seedhi Posted August 16, 2011 Posted August 16, 2011 Allow EU's Pak package to go through, says PM NEW DELHI: The Prime Minister yet again made a personal intervention to extend a significant unilateral concession to Pakistan, just a few days ahead of Independence Day. Senior sources said PM Manmohan Singh has ordered officials to withdraw India's official opposition at the World Trade Organisation (WTO) to a concessional trade package offered by the European Union to Pakistan. According to sources, the decision to reverse India's year-old stand was at the behest of Singh, and came after more than half-a-dozen meetings of WTO general council where India opposed the trade package. They said Singh's order would be implemented soon. India, supported by Bangladesh and Peru, mounted an opposition in the WTO to the package, challenging the unprecedented EU move. They also raised doubts if the concessions would at all benefit the flood affected people of Pakistan. If India withdraws its opposition, the other two will fall in line, giving WTO approval to the unprecedented package. In the wake of last year's devastating floods in Pakistan, EU made the offer, which has had no precedent, to provide a concessional trade package to the textile industry of Pakistan. India led the challenge to the package in WTO. When Pakistani foreign minister Hina Rabbani Khar was in India recently, she raised the issue of Indian objections with authorities here. At the commerce secretary-level meetings, the issue has been figuring prominently. It is also expected to figure among the key agenda when the commerce ministers of both sides meet in Delhi next month. The Indian stand was prompted by principles of free trade, and not any bilateral adversity, officials insisted. The barter of trade concessions for aid violates principles of free international trade, and sets dangerous precedents, India had argued in at least six rounds of WTO meetings. India said if EU wanted to provide aid to Pakistan, it was more than welcome to do it directly but not through trade diversion couched as trade concession. EU made the unilateral tariff concessions to Pakistan at its summit in September 2010 for export of some 75 items. The year-long concession was expected to give Pakistan a gain of about $300 million, in terms of increase in exports of finished textile products, cotton, ethanol etc. The decision was prompted by assessments that showed that the floods reduced Pakistan's GDP by about 2% in the 2010-11 financial year. However, sources said Singh's personal gesture will not go much beyond this for the time being. A senior official said they were still watching the progress made in investigations into the 26/11 case in Pakistan, cross-border terrorism and other factors of bilateral ties. For now, there would be a very cautionary approach, other than the reversal of the WTO stand, until the end of this summer, they said. http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/Allow-EUs-Pak-package-to-go-through-says-PM/articleshow/9617604.cms This borders on treachery - hurting our textile industry to favor pakistan, without any tangible benefit to India. If this move by MMS goes through he has no moral right to remain in office.
ganeshran Posted August 16, 2011 Posted August 16, 2011 Why should we withdraw the official opposition. When Pakistan is so stubborn regarding prosecution of Mumbai attack terrorists, why are we coming down from our position?
Stuge Posted August 16, 2011 Posted August 16, 2011 WTF is wrong with MMS .why is he acting like Paki agent everytime . THey will use most of the money against us like they always do .
ganeshran Posted August 16, 2011 Posted August 16, 2011 It is not our money per se. But India should still oppose any concessions, especially in the context of the inaction on Mumbai terrorists.
seedhi Posted August 16, 2011 Author Posted August 16, 2011 It is not our money per se. But India should still oppose any concessions' date=' especially in the context of the inaction on Mumbai terrorists.[/quote']EU is bound by WTO rules, and India is legally right in opposing the trade concession to pakistan. Note that Peru, Bangladesh and other countries are also opposing it. This trade concession will hurt our industries which export to EU. MMS has no right to sacrifice their interests for the sake of "goodwill" with the pakis. There is no tangible benefit to India, only economic loss.
