Prakat Posted February 24, 2012 Posted February 24, 2012 lol at 'honorary Aryan' status. The Dhyan Chand story is however made up, as none of the contemporary sources reported it and DC doesn't mention it in his autobiography either. What is true is that the Indian contingent, refused to salute Hitler, the only country to put up such an act of open defiance and make a political statement on this stage. Even the British athletes didn't go that far.
mishra Posted February 24, 2012 Posted February 24, 2012 You are confusing your ignorance on the subject with certainty. Ever heard of Jesse Owens? I suggest you read up about him. Yes definitely.... What is wrong with that. Owens said, "Hitler didn't snub me – it was FDR who snubbed me. The president didn't even send me a telegram."On the other hand, Hitler sent Owens a commemorative inscribed cabinet photograph of himself. :haha: Living space Lebensraum. Now That was core ideology of Germans. Hitler was attempting to secure that. Now you will find a lot of articles explaining in detail what it meant.
hari504504 Posted February 24, 2012 Author Posted February 24, 2012 lol at 'honorary Aryan' status. The Dhyan Chand story is however made up, as none of the contemporary sources reported it and DC doesn't mention it in his autobiography either. What is true is that the Indian contingent, refused to salute Hitler, the only country to put up such an act of open defiance and make a political statement on this stage. Even the British athletes didn't go that far. :hmmm: Interesting, all the sources I found are secondary ones as you are saying. Maybe, it could also be that the reason why Dhyan Chand didn't mention it at all in his book could be for the very same reason why the contingent refused to salute the man - he didn't really hold Hitler in a high regard and thus the offer wasn't all that much to him. If Hitler was so racially prejudiced and did see us an inferior animals..he had no reason to host Netaji Bose in Germany. He probably did see value in us as is the case with him and the japs and the Italians, there was no way they could secure the subcontinent on their own, if it came to that.
Prakat Posted February 24, 2012 Posted February 24, 2012 @mishra What do you think Hitler's gift means? Do you suppose it is some big symbolic clue about Hitler's growth as a lover of all humans? This is what he thought after Owen's victories, " People whose antecedents came from the jungle were primitive, Hitler said with a shrug; their physiques were stronger than those of civilized whites and hence should be excluded from future games." Owen's quote about FDR reflected about the politics of the time when the country was still far from the Civil Rights movement which was still a decade away. He was right to say that, because he had no bone to pick with Hitler, however, he was duty-bound do something about the situation at home.
Prakat Posted February 24, 2012 Posted February 24, 2012 :hmmm: Interesting, all the sources I found are secondary ones as you are saying. Maybe, it could also be that the reason why Dhyan Chand didn't mention it at all in his book could be for the very same reason why the contingent refused to salute the man - he didn't really hold Hitler in a high regard and thus the offer wasn't all that much to him. If Hitler was so racially prejudiced and did see us an inferior animals..he had no reason to host Netaji Bose in Germany. He probably did see value in us as is the case with him and the japs and the Italians, there was no way they could secure the subcontinent on their own, if it came to that. Yes, Hitler's alignments with other leaders were driven by political convenience. He couldn't afford to be blinded by his racial bigotry if he dreamed of growth. Hardly likely that DC skipped the tale for that reason. The refusal to salute was because of orders from above and was carried out by the entire contingent and not by DC alone. Also, by the time he wrote his story, Hitler was long gone so there wouldn't be any compulsion to cover it up either. Nor are there any reports of that time to corroborate that story.
mishra Posted February 24, 2012 Posted February 24, 2012 @ PK How can he decide which country should put forward which athelete? Common sense says India will send Indian isnt it? So what makes you think he would have been that naive to make the remark unless it was a joke. But one thing is certain. He didnt send memorabilia from his grave. You are ready to conveniently ignore what Ownes felt about him but put forward some comment from some source as absolute truth and then postulate on it that he would have enslaved all of the humanity I remember someone postulating a theory on national TV that Hitler has only one ball. That brought inferiority complex in him when in bed. Also that one ball somehow wasnt able to generate som sort of hormone which effected his brain. Combined together depression and inferirity complex and lack of that hormonelead him to become mentally challenged.... Living space or Lebensraum was core to his foreign policy. A lot of article will somehow induce racism in it. But to me that term it itself never sounded like supremacist, kill all and so on. As i said. Hitler has problems which were local. If given a choice neither Africans nor Asians whould have tried Begani Shadi mein Abdulla Diwana
Prakat Posted February 24, 2012 Posted February 24, 2012 @ PK How can he decide which country should put forward which athelete? Common sense says India will send Indian isnt it? So what makes you think he would have been that naive to make the remark unless it was a joke. But one thing is certain. He didnt send memorabilia from his grave. You are ready to conveniently ignore what Ownes felt about him but put forward some comment from some source as absolute truth and then postulate on it that he would have enslaved all of the humanity I remember someone postulating a theory on national TV that Hitler has only one ball. That brought inferiority complex in him when in bed. Also that one ball somehow wasnt able to generate som sort of hormone which effected his brain. Combined together depression and inferirity complex and lack of that hormonelead him to become mentally challenged.... Living space or Lebensraum was core to his foreign policy. A lot of article will somehow induce racism in it. But to me that term it itself never sounded like supremacist, kill all and so on. As i said. Hitler has problems which were local. If given a choice neither Africans nor Asians whould have tried Begani Shadi mein Abdulla Diwana You have lost me. I have no clue what you are talking about anymore. Good luck.
