akshayxyz Posted June 29, 2011 Author Posted June 29, 2011 I think you are generalizing all the Vegans there. While I am sure there are those who take great moral pride and think they are making some radical change to animal treatment' date=' For a lot of others it is a personal choice. They do not want to add to the demand because it is a demand and supply situation. A guy who goes for environment friendly vehicle and gives up one which runs on gas will not maybe directly reduce carbon index but is trying not to contribute to it. So I disagree with this whole "go back to the caves" argument. I say to each his own.[/quote'] First of all - I am not talking about Vegans! Although debatable, taking moral pride in turning veg is fine only to some extent. But accusing non-veg of 'lower morals' due to killing animals for food - is not right. By - "go back to caves/jungle" - I just meant, even if you choose to live completely like a stone-age-agriculture based tribe, that still does not guarantee 'no-pain' to no living beings. Demand vs Supply - If one chooses to avoid meat, and replaces by some veg-product(s). One may not directly be eating an animal. But it does not mean, no animal is being tortured to meet his 'change of demand'. Also - killing is not the only way to give pain / torture an animal. Lets say, one was getting 100 gm of protein from meat, and by turning veg, he switches to milk/dairy products. The additional demand of milk to meet the same protein requirement of the person, may mean starving some calf, giving injections to some cow, or perhaps additional under-age slave at some dairy farm. P.S: If you shift to electric car from petrol one - your carbon footprint is not necessarily reduced. Anyway, lets not get into 'green fuel'.
punjabi_khota Posted June 29, 2011 Posted June 29, 2011 I was in Netherlands last month, and those people have **** load of halal shops, doner kebabs places etc. I am guessing this decision is a big deal over there.
akshayxyz Posted June 29, 2011 Author Posted June 29, 2011 How is a vegetarian not causing 'lesser' animal torture ? read above.
flamy Posted June 29, 2011 Posted June 29, 2011 Torture is unnecessary. Just kill it and put it on my plate, please.
flamy Posted June 29, 2011 Posted June 29, 2011 People who uproot defenseless plants should be shot in the balls and dumped in a tub full of tobasco sauce...these effing numbskulls are a disgrace to the concept of evolution. :two_thumbs_up::two_thumbs_up:
akshayxyz Posted June 29, 2011 Author Posted June 29, 2011 ^ How did I miss that. Good one Ganesh. Animals at least can run and hide or attack. Poor plants, cant even express dissent/pain.
Captain of Bhangra Posted June 29, 2011 Posted June 29, 2011 Each to their own, but me & my friends/family refuse to eat anything ritually slaughtered. There aren't any Jewish establishments near us, so we tend to avoid Islamic ones. I was a vegetarian for 12 years, and still have a conscious thing where I couldn't knowingly eat meat, knowing it suffered more than necessary... If I ever get roped into a work function where I know the venue will be serving Halal, I either avoid it, or only eat Vegetarian, Pork, or Fish. Even when drunk, my friends know to look out for the arabic signs in fast food shops, or as they put it: "Not eating here dude, squiggly in the window". One of my friends even went as far as to take legal action against our office cafeteria, for selling Halal meat without warning. They settled before it got out of hand though... I'm surprised at the OP though, as when I had my bachelor party in the Netherlands, my friends were of the opinion that they bent over backwards to accomodate Muslims in terms of food. Moreso than Britain...
The Rock Posted June 29, 2011 Posted June 29, 2011 That drumstick you ate at KFC the other day .. How would you like the chicken killed -- Would it being stabbed, tortured and just beaten for no reason be OK? "Would it being stabbed, tortured and just beaten for no reason be OK?" No it wouldn't be OK and I wouldn't like it. But my reasons for not liking it is different: the torture and the stress suffered by the animal affects the quality, firmness, and color of the meat. Otherwise I don't give a **** about treatment of animals who are bred for consumption. It's hilarious as hell that kosher/halal is banned in Netherlands but scientists there are probably still torturing rats amongst other animals in scientific labs across the country...
ganeshran Posted June 29, 2011 Posted June 29, 2011 It's hilarious as hell that kosher/halal is banned in Netherlands but scientists there are probably still torturing rats amongst other animals in scientific labs across the country... Good point. This was a mandatory experiment during my college years.
urbestfriend Posted June 29, 2011 Posted June 29, 2011 ^ How did I miss that. Good one Ganesh. Animals at least can run and hide or attack. Poor plants, cant even express dissent/pain. This should go to retarded thread.
punjabi_khota Posted June 29, 2011 Posted June 29, 2011 It's hilarious as hell that kosher/halal is banned in Netherlands but scientists there are probably still torturing rats amongst other animals in scientific labs across the country... :WTF: What is hilarious about it ? Would you rather the scientists give you cancer ?