Ram Posted August 16, 2011 Posted August 16, 2011 BJP Prime Minister hugs Pakistani Counterpart on the Wagah Border, even as the Pakistani army is busy plotting the Kargil Invasion - *Radio Silence* Foreign Minister Jaswant Singh has to bear the ultimate embarrassment of bartering hardened terrorists for Hijacked Indian passengers – More radio Silence* India withdraws opposition to a WTO Trade deal that will significantly help alleviate the sufferings of a significant portion of the Pakistani population ravaged by successive years of crippling floods in what is by and large a humanitarian move, than a Pro-Pakistani move - MMS has no moral right to remain in office. :nice:
seedhi Posted August 16, 2011 Author Posted August 16, 2011 BJP Prime Minister hugs Pakistani Counterpart on the Wagah Border, even as the Pakistani army is busy plotting the Kargil Invasion - *Radio Silence* Foreign Minister Jaswant Singh has to bear the ultimate embarrassment of bartering hardened terrorists for Hijacked Indian passengers More radio Silence*How are these two situations comparable to the present case? MMS is doing this on purpose, there is no intelligence failure like Kargil, nor are any Indian lives at stake like in the hijacking. And what the relevance of BJP is in this thread is beyond me. India withdraws opposition to a WTO Trade deal that will significantly help alleviate the sufferings of a significant portion of the Pakistani population ravaged by successive years of crippling floods in what is by and large a humanitarian move, than a Pro-Pakistani move - Jaswant Singh has no moral right to remain in office. :nice:India sent aid to pakistan during the floods - they rejected it. Why are you forgetting that this move hurts Indian industry. Being an economist MMS knows very well that this is the worst possible way to extend any aid. Bangladesh, Peru and even Italy are opposed to this EU concession simply because it hurts their industry. If EU wants to help pakistan - they should give it aid directly, not at the expense of India and other countries.
Ram Posted August 16, 2011 Posted August 16, 2011 How are these two situations comparable to the present case? MMS is doing this on purpose' date=' there is no intelligence failure like Kargil, nor are any Indian lives at stake like in the hijacking. [/quote'] OMG I thought your group was under strict orders to ignore me?! :omg: So lets get this straight; Pakistani army invades Indian territory by their 100s, if not 1000s - Govt. didntknow it was happening, so you cant blame them. Indian Prime Minister gives go-ahead for humantatian trade deal - OUTRAAAGGEE! He has no rights left to remain in office. Nice! :nice: This is a humanitarian move. This package was offered to Pakistan by EU as part of the relief package for the floods. Why do you have to see EVERYTING thru the viewing lens of India-Pakistan animosity. And btw, if you think this move hurts Indian Industry, here's another Prime Minister who did even more damage by giving Pakistan the Most Favored Nation status. Yes, your very own dear leader Atal Bihar Vajpayee! http://yaleglobal.yale.edu/content/will-vajpayees-gambit-pay Monetary packages donÃÕ work because most of the money goes into the pockets of corrupt officials. The only way to ensure the relief reaches the people is to make sure their business flourish and one of the ways to do that is to reduce trade barriers to their exports (which is what is happening here).
seedhi Posted August 16, 2011 Author Posted August 16, 2011 OMG I thought your group was under strict orders to ignore me?! :omg: So lets get this straight; Pakistani army invades Indian territory by their 100s, if not 1000s - Govt. didntknow it was happening, so you cant blame them. Of course you can blame them, it was a monumental intelligence failure which will forever be a black mark against the people in charge then. But what relevance does it have to this thread. This is like bringing up the 1962 disaster to support the BJP. Indian Prime Minister gives go-ahead for humantatian trade deal - OUTRAAAGGEE! He has no rights left to remain in office. Nice! :nice: This is a humanitarian move. This package was offered to Pakistan by EU as part of the relief package for the floods. Why do you have to see EVERYTING thru the viewing lens of India-Pakistan animosity. And btw, if you think this move hurts Indian Industry, here's another Prime Minister who did even more damage by giving Pakistan the Most Favored Nation status. Vajpayee did not grant pakistan the MFN status, that was done earlier, I think after India signed the WTO accords in the mid-90s. Pakistan has not reciprocated till date. Monetary packages donÃÕ work because most of the money goes into the pockets of corrupt officials. The only way to ensure the relief reaches the people is to make sure their business flourish and one of the ways to do that is to reduce trade barriers to their exports (which is what is happening here).Indian industry must have priority over the well being of pakistan, after all MMS is the Indian PM. I can understand someone from the EU advocating for pakistan, but for MMS to do this is immoral. And by the way, this move also hurts Bangladesh which is even poorer than pakistan, yet more deserving of our support than pakistan.
