya karo .... lekin philhaal banda hazir hai aapko porani julab katha vistar sey phir prastut karne ki liya Haan lekin aapke biradri vaaley pahunch jayenga fatafat ek naya fatwa lekar as soon as they see you going down in flames .... :--D ... Aur rahi baat raag ki ... aap he ne shuruvaat ki the :winky: Biradari waalon ki baat biradari se karo janaab humse kyun?? Hum to apne man ke marzi hain (unlike you who is controlled from Nagpur :haha:) Jab mauka lage aa jaaiye bas thora naya argument laane ka. wahi ek fata baaja aadmi kahan tak sune?? Humko to ab 1983 WC ka highlights bhi bakwaas lagta hai at time, aap to 2000 saal poorana baaja 5000 baaj baja chuke hain.. Ab thora uppar uthein aap :giggle:
Lurker Posted January 26, 2010 Posted January 26, 2010 Arey baat RSS ki nahi ... baat chewtiya public ki hai jiska sewa aap karney bol rahe hai ... Which bozo would want to work for a population that simply refuses to acknowledge its history and present ( future ki tau aisi ki taisi) . They think self destruction is our janma siddha huq. :-D Arre bhai aap bozo nahin hai aap to samajhdaar aatma hai. Bozo to woh hain jo aaj bhi Hindustan fauz mein bharti ho rahe hain. Hamare aapke jaise samajhdaar log armchair critic ban gaye hain aur aap humse bhi ek kadam aage hain apna paurush dikhaane mein. Emphasis ke liye phir se dohraata hoon. Aap jaise samajhdaar log Hindustan se palayan kar gaye, jo bewakoof hain woh abhi bhi Siachen glacier pe bandook liye khade hain. Khus? I mean right here ... we have seen you harp endlessly on how peacfull your beloved ROP is and spew venom at RSS . you even said that Jizya was a mahaprasad from Allah miyan and that your Mughl-e-Azam wala shahenshah was wonly doing his dharm .. yaad aaya ? Arre bhai RSS to chewtiya brigade hai hi ismein kya sochna? Kaun main akela kahta hoon? Jyaadatar Hindustani aisa hi sochte hain. All said and done India would be a better country without RSS. Ab aapko mera stance clear ho gaya? aap tau Biradri ke pramukh senadhikari hai ... :--D Arre aap to sharminda kar rahe hain. Hum to senadhikari? Hum to honorary Mod bhi nahin hai bhaiya :haha::haha: Aap to loony brigade ke sarwesarwa hain. Aapko kya senapti kya senadhikari? Main to phir kahta hoon ke USCIS ka chakkar chodiye aur ek talwaar aur do RSS ki chaddhi pahan ke chaliye Siachen. Vande Mataram :winky: I take that as a .. "no no I dont want to live thru the past julab katha " .. from you :hmmm: lol..Saawan ke andhe ko hara and all that. Arre bhai even the most popular car, and the greatest hits(movies/songs etc) are released with a "New and improved" formulae, aap wahi 1500 BC mein latke huye hain. Then again this is very reflective of how RSS and Taliban maanshikta are often one and the same :giggle: Stone age mein hi rahne ka bandhu. xx
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