Captain of Bhangra Posted June 29, 2011 Posted June 29, 2011 It's hilarious as hell that kosher/halal is banned in Netherlands but scientists there are probably still torturing rats amongst other animals in scientific labs across the country... I don't (knowingly) eat rats or other lab-testing animals either...
ganeshran Posted June 29, 2011 Posted June 29, 2011 :WTF: What is hilarious about it ? Would you rather the scientists give you cancer ? I thought his point was against the guys opposing eating non veg food on the ground of ethics
akshayxyz Posted June 29, 2011 Author Posted June 29, 2011 This should go to retarded thread. Please.. whatever makes you happy.. Meanwhile have a quick read. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarcasm#Understanding Understanding the subtlety of this usage requires second-order interpretation of the speaker's intentions. This sophisticated understanding can be lacking in some people with certain forms of brain damage, dementia and autism,[11] and this perception has been located by MRI in the right parahippocampal gyrus.[12][13]
The Rock Posted June 29, 2011 Posted June 29, 2011 :WTF: What is hilarious about it ? Would you rather the scientists give you cancer ? It just shows the double standards, not all scientific experiments are essential. And where did you read that most scientific experiments are about curing diseases/ailments?
punjabi_khota Posted June 29, 2011 Posted June 29, 2011 It just shows the double standards' date=' not all scientific experiments are essential. [b']And where did you read that most scientific experiments are about curing diseases/ailments? Enlighten me what they are about then ?
ganeshran Posted June 29, 2011 Posted June 29, 2011 Enlighten me what they are about then ? Many are not - the ones done in many colleges in India are simply repetitions of what has already been done without any intellectual value whatsoever. I have seen people copy readings from someone else and doing the experiment only to be seen as occupied in the lab
The Rock Posted June 29, 2011 Posted June 29, 2011 Enlighten me what they are about then ? Testing of cosmetics products Experiments into behavior, like what happens to an animal psychologically after extended isolation (just a simple example) Experiments to study evolution and genetics of the specie. Now before you argue that these experiments help scientists get a step closer to tackling certain diseases, those kind of experiments come under a separate category. Plus, like Ganeshran said, many experiments are just repeats of those which have already been performed scores of times before And even for those experiments which are said to be essential, such as those with the aim of finding more information on stroke, the animals can be treated more humanely. There have been many whistleblowers claiming maltreatment of lab animals, that they weren't euthanized or given painkillers after surgery or were forcibly isolated in cages for extended periods without any stimuli. Not to mention the millions of animals that are dissected in schools and universities across the world. Of course you can argue that such dissection is necessary for the students to learn whatever they're learning but then I can argue that instead of using a real animal they can use a synthetic model. And there have been many bizarre experiments too. For instance there has been one where an elephant was administered a massive dose of LSD to see if it induces temporary madness. What did the scientists learn from the this? That LSD was fatal to elephants :hysterical: And before you ask for sources, let me point you to this shiny new thing called Google :winky: =-=-= Now before you think I'm one of those new-age hippy-types, my whole point was to show the double standards and hypocrisy of certain people really...
punjabiplaya Posted June 29, 2011 Posted June 29, 2011 its there country they can do what they want,if people dont like it they should go back to there own country where they can eat what they want,hope the uk starts getting more strict and putting its foot down!!!!!!
Sir_Afridi Posted June 29, 2011 Posted June 29, 2011 What will Dutch Muslims do now? No halal meat for them. Haram meat is only allowed if ones life is threatened. What about the imported halal meat ? Is that banned as well?
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