Ram Posted August 16, 2011 Posted August 16, 2011 Of course you can blame them, it was a monumental intelligence failure which will forever be a black mark against the people in charge then. But what relevance does it have to this thread. This is like bringing up the 1962 disaster to support the BJP. It has no relevance to this thread, except to highlight your selective morality. Where was all your outrage when an entire platoon of the Pakistani army was casually marching across the border? Vajpayee did not grant pakistan the MFN status, that was done earlier, I think after India signed the WTO accords in the mid-90s. Pakistan has not reciprocated till date. That's just not FACTUALLY CORRECT. Its not like the MFN was granted by India to Pakistan in the 90s and that has remained so since. It has been revoked many times subsequently, only to be given again, when the Indian govt. thought the time was right. Vajpayee was one of the Prime Minister who gave Pakistan the MFN status, in an attempt to the thaw relations. I am now waiting for you to say that Vajpayee also hurt India businesses, thanks. :nice: Indian industry must have priority over the well being of pakistan, after all MMS is the Indian PM. I can understand someone from the EU advocating for pakistan, but for MMS to do this is immoral. So was Vajpayee, but that didnt stop him from giving Pakistan the MFN status, did it? And by the way, this move also hurts Bangladesh which is even poorer than pakistan, yet more deserving of our support than pakistan. Why the sudden new found love for the Poor of the Bangladesh? :dontknow: FFS dude, this was a humanitarian package meant to help the flood affected people of Pakistan and you still dont want to waver? How bad do you think we would have looked in front of the international community, opposing this package? You think it will make us look good?
ganeshran Posted August 16, 2011 Posted August 16, 2011 I dont consider it treachery or anything, but what is the need to withdraw this opposition now. Pakistan has a history of pretty much protesting any development assistance sought by India - including water projects in Kashmir.. And there has been no action against the Mumbai accused as well. Pakistan has time again remained stubborn, why should we adjust as a goodwill measure?
Ram Posted August 16, 2011 Posted August 16, 2011 I dont consider it treachery or anything, but what is the need to withdraw this opposition now. Pakistan has a history of pretty much protesting any development assistance sought by India - including water projects in Kashmir.. And there has been no action against the Mumbai accused as well. Pakistan has time again remained stubborn, why should we adjust as a goodwill measure? If we begin to act like them, even stoop lower, then what is the difference between them and us? You're suggesting that we let the decades long animosity between our two nations come in the way of humanitarian relief that the flood affected people of Pakistan so desperately needs? If we are going to win this war against hatred and terror, we have to persevere and be the better people, not by acting petty and silly.
ravishingravi Posted August 16, 2011 Posted August 16, 2011 If we begin to act like them, even stoop lower, then what is the difference between them and us? YouÃÓe suggesting that we let the decades long animosity between our two nations come in the way of humanitarian relief that the flood affected people of Pakistan so desperately needs? If weÃÓe going to win this war against hatred and terror, we have to persevere and be the better people, not by acting petty and silly. I actually disgaree with your line of argument on the thread, but agree with this one instance. I was bitterly disappointed at the manner in which the govt., media and people in general reacted or rather failed to react at the destruction during floods in Pakistan. It was an unprecedented disaster. And if in that instance we would have reacted with our hearts and been generous when they were desperate we would have won over a lot of hearts. It was a lost opportunity both politically and humanely.