Lurker Posted February 24, 2012 Posted February 24, 2012 Agree 100% Germany probably had a greater net effect on us gaining independence than the whole ridiculous non-violence movement. Thanks for proving Albert Einstein's point on Gandhi. :hatsoff::hatsoff:
mishra Posted February 24, 2012 Posted February 24, 2012 You have lost me. I have no clue what you are talking about anymore. Good luck. I know, ur Owen theory backfired.:haha: Despite all the prejudiced literature around, you have not provided a single evidence to the claim that Hitler attacked Poland with a agenda to exterminate Jews or global aspirations of Hitler (specially in Asia, Africa,America).
mishra Posted February 24, 2012 Posted February 24, 2012 Thanks for proving Albert Einstein's point on Gandhi. :hatsoff::hatsoff: Whats up? ---Albert Einstein
Prakat Posted February 24, 2012 Posted February 24, 2012 I know' date=' ur Owen theory backfired.:haha: Despite all the prejudiced literature around, you have not provided a single evidence to the claim that Hitler attacked Poland with a agenda to exterminate Jews or global aspirations of Hitler (specially in Asia, Africa,America).[/quote'] You are terming the vast information at hand about Hitler's racist views as 'Prejudiced Literature'???? Most of the things I quoted to prove your points baseless were from Mein Kampf. Have you forgotten that already? And since when did our discussion reach a point where the onus was on me to prove that a. Hitler attacked Poland with a agenda to exterminate Jews and b. global aspirations of Hitler? What would be the point of that? What are you going on about? You are snowballing this discussion pointlessly. go back our chat to see what this has been about instead of jumping from random plot point to another.
mishra Posted February 24, 2012 Posted February 24, 2012 Chal bhai, office band ho gaya. Have a good weekend. Monday phir se :banghead: Sent from my HTC Desire S using Tapatalk
achilles Posted February 25, 2012 Posted February 25, 2012 Its pretty easy to do that by just killing off all the weaker/poorer sections and having absolute power. India would be rich too if you send millions of people to camps at no wages' date=' prevent poor from reproducing, have everything for the benifit of the rich and powerful and enforce your laws by force on everyone. Some genius[/quote'] You guys are focussing only on the bad that he did, like everyone does. Yes, he killed Jews and did some crazy stuff. But does that take away from the fact that- He was arguably the greatest modern warfare strategist He couldn't be beated straight up, infiltration and spying caused his defeat, not direct war His people loved him for the work he did The British & Americans learnt a lot from this incarnation of "EVIL"
achilles Posted February 25, 2012 Posted February 25, 2012 As for dictatorships going awry, lets talk about Bahrain.
surajmal Posted February 25, 2012 Posted February 25, 2012 From the viewpoint of Indians, WW2 was war among two racist factions. So Hitler's rise and fall forced the European nations (especially the colonial powers) to look inwards and consider their own evil deeds.
achilles Posted February 25, 2012 Posted February 25, 2012 At best, Hitler "tormented" people, for a few years. The British tormented Asia for over 200 years. Ofcourse, it is not allowed to point this out as it isn't the popular thing to say.
anotherhawkeye Posted February 25, 2012 Posted February 25, 2012 From the viewpoint of Indians' date=' WW2 was war among two racist factions. So Hitler's rise and fall forced the European nations (especially the colonial powers) to look inwards and consider their own evil deeds.[/quote'] Hear Hear! From India's standpoint, ww2 was god send. It was terrible and I am not endorsing it by any means, but it definitely helped India get her independence. Such is the sorry state of the country that we needed a calamity of monumental proportions to gain our independence after 700 ****ing years.
anotherhawkeye Posted February 25, 2012 Posted February 25, 2012 At best, Hitler "tormented" people, for a few years. The British tormented Asia for over 200 years. Ofcourse, it is not allowed to point this out as it isn't the popular thing to say. What some of these 'Indians' don't get is that a hatred against a crimnal is proportional to how it affects you at a personal level. One would feel extremely angry against a drunken driver who killed their kin in an accident than against a serial killer in another country. They are both bad, but who do you hate the most? Britain is no angel and is no better than Hitler in my eyes.
achilles Posted February 25, 2012 Posted February 25, 2012 What some of these 'Indians' don't get is that a hatred against a crimnal is proportional to how it affects you at a personal level. One would feel extremely angry against a drunken driver who killed their kin in an accident than against a serial killer in another country. They are both bad, but who do you hate the most? Britain is no angel and is no better than Hitler in my eyes. See, I don't care how Angel-like A country/person was or is, and how devil-like another country/person was or is. All I want is people to be a bit more acceptant that an Angel can have a Devilish streak and a Devil may have an Angel lurking around in him.
surajmal Posted February 25, 2012 Posted February 25, 2012 try saying this to a westerner (of canadian/US/UK origin): "There was no difference between Imperial England and Hitler". There reaction is sigworthy. Funny thing is British policies resulted in deaths a magnitude greater (in India alone) than Hitler's actions. But you will never find that fact in history books.
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