ganeshran Posted August 16, 2011 Posted August 16, 2011 If we begin to act like them, even stoop lower, then what is the difference between them and us? YouÃÓe suggesting that we let the decades long animosity between our two nations come in the way of humanitarian relief that the flood affected people of Pakistan so desperately needs? If weÃÓe going to win this war against hatred and terror, we have to persevere and be the better people, not by acting petty and silly. Ram, as long as there is reciprocation, I am all for peace and mutual help. However that is not the case.. We gave Pakistan MFN status 9 years back, and still waiting for the reciprocal signal. Our aid during the 2005 earthquake was left rotting at the border. Our aid during the recent floods wasnt accepted directly and asked to be routed through the UN. When a nation makes it amply clear that it does not want our help, why should we offer help everytime knowing pretty well that it is not going to improve the relationship?
seedhi Posted August 16, 2011 Author Posted August 16, 2011 It has no relevance to this thread' date=' except to highlight your selective morality. Where was all your outrage when an entire platoon of the Pakistani army was casually marching across the border? [/quote']This was in 1999, was this forum in existence? At least I was not posting here, so how can you say I was not outraged? You need to back up your statement with some links. AFAIK Vajpayee never withdrew the MFN status to pakistan, and nor did he reinstate it. Well, India did oppose this concession for a year. And now, a year later a reversal makes no sense. Not to mention it hurts our own industries.
Ram Posted August 16, 2011 Posted August 16, 2011 Ram, as long as there is reciprocation, I am all for peace and mutual help. However that is not the case.. We gave Pakistan MFN status 9 years back, and still waiting for the reciprocal signal. Our aid during the 2005 earthquake was left rotting at the border. Our aid during the recent floods wasnt accepted directly and asked to be routed through the UN. When a nation makes it amply clear that it does not want our help, why should we offer help everytime knowing pretty well that it is not going to improve the relationship? Their actions and attitude towards us should not dictate our approach to humanitarian situations. Just because they are petty, silly and confrontational, does not mean we go one-up and do even worse. Look what they have reaped after years of failied policies that built up hatred, mis-trust and animosity. If we go down the same path, we will soon end up looking like them. To be honest, I couldnÃÕ care less about Pakistan as a country (I feel for its people yes, but as a entity, I have little or no concern for the Pakistani state). I am more worried as to what attitude/approach our govt. takes. And I donÃÕ want us to go down the same road that they went.
Clarke Posted August 16, 2011 Posted August 16, 2011 Ram, we were never like them and shall not be in so any time in the future. The fact that we did not march into Lahore/Karachi despite their repeated intrusions into our territory (65, 71, 99) should be a testament of our restraint. No other major power has shown such calm, but all of this is besides the topic. Why should our textile industry (which includes the cotton farmers, the lot that has suffered a lot due to various reasons) compete against an unfair concession ? If the Europeans feel they should help our neighbors, they can do it the American way by means of currency as well as material aid. We shortlisted the expensive european entries in one of the biggest defense deals of all time and have hardly asked for trade incentives ourselves.
ganeshran Posted August 16, 2011 Posted August 16, 2011 I agree with Clarke. Even if we set aside the grossly disproportionate gestures by India to Pakistan for a moment, not opposing this motion puts our exporters at a disadvantage. And the people who suffer would be like the workers at Tirupur, an industry which is already not doing well. Pakistan's masses have nothing to do with the conflict, they are innocent of any wrong doing and deserving of a good life. However, their state has and always will work against us, even if it means doing themselves more harm in the long run
Sarkar Posted August 17, 2011 Posted August 17, 2011 MMS the worst prime minister India ever had wasnt this guy sending boxes of mangoes when Pakistan was breaking rules of LOC i hate these muppets.
Ram Posted August 17, 2011 Posted August 17, 2011 This was in 1999' date=' was this forum in existence? At least I was not posting here, so how can you say I was not outraged? [/quote'] Oh so you were outraged then? Excellent. So I am guessing it shouldn’t take too much cajoling for you to say this; Come on, lets hear you say that. I cant be surfing the internet trying to extricate links that satisfy you. The fact of the matter is, the same trade measures that you know condemn the Congress govt, erstwhile BJP govt. have done the exact same things, if not more. Better late than never to act humanitarian, I’d say? :winky:
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